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Mister T
Joined: 28 May 2007
Posts: 2
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 Posted: Wed May 30, 2007 5:33 am Post subject: TESOL ethics and morals |
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I have some questions about ethics and morals. I would be interested in your opions.
What are the ethical and moral issues facing TESOL instructors in China?
Are ethical and moral issues an important consideration within the TESOL environment?
Does the issue of TESOL ethics and morals impact upon the students?
Do teachers within an unsupervised TESOL environment of have an ethical and duty to protect the well being of students by unofficially supervising their colleagues?
Looking forward to your comments. |
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Ahchoo
Joined: 22 Mar 2007
Posts: 606
Location: Earth
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| Posted: Wed May 30, 2007 7:08 am Post subject: |
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| Do teachers within an unsupervised TESOL environment of have an ethical and duty to protect the well being of students by unofficially supervising their colleagues? |
No.
The dilema facing english teachers (or any foreigner for that matter) in China is reconcilling their morals with the lack thereof in their Chinese superiors (as in bosses.) |
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vikuk
Joined: 23 May 2007
Posts: 1842
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| Posted: Wed May 30, 2007 9:41 am Post subject: |
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| Do teachers within an unsupervised TESOL environment of have an ethical and duty to protect the well being of students by unofficially supervising their colleagues? |
well why not read this thread - on corporal discipline -
http://forums.eslcafe.com/job/viewtopic.php?t=43769&highlight=corporal+discipline+kindergarten
Note how many posters are willing to lay into the kids and consider it an effective way of managing the classroom - note how one poster argues that it's okay to be pro-hitting children in posts, since he has the right of free speech - I wonder if his ethic and moral logic concerning free speech goes as far as allowing us to talk about and advertise other serious law breaking acts that may go in the classroom!!!!!! Morals and ethics - most FT's think that's something to do with having the right visa - about protecting childhood, promoting healthy development and teaching the truth - well, I gotta feelin' most aint thought about that  |
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tofuman
Joined: 02 Jul 2004
Posts: 937
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| Posted: Wed May 30, 2007 12:59 pm Post subject: |
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"Unofficially supervising your colleagues." More information is needed here. Is one of your colleagues boffing underage students? Careful, the person to whom you report him might be doing the same thing. Or another one of your Chinese colleagues might have a taste for fresh meat. Perhaps an old timer, a CCP member, who is on exceptionally good terms with the headmaster.
Interesting, but tricky, situation. Careful.... |
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HunanForeignGuy
Joined: 05 Jan 2006
Posts: 989
Location: Shanghai, PRC
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| Posted: Wed May 30, 2007 1:46 pm Post subject: |
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| tofuman wrote: |
"Unofficially supervising your colleagues." More information is needed here. Is one of your colleagues boffing underage students? Careful, the person to whom you report him might be doing the same thing. Or another one of your Chinese colleagues might have a taste for fresh meat. Perhaps an old timer, a CCP member, who is on exceptionally good terms with the headmaster.
Interesting, but tricky, situation. Careful.... |
While Tofuman's advice may appear irreverent, I can attest to its accuracy. It is the advice of an experienced China FT. Whistleblowing doesn't usually go very far in China and more often than not, it backfires. Mind your own business and if you can't accept the situation, then go find another job. That may sound calloused but it is the reality of the situation here. |
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vikuk
Joined: 23 May 2007
Posts: 1842
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| Posted: Wed May 30, 2007 1:50 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: |
"Unofficially supervising your colleagues." More information is needed here. Is one of your colleagues boffing underage students? Careful, the person to whom you report him might be doing the same thing. Or another one of your Chinese colleagues might have a taste for fresh meat. Perhaps an old timer, a CCP member, who is on exceptionally good terms with the headmaster.
Interesting, but tricky, situation. Careful.... |
Maybe leading a good moral life - is being able to live with yourself - which could be linked to being able to do the right thing, during times of very serious a wrong doing - especially with respect to reporting the forcing children to have to undergo outrageous acts to satisfy the needs of criminals- and being able to do that right thing regardless of who these criminals are and of what personal cost it takes!!!!
But then again some posters could warn us to be careful - since in their moral world self-protection must reign supreme 
In this argument of ethics - how much would turning the blind-eye cost you as a person - how moral would you feel knowing number one was doing okay - but somebody else - maybe a child was suffering 
And remember the last couple of posts were not talking about your run-of-the-mill type suffering - they hinted at keeping stum on something far more serious!!!! |
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Steppenwolf
Joined: 30 Jul 2006
Posts: 1769
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| Posted: Wed May 30, 2007 4:02 pm Post subject: |
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"Mister T" also started a mysteriously tytled thread "Dysfunctional TEFL teachers?" and someone pointed out that he is trolling...
Which he, obviously has done successfully, judging by the harvest of replies to this
thread... |
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vikuk
Joined: 23 May 2007
Posts: 1842
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| Posted: Wed May 30, 2007 5:03 pm Post subject: |
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Why should bringing up a subject that matters be called trolling - who cares where the subject matter comes from, or who brings it up - if its pertinent to our profession then lets discuss it. If The OP seriously wants to discuss this matter then he's free to write more in other posts from which we can better judge his intentions - but as you can see the discussion has started to grow from that initial post - or does that make us other posters also guilty of "trolling"!!!
By the way is anyone avoiding writing a meaningful post in this thread, because they're scared of being called a troll?????
Out of interest Steppenwolf - what would your advice be to an FT who caught a colleague having sex with an underage student - after all you are pretty hot on the tail of those illegal visa people - and since the underage thing must rate as a much more serious crime, you've surely got some words of wisdom on this one |
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7969
Joined: 26 Mar 2003
Posts: 5782
Location: Coastal Guangdong
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| Posted: Wed May 30, 2007 5:29 pm Post subject: |
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| vikuk wrote: |
Why should bringing up a subject that matters be called trolling - who cares where the subject matter comes from, or who brings it up - if its pertinent to our profession then lets discuss it. If The OP seriously wants to discuss this matter then he's free to write more in other posts from which we can better judge his intentions - but as you can see the discussion has started to grow from that initial post - or does that make us other posters also guilty of "trolling"!!!
By the way is anyone avoiding writing a meaningful post in this thread, because they're scared of being called a troll?????
Out of interest Steppenwolf - what would your advice be to an FT who caught a colleague having sex with an underage student - after all you are pretty hot on the tail of those illegal visa people - and since the underage thing must rate as a much more serious crime, you've surely got some words of wisdom on this one |
wouldnt that be a matter for the chinese security forces, and subsequently, the judiciary? |
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lostinasia
Joined: 11 Apr 2007
Posts: 466
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| Posted: Wed May 30, 2007 5:36 pm Post subject: |
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Underage of course being under the age of 14. Let's be specific regarding age of consent.
Professional ethics is quite different from personal morals and ethics.
Do your job professionally and ignore the morons who believe that your personal life has anything to do with your professional ethics and responsibilities. Yes, they can cross into one another but that is a different issue.
Such high-horses in the world at times |
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vikuk
Joined: 23 May 2007
Posts: 1842
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| Posted: Wed May 30, 2007 6:20 pm Post subject: |
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| wouldnt that be a matter for the chinese security forces, and subsequently, the judiciary? |
Of course - but then how are they going to find out if those of us who know stay stum - for the sakes of our careers!!!!
| Quote: |
Professional ethics is quite different from personal morals and ethics.
Do your job professionally and ignore the morons who believe that your personal life has anything to do with your professional ethics and responsibilities. Yes, they can cross into one another but that is a different issue. |
The profession of a teacher often means that you're put in a situation of serious responsibility - that of caring for the well being of children while they are in your professional company - company that should be deemed serious since a teacher is usually a person of influence. If you believe that its OK to use this position to seek sexual favour from these young students - and then believe that this is a personal matter since those "favors" take place after school hours - then I think you seriously need to think over if you are suitable candidate to be an FT - after all would you want a teacher who thinks this way to be near your kids????
Think of it this way - ethics and morals represent societies norms - and regardless of our own personal differences - how many of you readers come from a society that regards an adult having sex with an underage partner to be a norm - then think about that adult being a teacher - even less normal - and that underage partner being the teachers student - even more abnormal in my book - an abnormality that has come about because ones profession - and in any normal society one which would be regarded as a breach of professional ethics (having a criminal relationship with a pupil). Or am I talking from a high horse - and everyone else here thinks that this an acceptable norm, especially if it takes part - in a so-called private world - outside the school gates
And why should we inform on this law breaking - well whatever way your professional ethics hang - I hope a few of us out there would stick up for a group that need protecting, the young - and make sure if some of our fellow FT's decided that, in China, they could easily exploit their younger pupils in a sexual manner - that they would have someone to answer to. After all if we as teachers can't make that call and then decide to turn a blind eye - who will????? |
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