Job Discussion Forums

[Horizontal Hero]

I'm in the process of negotiating a tenure-track position at a top uni in Taiwan (I'm now in Hong Kong). What I'd like to know is, what are typical salary and conditions for tenure-track positions here? I've got a PhD, and more than a decade of education experience. However that experience is mostly with secondary schools and uni foundation ESL programs.

I found this: http://www.michaelturton.com/Taiwan/college_benefits.html
But I am wondering if it applies to tenure-track positions in social sciences.

The reason I'm asking of course is that I don't want to undersell myself - or oversell for that matter. Would it be unreasonable to ask for housing, medical coverage, air fare etc.? What about teaching hours per week? A month of holidays? This is not an ESL job, but in social science. Any help would be greatly appreciated.

[Solar Strength]

Tenure doesn't exist in Taiwan.

Michael Turton wrote:

[MomCat]

HH, I believe you'll find Michael's information hasn't been updated for a while. There also used to be a second paragraph that contradicted the first one regarding consistency of salaries.

All my information is second hand but the figures I've heard for a PhD teaching at a uni have been higher than the $72,000 he implies is top.

[Horizontal Hero]

Thanks for the replies. I too had heard that there was no such thing as "tenure-track" in Taiwan. But the Dean of the department used that precise phrase in his email to me. Maybe he just meant "we'll promote you if we like you".

I worked in Taiwan a few years ago, and a masters degree holder told me he was making 90 000, but that was with overtime I believe. Anyway, the pay is pretty lousy, but I'm not wanting to do it for the money. I can earn nearly three times as much as that in my current secondary position in Hong Kong. But I want out of secondary teaching, because there is no future in it for me as far as career advancement. But my wife will kill me for the loss of money - she's Chinese. That's if I actually land the job, which is no guarantee at the moment.

[Solar Strength]

I was told that holding a Ph.D does not decide what your monthly salary will be. Rather, it is the academic rank you hold that determines how much your salary is. For instance, one could hold only a Master's degree but hold the rank of Associate Professor.

Ph.D holders normally enter with the rank of Assistant Professor.

The following monthly salaries and hours per-week of teaching are similar all over Taiwan but they may vary from school to school. Also, salaries may vary between national and private universities.


Professor:
$85,000 per-month
8 hours per-week.

Associatate Professor:
$75,000 per-month
9 hours per-week.

Assistant Professor:
$65,000 per-month
10 hours per-week.

Lecturer:
$55,000 per-month
10 hours per-week

[Taylor]

Dear Readers,

Just wanted to verify that the post by Solar Strength regarding salaries is accurate and up-to-date, as far as I know.

Most professors that I know need to teach 14-18 hours per week, though. I think overtime pay is based on the 'minimum wage' of 575 NT/hour....

Best wishes,

Taylor
Kaohsiung 9+ years

[forest1979]

The hours given for a professorial position are basically correct as is most information at Michael Turton's site (not withstanding minor wage level changes). However some Assistant Prof's contract maybe for 9 contract hours per week although if this is the case then I am sure overtime is possible to boost the salary level (about US$2000 per month). I would however in light of your posting be very careful of any promises of research money and promotion. Research grants, conference funding, etc. are usually not available from within the university but have to be applied for in open competition circumstances from the National Science Council (NSC), and promotions at private unis (if that's who you have applied to) have to go to the MoE. National unis from what I have been told can do their own internal promotion reviews but it is the norm at places like National Taiwan University, considered the island's best higher education institution, to work for 4 years as an Assistant Prof before any application for promotion can be considered.

From my own experience of working in Taiwan unis I would be very careful of what people inform you of administrative regulations. The general ignorance amongst administrators is often appalling. You'll find more professionalism in Hong Kong. Don't be fooled by thinking people in high positions like Deans or Heads of Department know anymore than the secretaries (as little as they know!).

Final note too, bear in mind exchange rates. A Profs salary wasn't so bad a few years ago but now the Taiwan $ is being eaten by other currencies the value of a Taiwanese wage is a lot less than before. If you're coming from Hong Kong then you'll notice a major drop in your salary level and if your wife grasps this quickly then you'll have your ears bent a hell of a lot. On the one plus side though you can work a maximum of 4 or 5 hours above your contract at the institution where you work and also undertake another 4 hours as a part-time Prof at another higher ed place. But look at the facts - if you have a PhD and are teaching for 18-19 hours a week for 18 week-long semesters how many papers will you crank out? I'll tell you now, not more than 1 and that will be for the compulsory annual department conference.

As for being told tenure track, it doesn't exist. Yes, you can be considered full-time staff but so are most people as Taiwanese rules make it difficult to get rid of bad teachers after a small number of years of employment at any one place. As for housing benefits, flights and the like, just forget it.

[elliot_spencer]

Are there many university job in Taiwan?

I hear they don;t accept distance learning MA's is that correct? Is there a place in TW where you can do an MA in TESOL?

Do you need to have written any publications?

Thanks

[Horizontal Hero]

[forest1979]

[forest1979]

But I'm not sure I'll actually accept the position if they actually offer it to me. We've been "negotiating" for over a year, while my PhD came through and the damn document was approved by the Taiwan "consulate" in Brisbane. I just got it back today, so sending off the "proof" to the uni tomorrow. (Tamkang Uni, Taipei)



Sorry, don't wish to be rude but Taiwanese university position recruitment admin is pretty straightforward. I fail to see how you can negotiate for a year about whether to go to Tamkang Uni in Damshui or not. If you have notorized degree certificates its an easy procedure. Also if you have a dozen publications in decent ranking journals then they'd snap your hand off even if the paperwork for the PhD is not there (but coming through). Even if you've published in their journals (e.g. Future Studies, etc.) then that shouldn't be a problem. Any package they offer is more or less tied to the MoE regulations, that's why I can't understand what you have to negotiate about. Whether you teach English or something else, the rules at the MoE are all the same.

[Horizontal Hero]

Well maybe you need to think a little more along the lines that not every Dean of every Department thinks the same. I submitted my thesis a year ago, and the system in Australia can be very drawn out. It took nearly a year for the examiners to get the reports in, and for uni admin to do all the paperwork. The Dean at Tamkang said he could not hire me on my honours degree alone. They wanted the PhD confirmed, AND THEN AUTHENTICATED by the Taiwan "Consulate" near my university on Oz - before then they definitely could not sign me as full-time staff (but suggested part-time work, which I declined). My main PhD supervisor works at Tamkang as a visiting professor AND at my uni in Oz where I'm enrolled, but still they wanted authentication. When I complained to my supervisor about this drawn out process, he said it was perfectly understandable given the spate of fake degrees going round at present. The authentication from the consulate came through two days ago. Now I have to mail it to the Dean.

Or did you want them to pay me as a professor on an honours degree and publications? Regardless of the fact that I have nearly 20 publications (including an academic book and quite a few book chapters, the latter all published through books at Tamkang Uni Press) the PhD was what the Dean wanted. Simple.

Perhaps "corresponding" would be a better description than "negotiating". I was invited for an interview at one point (I turned it down - no time) and sent hard copies of my dissertation to the Dean.

I have just received an email from the Dean today with a possible salary figure, and he said he'd get back to me soon about what classes I could teach, and mentioned the starting date. Previously my supervisior said, "Dean..... is very serious about hiring you", so although I am certainly not counting my chickens, it seems there is a damn good chance I will be offered something.

[forest1979]

Sorry if you took my last post personally. I could only respond to the information you had sent and obviously made an assumption that maybe you had an MA. Quite obviously the year of authentification shows the longevity of bureacractic processes in Taiwan with Australian unis. I know from experience with US, Canadian and UK degree certificates once notorization has been done the system works very quickly. But I understand why it can take so long. Uni admin committees only sometimes meet twice a year to issue PhD certificates - sadly it appears you maybe fell foul of that situation. Bottom line anyway, with just an honours degree there's buckleys of getting any academic job. I'm sure there's a MoE rule saying the minimum requirement is a MA. As for what Professor level that will depend on if you have SSCI publications - books and book chapters have less value than SSCI papers - and your teaching experience within a higher ed system recognised by the MoE. Nonetheless If you have 20 publications, an authenticated PhD and a book then there's little wonder why the Dean has expressed an interest in you. In relation to most academics in Taiwan you will be head and shoulders above the norm. I would put a firm bet on it that you will get an offer once all paperwork is done and dusted. If that occurs, well done!

[Horizontal Hero]

Nothing personal, just emphasing the point - although in past posts on the Taiwan forum I have encountered a few nasty types!

There's no problem on the Taiwan side of the equation with Australian Unis. It tool only 2-3 weeks to send off my PhD to Brisbane, get it authenticated and returned. The problem is the examination system with PhDs in Australia - in my case three examiners read the dissertation - and one took eight months to get the report back. THEN the uni admin got into gear - it had to go through two meetings. Actually I eventualy wrote a letter of complaint to the VC, and he responded personally, and they finally got off their bums and did the paperwork.

As far as I know all the journals I've written for are accredited journals - all peer reviewed - and the Tamkang Journal of Futures Studies is the one I've published most in. I published a lot of my PhD as journal papers, and wrote other stuff along the way. It actually helped a lot with the PhD, as the critical feedback was invaluable - so I'd recommend it to others (as long as you can get published without TOO much re-writing). But I looked at the re-writing as editing for the PhD too, so didn't mind - some articles I completely re-wrote and resubmitted.

[Serious_Fun]