Job Discussion Forums

[slodziak]

This post has been inspired by a discussion currently taking place here:

http://forums.eslcafe.com/job/viewtopic.php?t=54681&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0

It seems that the use or, more specifically, non-use of the search function can cause some people great anger and frustration not only on Dave�s ESL cafe but also on websites all over Internet. It can lead to some people (usually those who have been using the discussion board for longer) to recommend, sometimes quite tersely, that the guilty party should not waste the time of others by foregoing the search option before posting.

While I usually do perform a search of a topic before making a post the frustration shown by some does seem quite curious to me. I don�t get what it is that makes some people anger and write in abrupt terms that the poster should have used the search function rather than repeat a post that has been covered before. This is how I see it:

� If the issue in the post has been made before surely it would be better to put a link to the previous discussion thereby helping the poster get the information they want.
� If replying with a link seems too much effort then what is the point in just bluntly telling someone to �use the search function�? It seems to me that the only motive can be to vent some spleen or to begin an argument � neither of which is helpful to the poster.
� Why are repeat posts actually so bad? I mean is there something I am missing? Do they take up space on the web that can slow things down? Do they cost the host money? Or do they purely annoy people who are tired of seeing the same old questions � if it is this then wouldn�t it be better to ignore the post rather than get someone�s back up by telling them to �use the search function�.

I am not trying to attack any individual user I just want to be enlightened. Maybe I too should be getting upset by repeat topics but am too naive to see why.

[Hoser]

Did you use the search function before you made this thread? Oops, sorry Canuck! I stole your thunder!

[Glenski]

[mfaulkner]

Not really an answer, but related: forum search functions tend toward the buggy. Many times (here) I have typed my search query and parameters, hit return, and then a blank page pops up. In other forums, I'll search for a three word topic, in quotation marks, and threads that only contain one of the words pops up.

[JimDunlop2]

Part of the answer to your post is also steeped in a bit of Internet history.

Some of us old-timers have been roaming around since the net was nothing more than a few thousand websites, accessible only via a UNIX-driven, text-based web browser... Since those early days the immediate predecessor to forums like Dave's has been the newsgroups (which still exist quite healthily today). It was always an adventure sifting through the usenet lists. (Anyone remember alt.sex.bestiality.sheep.baa.baa.baa.baa.moo ???) Yeah.. Well, for the record, I did NOT subscribe.

It has always been considered good netiquette (since those days) to NOT start posting the moment you subscribed to a newsgroup. LURK (A LOT) before your first post! That was almost a mantra! The reasons for that should be obvious. But clearly, as indicated by your post today, it is not.

First off, newbies, as soon as they gain access to a resource tend to be really really excited by their new find or "toy." And like any kid with a new toy, they are really, really enthusiastic but lose sight of and respect for the existing members of the group. They are literally like little children, running around, asking a zillion questions (many of them inane) and generally making pests of themselves.

Second of all, it has been famously quoted that those who cannot learn from history are doomed to repeat it. That holds true on discussion forums as well. Each forum has its own personality. There are unique "hot buttons" that will trigger flamewars, for example. If you want to start one on Dave's, just go ahead and start a thread asking whether "gaijin" is a derogatory term or not. The easiest way to avoid this? Lurk & Search.

Third, since the days of newsgroups, getting to know a forum's "personality" by lurking for a while first would help newbies fit in better when they did start posting. Again. That's where searching comes in handy. Lurking's no fun when you are sifting through pages and pages of boring junk... But it can be much more fun if you use the search function to try and get the answers to questions that interest you and are relevant to your situation. Searching is just another form of lurking.

People who yell at newbies for not using the search function aren't doing it just to be mean or because they've been around too long and become ornery (although that may be the case for some...) They do it because they want to teach people to think independently and how to solve a problem for themselves. Not only is it for more rewarding, but the solution tends to get remembered far more.

When I fixed my first small engine, I had no manual, no professional mechanic to help me and no access to an Internet forum telling me how to do it. If I had logged onto Dave's Engine Mechanic Cafe, posting a question: How do I overhaul a 50 cc. Honda 2-str. engine? And someone just came over and did it for me, I would have been thrilled but wouldn't have learned a thing. Whereas now, having done it myself I can do it again any time I need to.

As with answering questions on Dave's -- leading someone to the answer by getting them to search for it probably helps them more than just handing it to them on a silver platter. Not to mention the fact that if a topic HAS been discussed ad infinitum it saves the veterans a lot of ire and frustration.

Let me just conclude with a cross-post to a thread almost exactly like yours here. http://forums.eslcafe.com/job/viewtopic.php?t=42527

[slodziak]

A great answer JimDunlop2; funny and enlightening but I think I see the problem: