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Kurochan · Joined: 01 Mar 2003 Posts: 944 Location: China

OK, maybe this is a dumb question, but I was taught that there's no rule you can learn to tell you when to use -er on the end of an adjective (better) or more (more interesting). You just have to "feel it out," and decide which is right in sort of a heuristic way -- if it feels wrong, it's wrong; if it feels right, it's right.

Is that BS? A Chinese person told me there's a rule -- but I'm not sure what it is, or if it's for real (my students come up with weird "rules" sometimes). I remember it having to do with the number of syllables -- like if there are one or two, you add er, and if there are more you say more. Is this a real rule, or a rule of thumb?

( Evil or Very Mad

And if anybody thinks this is a dumb question, and I should be aware of some sort of rule, let me just say I went through 18 years of education and I never heard of any such thing. Don't blame me. Blame the American educational system! I looked for a rule in my grammar/style books and couldn't find anything -- I just want to know if this is for real or not. I don't want to gawp like a fish if someone asks me about this. And I know I shouldn't start sentences with and! I'm just a bit insecure right now and have PMS! Embarassed

)

guest of Japan · Joined: 28 Feb 2003 Posts: 1601 Location: Japan

Long ago I learned that if there are 3 or more syllables then you should use "more." If 2 or less, use "-er." This rule has many exceptions, but it's quite handy for students.

Gordon · Joined: 28 Jan 2003 Posts: 5309 Location: Japan

Guest of Japan is right on, 2 syllables or less and use -er. A good rule of thumb anyways.

joe-joe · Joined: 15 Oct 2003 Posts: 100 Location: Baku, Azerbaijan

I agree with Guest of Japan, that if a word has 1 or 2 syllables, you add -er are a suffix to the adjective, (e.g. high-higher), and if there are more than 3 syllables you put 'more' in front of the adjective, (more intelligent). There are indeed the irregular exceptions such as good/better, bad/worse.

joe-joe · Joined: 15 Oct 2003 Posts: 100 Location: Baku, Azerbaijan

I meant 3 or more syllables, not 'more than 3 syllables'! in my last post Embarassed

, and yes I also agree with Gordon as well; he beat me to the 'submit' button! Very Happy

Stephen Jones · Joined: 21 Feb 2003 Posts: 4124

If the word has three syllables, then it will use more. There are no exceptions to that rule.

If the word has one syllable then it will take the short form. There has been argumenot on this forum as to whether "more close" is acceptable, but the general consensus of opinion is that it is not. So you have another clear rule here.

With two syllables it depends on the last syllable - for example adjectives ending in -ing would take more, always, some words ending in -id or -er can take both forms, and some words would nearly always take short form. There is some leeway here so use your own judgement or check up with an online concordance such as the CoBuild.

It is not surprising you didn't come across this at school; you wouldn't need to as a native English speaker has these rules internalized. The "grammar" rules you are taught in High School cover the "mistakes" a native speaker would make, which are often not so much mistakes as differences in style or register.

What you need to do is to get a couple of reference grammars. Also I am surprised you did not cover this in your EFL course. I'd seriously consider a CELTA or Trinity Cert at the very least. After all your body has been working fine for twenty years but that doesn't qualify you to work as a doctor without additonal training :)

Hogbear · Joined: 12 Oct 2003 Posts: 42 Location: New York City

Is fun an exception?

leeroy · Joined: 30 Jan 2003 Posts: 777 Location: London UK

So, usually, 1 syllable will have +er. (hot=hotter)

2 syllables where the second syllable is a "y" will be +ier. (funny=funnier)

2 or more syllables otherwise will be more+ (more interesting).

However, prefixes don't count as a syllable in this rule (unhappy = unhappier) - and there are loads of exceptions to each rule (such as fun - and some people say "cleverer") anyway.

Roger · Joined: 19 Jan 2003 Posts: 9138

Hello, kurochan,
nobody beats Stephen and his explanation! Hat off to him! Anyway, your question, howe3ver "dumb" it was, was justified. Anyway, it does not mean that you are dumb. Re hogbeart's question concerning "fun".... "funner", "funnest"? Of course, it's 'more fun", and "most fun".
Perhaps this is because "fun" as an adjective is relatively new; most students acquire it as a noun. Is the use of "it's fun..." perhaps an idiomatic expression?

dyak · Joined: 25 Jun 2003 Posts: 630

dduck · Joined: 29 Jan 2003 Posts: 422 Location: In the middle

leeroy · Joined: 30 Jan 2003 Posts: 777 Location: London UK

"You teach a child to read, and he or her will be able to pass a literacy test.''

�George W. Bush, Feb. 21, 2001

http://politicalhumor.about.com/library/blbushisms2001.htm

nomadder · Posted: Sun Nov 23, 2003 6:03 pm Post subject:

Hmm? But will s/he be able to speak sensibly?

Example recently sent to me:

-I was at the airport checking in at the gate when an airport employee asked, "Has anyone put anything into your baggage without your knowledge?" To which I replied "If it was without my knowledge how would I know?" He smiled knowingly and nodded "That's why we ask."-

guest of Japan · Joined: 28 Feb 2003 Posts: 1601 Location: Japan

dduck,

The current President of the United States cannot be used as an example of effective English communication. To illustrate this, just type "stupid Bush quotes" into Google. You will be entertained for hours.

schwa · Joined: 12 Oct 2003 Posts: 164 Location: yap

Stephen Jones wrote above:
'If the word has three syllables, then it will use more. There are no exceptions to that rule.

I'd think unhappier, unfriendlier, etc are acceptable.