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Tiger Beer
Joined: 08 Feb 2003
Posts: 778
Location: Hong Kong
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 Posted: Mon Oct 29, 2007 4:41 pm Post subject: Places you'd consider teaching... |
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I'd consider...
Taiwan - Northeast Asia mixed with Southeast Asia.
Japan - Korea's alter-ego and more impressive cousin.
Brazil - best culture in the world! 
Kazakhstan - Okay, haven't been there, but seems intriguing enough. So does its neighbors like Kyrgyzstan and Uzbekistan.
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I wouldn't consider...
Spanish-speaking world, while although its a good one, already spent enough time in them and Brazil to know Brazil is more appealing to me anyways.
Africa - would be better to travel, not teach there.
Europe - Eastern Europe would be moderately attractive temporarily, possibly Romania or Ukraine, but I'd be pining for something Asian and not getting any resemblenace of it anywhere there.
The Middle East - a remote possibility. Seems better as it gets closer to the end of one's career. UAE or Bahrain would top of my list if I did.
Southeast Asia - could be interesting. Despite very few jobs here, the Philippines would interest me most in this region, but not likely to find work long-term there enough to make a semi-career out of it. Vietnam has $ but the people are too aggressive. Overall, if I were to work for little pay (ie Thailand, Malaysia, etc.), I'd rather head for my first love, Brazil.
China - the country that makes Korea look REALLY REALLY good! There isn't anything I've read or experienced (been there 4 times) that would make me want to hurry and get up over there. I'd be interested to hear from those who have however. |
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Rooster_2006
Joined: 24 Sep 2007
Posts: 984
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| Posted: Mon Oct 29, 2007 4:54 pm Post subject: |
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Okay, good topic, here's my list:
Countries I'm Willing to Teach in Before I Get My Degree:
China - I can get a visa legally without a degree (just my CELTA), and China has Yanbian Korean Autonomous Prefecture -- keep studying Korean at like 1/5 the price of Korea.
Russia - I'm ready for a break in a European country, even if I'm still in geographic Asia.
Mongolia - It seems like the ultimate anti-Korea, so it's seeming really appealing right now.
Indonesia - Low visa requirements from what I've gathered, and I really want to teach on a tropical island for a summer (although I might also be able to do this on Hainan Island).
Countries I'm Willing to Teach in AFTER I Get My Degree:
Japan - It just seems like the best place to teach. I work at a youth hostel right now, and the English teachers from Japan always seem so HAPPY with their situations, as opposed to teachers in Korea who are frequently messed up.
Korea - I've put in about 900 hours in the classroom learning their language, and I've spent over three years in their country, so at least it's familiar terrain, and the pay is pretty high.
Hong Kong - I lived there for three years. It'd be fun to drop by again. Hong Kong is also a lot more tolerant of diversity than most other places in Asia, so maybe it'd be the best bet for the long-term.
I wouldn't consider...
My Own Country (USA) or Another English-Speaking Country - If I'm going to be in my own country (or another one in the Anglosphere), I'm going to do something I want to do, not teach ESL.
Thailand - No matter how great a place it is, there's no way I'm going to teach for the wages that are paid there if I have worked hard and gotten a degree, especially when everyone I know will be whispering to each other about how I must be a *beep*-monger (sorry, I didn't make the stereotype up).
North Korea - I would LOVE to teach there for like six months, but I won't even consider it because I'm an American, and I don't see how I could get a job there.
Anywhere in the Middle East - I think it would be fascinating and possibly profitable, but I'd have major concerns about my safety. Americans aren't really in fashion right now over there.
Any Latin American Country - I hated high school Spanish and have little interest in any of those countries. Plus the wages suck. Plus working in a Spanish-speaking country isn't particularly unique (I want to be unique).
Cambodia - It seemed like a cool country when I toured there, but from what I've seen, there is very little paid English teaching -- just volunteer things, and not only that, YOU have to pay to volunteer! Pay to volunteer? Are you smoking crack?
Africa - I think this would mainly be volunteering. I think there are better ways to volunteer than to teach English. Just look at India and the Philippines -- high rates of English, yet neither has an average GDP per capita (nominal) of over $2,000 a year. I'm sure some offended English teacher will flame me now, explaining how teaching English is the great savior of all third world nations. However, it's not.
Central Asia - Why? |
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Rooster_2006
Joined: 24 Sep 2007
Posts: 984
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| Posted: Mon Oct 29, 2007 5:23 pm Post subject: |
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Oh my, I can't believe I forgot:
#1 for "Place I Would Never Want to Teach"
INDIA - Maybe it was my awful Indian boss at 7-Eleven, Kamlesh Kaur. Whatever the case, I not only don't want to teach there, I don't even want to go there. People burying themselves alive for religious reasons, women setting themselves on fire because their husbands died, the plague, debt slaves, the accent, etc. You would need to pay me (a lot) to go there. |
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QatarChic
Joined: 06 May 2005
Posts: 445
Location: Qatar
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| Posted: Mon Oct 29, 2007 6:53 pm Post subject: |
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Interesting topic.............
Countries I would consider
Brazil-has been a childhood dream for as long as I can remember
Argentina/Chile- out of sheer curiosity
China-loved Beijing when I was there for 10 days on business, of course it may well be different to live & work there.
Nepal- had a great holiday there/would be rewarding & there'd be lots of opportunities for trekking/ mountain climbing etc
Jordan-different side to the Middle East
Vietnam/Cambodia- sheer curiosity & to explore other regions in SE Asia
Kenya/Tanzania- Be interesting to gain experience in Africa, and the East appeals to me more than West Africa
Countries I wouldn't consider
Possibly Eastern Europe- it's never appealed to me, but I haven't been there before, so I may change my mind!
Korea- just from what I read on the forums there 
Countries I would love to go back to
Spain- had an amazing time working there, but pay very poor 
Ireland- had a great time working there
Oman- great students to teach, but low salaries compared to the rest of the Gulf |
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dixie
Joined: 23 Apr 2006
Posts: 644
Location: D.F
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| Posted: Mon Oct 29, 2007 7:52 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: |
| Plus working in a Spanish-speaking country isn't particularly unique (I want to be unique). |
I get your desire to be unique, but not sure how you can say that when you have a bunch of Asian countries on your list that are high centres for EFL teachers as well.
I get why you wouldn�t want to come here (Mexico) or Latin American if you have no interest in language or culture. I feel the same way about going East (although I woudn�t mind earning some of the salaries!)
Currently I am teaching where I want. Nothing else appeals to me, although I would love to go and travel to a bunch of other places ("bunch" basically meaning the rest of the world!  )
If I did ever move, it would likely be furthar South, although I don�t have a specific country that I currently desire to experience above the others. |
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soapdodger
Joined: 19 Apr 2007
Posts: 203
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| Posted: Mon Oct 29, 2007 8:04 pm Post subject: |
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| Mustique would do me fine, but I'd settle for St. Lucia if I really had to slum it. |
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wildchild
Joined: 14 Nov 2005
Posts: 519
Location: Puebla 2009 - 2010
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| Posted: Tue Oct 30, 2007 12:23 am Post subject: |
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Consider
| Quote: |
| 1. to think carefully about, esp. in order to make a decision; contemplate; reflect on: He considered the cost before buying the new car. |
I would consider any country.
short of changing the subject, or having cotton in the ears, how could any educated person not consider something? |
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denise
Joined: 23 Apr 2003
Posts: 3419
Location: finally home-ish
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| Posted: Tue Oct 30, 2007 2:18 am Post subject: |
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My ultimate goal is to end up back in the US, either in a university/college or doing teacher training on a TEFL course. I really don't plan on country-hopping anymore, but I think I said that a couple of countries ago. If I were to keep looking for jobs, I think I'd look into...
the UAE, particularly Al Ain or Abu Dhabi.
Hmmm... nowhere else has salaries that are high enough + a culture that I think I'd enjoy. If salaries and visas were not an issue, I'd go somewhere in Europe.
Places I wouldn't consider: anywhere I've already taught--Czech Republic, Japan, China, Chile, Peru. I might go back and visit (well, not Peru--I'm done with it!), but I wouldn't want to attempt to repeat my previous experiences.
And no Korea. It just doesn't appeal to me.
To...???... whoever it was that said that the Middle East is not safe for Americans--I'm sorry you think that. Yes, that certainly is the stereotype, but I can assure you that we're quite safe here in Oman. In fact, I've had people here ask me why we (Americans) think they're all terrorists. It's really sad.
d |
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GambateBingBangBOOM
Joined: 04 Nov 2003
Posts: 2021
Location: Japan
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| Posted: Tue Oct 30, 2007 2:46 am Post subject: |
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| Rooster_2006 wrote: |
Asia, so maybe it'd be the best bet for the long-term.
I wouldn't consider...
My Own Country (USA) or Another English-Speaking Country - If I'm going to be in my own country (or another one in the Anglosphere), I'm going to do something I want to do, not teach ESL.
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wtf! |
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jammish
Joined: 17 Nov 2005
Posts: 1704
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| Posted: Tue Oct 30, 2007 3:08 am Post subject: |
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| Rooster_2006 wrote: |
Oh my, I can't believe I forgot:
#1 for "Place I Would Never Want to Teach"
INDIA - Maybe it was my awful Indian boss at 7-Eleven, Kamlesh Kaur. Whatever the case, I not only don't want to teach there, I don't even want to go there. People burying themselves alive for religious reasons, women setting themselves on fire because their husbands died, the plague, debt slaves, the accent, etc. You would need to pay me (a lot) to go there. |
it's also the most stunning, amazing and interesting place to travel in. I had a fantastic time doing voluntary work there 10 years ago. Every day I would finish teaching for the morning and jump on my bike and go riding through forests full of peacocks, monkeys, deer, etc. It was magical. That said, I dunno about living in one of the big cities like Bombay, Madras etc. |
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Rooster_2006
Joined: 24 Sep 2007
Posts: 984
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| Posted: Tue Oct 30, 2007 4:10 am Post subject: |
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| jammish wrote: |
| Rooster_2006 wrote: |
Oh my, I can't believe I forgot:
#1 for "Place I Would Never Want to Teach"
INDIA - Maybe it was my awful Indian boss at 7-Eleven, Kamlesh Kaur. Whatever the case, I not only don't want to teach there, I don't even want to go there. People burying themselves alive for religious reasons, women setting themselves on fire because their husbands died, the plague, debt slaves, the accent, etc. You would need to pay me (a lot) to go there. |
it's also the most stunning, amazing and interesting place to travel in. I had a fantastic time doing voluntary work there 10 years ago. Every day I would finish teaching for the morning and jump on my bike and go riding through forests full of peacocks, monkeys, deer, etc. It was magical. That said, I dunno about living in one of the big cities like Bombay, Madras etc. |
I've known perfectly sane, rational people who loved India -- I know one person (a Korean married to an American) who loves it so much, she's planning to retire there. I don't understand them, but apparently they see something that I don't. However, I don't think I'll ever teach there. |
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Rooster_2006
Joined: 24 Sep 2007
Posts: 984
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| Posted: Tue Oct 30, 2007 4:25 am Post subject: |
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| GambateBingBangBOOM wrote: |
| Rooster_2006 wrote: |
Asia, so maybe it'd be the best bet for the long-term.
I wouldn't consider...
My Own Country (USA) or Another English-Speaking Country - If I'm going to be in my own country (or another one in the Anglosphere), I'm going to do something I want to do, not teach ESL.
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wtf! |
What's so odd about this? Aren't most of the people overseas teaching English doing it because their local language proficiency isn't good enough to do what they really want to do in the country they want to live in? I'll do a good job and try to surpass the other teachers while I'm doing it, but it won't be anything more than a mini-career lasting five years or less, if I can do anything about it. |
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GambateBingBangBOOM
Joined: 04 Nov 2003
Posts: 2021
Location: Japan
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| Posted: Tue Oct 30, 2007 4:46 am Post subject: |
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Even when your local language is very good, the opportunities outside of teaching your own language (assuming that language is English) can be a bit limited.
***Most*** people teach in overseas placements for a few years, and then go back to their home country for their career. Japan, at least, likes it that way, and has big problems with the aging population because they don't want to increase immigration, but won't have enough people to fill all the jobs in the next generation or so. Already there are predictions that every student will be getting into university simply because otherwise the universities will be forced to close. |
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Rooster_2006
Joined: 24 Sep 2007
Posts: 984
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| Posted: Tue Oct 30, 2007 4:51 am Post subject: |
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| GambateBingBangBOOM wrote: |
Even when your local language is very good, the opportunities outside of teaching your own language (assuming that language is English) can be a bit limited.
***Most*** people teach in overseas placements for a few years, and then go back to their home country for their career. Japan, at least, likes it that way, and has big problems with the aging population because they don't want to increase immigration, but won't have enough people to fill all the jobs in the next generation or so. Already there are predictions that every student will be getting into university simply because otherwise the universities will be forced to close. |
Although I was aware of that, it's always nice to hear it again.  Although Japan is not interested in increasing immigration, I doubt the population decline will cause them to DECREASE immigration, either, and when jobs are sitting unfilled, they're going to need someone to fill them -- they might even have to resort to the foreigners (English teachers who are sick of being English teachers) who are hanging around and applying for them, if they get REALLY desperate. I just hope this day comes sooner and not in 2050. |
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GambateBingBangBOOM
Joined: 04 Nov 2003
Posts: 2021
Location: Japan
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| Posted: Tue Oct 30, 2007 6:02 am Post subject: |
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| Rooster_2006 wrote: |
| Although Japan is not interested in increasing immigration, I doubt the population decline will cause them to DECREASE immigration, either, |
That's exactly what it'll mean. It's not the NUMBER of foreigners. It's the PERCENTAGE. Less Japanese people means less foreigners to make up the same percentage. That's actually the way they think of it, because for the people for whom immigration is a big problem, they are trying to protect their unique culture from foreign influence. I forget the actual number, but I think I read they are looking at increasing foreigners by 1% in the next while to deal with the aging population with a note that foreign labour will never be over 5(?)% (in other words, they will replace each foreigner as they leave for a while, and then just slowly stop replacing them when they leave, because in twenty years time the number of Japanese people will have gone down sufficiently that by the number of foreigners in the country TODAY, they will have too many).
| Quote: |
and when jobs are sitting unfilled, they're going to need someone to fill them -- they might even have to resort to the foreigners (English teachers who are sick of being English teachers) who are hanging around and applying for them, if they get REALLY desperate. I just hope this day comes sooner and not in 2050. |
Or else, they will just have Japanese people double up on jobs doing the bare minimum for each, until eventually the compasny closes, or does something to find enough Japanese people to fill positions. There are already more than a few people saying Japan will revert to a smaller scale economy in the future rather than import more people. There is also a drive to try and get more Brazillians of Japanese heritage into Japan to increase the population, and of course emergency messures like 'no overtime day' one day a week in the hopes that by husbands and wives actually seeing each other they will create babies, when in fact, they tend to be so tired that they go home and drink beers (for the men) and catch up on chores / raise the kids (for the women- men tend to do a whole lot of jack in Japan other than work and it's why the majority of divoces are occuring with retired couples- the wife hasn't actually seen this guy in thirty odd years other than on weekends and he drives her crazy so she ditches him).
My impression is that when Japanese people think of increasing foreign labour, they are thinking of increasing the number of warehouse and possibly construction people. The idea that a foreigner would end up in management is not one that goes over well. In fact, a couple of years ago a woman who had been a nurse for longer than any other nurse was passed over for a promotion because of her Korean heritage, she isn't allowed to hold senior management positions in public companies (Korean people who arrived during and after WWII have a special status that allows them to stay in the country permanently, but functions to block them from citizenship and therefore can never get some positions). You might be thinking, "But won't that set up an almost Medieval style heirarchy of one race above others in terms of social class?" The answer is "Yes. That's Japan".
I think you're assuming a North American style multi-culturalism theory here for Japan, but that type of thing doesn't exist (as far as work goes, with individual people and accepting of foreigness that's a different thing and varies from person to person). |
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