Job Discussion Forums

[jeffinflorida]

Ok I am teaching business courses at a "key" Chinese Uni at their Canadian affiliate.

I mentioned that most of my students are spoiled rich kids who come to school, pay their 25,000 plus rmb a year, and expect to be handed several diplomas at the end on a silver platter.

This school does this funky stuff where we teach � semesters, so every semester I have two different subjects to teach � like mini nine week semesters.

So I calculated that for this semester � which started like November 15, there were 21 actual classes that I lectured in. This does not count exam days or the Saturday when we had a class and I told the class not to come.

So I actually have the monitor is each class take attendance every class. I found that if I had them take attendance at the beginning of class then many would leave at break time so I staggered attendance and sometimes did it after the break.

So I was bored last night and actually totaled up all the students absences and counted them. This came after I chatted on MSN with a student who pretty much begged me to give her a high / passing grade.

To give you some insight, at the first class I tell the students the rules : Come to class, Don�t sleep in my class, Do you work, Don�t cheat � and you pass. To me it�s pretty simple.

So out of the 21 classes I have given some students have missed as many as 17 classes!

So this is the final grade policy I am enacting and implementing. Don�t ask me what the school policy is because it doesn�t really matter to me as their polices look like a palm tree in a hurricane�

Miss 4 classes ( that�s almost 20% of classes) and your final letter grade is dropped by one. As in A becomes B.

Miss 8 classes and your final letter grade is dropped by 2. As in an A becomes a C.

Miss 9 or 10 or more and pretty much you failed the course.

The schools latest policy � as told to me by students � is that if you fail a course you can not longer just pay the 100 rmb penalty and take the retest ( which everyone passes) but now have to pay like 4000rmb and retake the whole course.

So, this policy was stated at the beginning of the class. There are maybe 30 students who fall into the miss 4 or more category and about 10 that fall into the �Your assss is gonna fail because you missed 9 or more category.�

So the question remains, do you think I am being fair to my students?

Keep in mind there are some very hard working students ( mostly girls by the way, but that�s no secret) and I believe that by giving someone an A who missed 10 classes just because the got an A on every exam is not fair to those that show up every class.

Unfortunately I can only reward them with a high mark (and maybe a box of nice DoveBars for the 4 girls in the same room who have the highest marks).


Remeber, not counting exam days there are only 22 lecture days that I took attendance.

[vikuk]

You sound like a darn shoe factory boss!!!!!
Sorry - serious contribution - Jeff I think you're being totally fair to your students - after all you always intended to work as a teacher - not some sorry idiot who let's anything pass for education in their classroom.
If it don't work out there's always CCTV9 and the weather forecasting

[johnchina]

Are you being fair?

Chinese answer - No! It is a well-known fact that chinese students are incredibly intelligent and can understand everything just by reading it one time in a drowsy state or even whilst asleep. You are a very bad teacher and this can be proven by two means. First, the students are leaving your class in the middle or simply not attending. If you jumped around more like the white monkey they expect (and their parents are paying for!), more students would attend. Second, you clearly do not respect your students' rights. They have other things to do apart from attending your stupid, boring class! They need to chat on msn, go shopping for worthless trinkets and sleep after their intensive studies. However, you can still redeem yourself by giving all students an A grade.

Western anwer - Yes!

[jwbhomer]

I always included an attendance component in my marking scheme, and that was with the full blessing of my boss. I made it 20% of the final mark, and "sold" it to the students by telling them that all they had to do was show up and they'd score an easy 20 marks out of the 60 needed to pass. And most of them actually did it! I would say the average score for attendance was over 17/20.

One thing I wouldn't do, though, is let the class monitor take attendance. I used to call the roll myself. For a class of 30 or 40, taking 3 or 4 minuts out of 100 is not a lot. And it helped me to get to know their names.

So in a word, I don't think you're being unfair, Jeff.

[Lorean]

I can't remember exactly, but I think standard Chinese university policy is to fail students who missed X number of classes.

With regards to penalties, I think you should have stated your exact policy when the semester began.

I am in a similar predicament. I teach 3 different advanced listening classes. 80+% of my advanced listening class 2 students appear to have conspired to not complete homework assignments and not study for the final.

[vikuk]

[Lorean]

[vikuk]

Lorean writes this -

[mike w]

If students missed more than 20% of a course, they would not be allowed to take the final exam.

[tw]

I emphasize a lot on attendance, unlike one of my predecessors who gave all his students 80's and 90's -- even though only about 10% attended his classes after he'd told them that they didn't have to go if they didn't want to learn. I ding all late students and absent students 2.5% and once it reaches 15%, they get an automatic zero. Of course, if they can show an official slip from the office stating why and when they were absent, I would give them back 5% for the specific lesson. That is why I had near-perfect attendance, especially after students started noticing that I was not bluffing.

[Nemesis]

My school's got a rock solid system: for every five classes missed, they lose one percentage point.



As long as I keep dancin' for bananas, the system works a treat.

[Lorean]

I admire the monkey... wish there was a good DDR machine in my city.

[China.Pete]

"I always included an attendance component in my marking scheme... I made it 20% of the final mark..." -- JWB Homer

Right. Twenty percent is generally enough to get all but the totally disinterested students into class. Don't think you should just drop their grade, though. There's something to be said for passing those students who can get very good marks on the exam without coming to class (how are you testing them, BTW?). The twenty-percent rule has the added benefit of helping the slower students who are working their little hearts out in your class to get at least a passing grade.

[kev7161]

Is this the same JeffinFlorida who melts when any pretty coed winks at him and invites him to dinner?

Seriously though, you say some that miss classes are PASSING your English exams? (or, your exams in English?) a) how easy are your tests, or b) how fluent are these Einsteins? I personally feel attendance is important and should be part of the grade. There should be class projects/activities that take place during class time that goes toward the grades. Whether it be some spoken presentation or a pop quiz, if you're not there, you can't do it.

[roadwalker]

I told my oral classes that if they miss one or two classes during the semester, no sweat. But if they miss much more, and I DON'T CARE FOR WHATEVER REASON, that I would mark them down. I don't have a clue what their little slips of paper read and I frankly don't care if they were sick, tired or both. There are a couple that won't get a grade since I don't have anything to base it on. I do have one older uni student who missed a lot of classes, the majority in fact, apparently for family reasons. She took the oral exam at the end so I will give her a poor, but passing grade. This is only because she was very active in class while she was in attendence.