Job Discussion Forums

[temujinsky]

I was surprised by the passion within this Omani student when she came to me after class and asked why the 'West' sends so many poorly trained teachers to Oman. She wanted to know if Omanis were considered to be less important than students from other countries, especially in the 'West'.
I was surprised, as I mentioned. I asked her for more information and she told me that teachers who had only a peripheral grasp of the English language [teachers of oral English, and the like] were held in contempt by students who were serious about learning correct English. She then brought the much maligned apostrophe into our conversation. She asked me why teachers of English knew so little about the rules of grammar, and idiosyncratic anomalies such as the apostrophe. 'If a teacher does not know the simple rules concerning the simple apostrophe, can I be expected to trust them with more important aspectss of the English language?' I knew what she meant and I could gather into my recollection quite a few teachers who had no idea or were simply dismissive of the apostrophe.

[huntjuliehunt]

I understand this to a degree, and then I don't. If an English teacher who has earned his or her high school diploma and a 4 year degree from an American University doesn't have precise grammar, is it really all that necessary for an Omani student to have it? Of course they should have the right to learn grammar, the correct way. But I have often found that students who can't use simple, proper words to construct comprehensive sentences, are adamant that their teachers know how to teach less significant information. Frankly, most of us in the West don't use grammar properly anyway. Rosie O'Donnell has written two bestselling books, and has a widely read blog. One of her viewer comments was "Can you please try to use correct grammar? Yours is awful." She responded, "Correct grammar is boring." I'm not excusing teachers who just should not be teaching English, but I think students enjoy griping about things. Don't you ever want to say, "Look, I'm a Brit. I'm 40 years old. I have a degree. I enjoy lively conversations in fluent English with friends, family, and colleagues, that you wouldn't even understand. Now quit worrying about grammar, because in the real world people don't care too much about it. And learn words and sentences, because in the real world, people care about those."

[Kootvela]

The reason the West keeps sending unqualified teachers (not only to Oman but also to the rest of the world) is that any builder or plumber-no offence per profession meant- can take a TEFL in 4 weeks and be entitled to teach just because they were born in an English speaking country.

Away with certificate mills, I say.

[johnslat]

Dear huntjuliehunt,
I see your point. However, it seems to me the problem is more with the students' perceptions/opinions of their teachers than whether it's all that necessary for a teacher to know (and be able to teach) proper grammar.
And to tell you the truth, I don't think I'd use Rosie O'Donnell as much of an authority as to whether grammar is important or "boring."
If not knowing how to use apostrophes properly is a lack that will diminish students' respect for a teacher, then I think the teacher has a problem.
We, after all, are supposed to be the authorities, and it can be hard to be effective teachers if our students know more about the language than we do.
Regards,
John

[huntjuliehunt]

I agree with you on my use of Rosie O'Donnell as an authority. It may also be true, as you indicated, that the students are suffering teachers who just plain suck, and they're picking at grammar problems, when it may be an overall bad teacher problem. A good teacher, who cares, and who can teach the basics, can probably win over students. I am an example. I'll be brave here and give what may be the most embarrassing teaching moment in my life. I had a class full of police officers, who were very rigid and stout, which made me insecure about my teaching. I decided to give them a spelling exam. After the exam, I said, "Who can spell (a word I've forgotten)?" One of the students raised his hand and spelled it. I said, "That's correct. And a good way to remember the spelling of that is to remember (some letter scheme I noticed when I wrote the spelling on the board.)" Another student raised his hand and said, "Uhh... I don't believe that is the correct spelling." I looked at the word I'd written and immediately knew he was right. I don't know how one recovers himself in a situation like that. If I hadn't already gained their basic trust in my knowledge, there would probably have been a line of angry officers to the director's room.

[Stephen Jones]

[veiledsentiments]

All you have to do is read around this board for the last few years and you see some of the professional teachers of Oman bemoaning the fact that the universities and colleges in the hinterlands have been taking teachers with limited credentials and often little or no experience... not to mention some significant personality disorders and drinking problems.

The problem naturally stems from the fact that Oman does not want or can not afford to pay for the top of the TEFL profession... as SJ points out.

Temujinski... you might want to point that out to your student who made the complaint. A little economic reality check for them...

VS

[temujinsky]

VS, a carpenter hit a nail a bit skew and the job is not as good as when he or she had hit the nail head on. The same applies to our language; why not at least try to correlate our symbols so as to allow common understanding instead of regional and individual anomalies causing misunderstanding? It's just sheer laziness and ineptitude that creates confusion and in many cases utter contempt for poor teaching. My own country is in a mess due to this laziness. I owe it to students to be as close to perfect as I can manage. I can only ask: Why shouldn't I?

[flutterbayou]

[Borealis]

The CELTA is intended as an introductory course only. In an ideal situation a newly CELTA trained teacher should expect to teach beginners only, under supervision from the DOS and other experienced teachers. By working systematically through the student and accompanying teacher's book it is possible for the grammatically challenged to understand enough to teach said grammar. Teaching it is, in fact, the best way of learning it. After two years or so of "apprenticeship" the DELTA should be the next logical step forward. In many countries, including Oman, the CELTA and DELTA are not required qualifications. As long as schools continue to hire people with only a BA it's hardly surprising that students complain their teachers don't know how to teach.

B

[Kootvela]

[veiledsentiments]

First off, I don't know many places in the Gulf that do not at least require some sort of TEFL cert and many state a preference for the CELTA. This isn't the far reaches of Asia where they hire people for their native speaker status and maybe a degree in underwater basket weaving. Thank goodness... and it is why I avoided teacher in that part of the world. Of course, the variation of CERTs is similar to the variation in MAs.

And there can certainly be an over emphasis on grammar. I focused on teaching writing for my last ten or so years and one thing that students complained about was that I would not correct errors in spoken English in class. I refused to stop the flow of a discussion to nitpick grammar and stopped them if they tried to do it to each other. Now, I would spend half a class discussing the grammar errors that appeared in their writing and trying to pound proofreading skills into their heads to avoid them.

For those that questioned my seeming inconsistency, I asked them... do you speak perfectly grammatical Arabic in a conversation? They are the first to admit that they do not. My answer was that neither do English speakers. In spoken language, communication rules!! But, they darned well better know those grammar rules and use them in their essays or they will not do well in my writing class.

VS

[PattyFlipper]

[temujinsky]

As with VS, I do not halt a class because of THEIR grammar or pronunciation. Language is a flow that connects one to others and the idea of inserting obstacles into that flow is counterproductive to learning a language. I do, however, insist that I speak and write correctly, even within the vernacular, street talk and all.
My pet hate is the teacher who is not a teacher, but merely a user of the language, and usually a user who mis-uses the language because he or she has no idea as to grammar, spelling or syntax. Or what's worse, a teacher who happens to have these facilities but who couldn't care less about minor things such as apostrophes, hyphens, transitive and intransitive verbs, and all the other nit-picking devices that construct a marvellous and fascinating language.

[Borealis]

I agree with you Temujinski. I disagree, Kootvela that inexperienced teachers should be given upper levels. From my experience in several countries this is where the complaints often come from - ie that the students know more than the teachers. Working through the levels, until competent in both methodology and grammar, is the best way for a new teacher to gain experience and be able (eventually) to teach at all levels. In addition, a new teacher should be regularly observed by the DOS/experienced mentor and given feedback, and also be given the opportunity to observe experienced teachers, thus continuing what was started in the CELTA. If the feedback is done well, as part of professional development, it can be a positive experience for the new teacher. This is how teacher training is done where I work and the system works well. There is also encouragement for teachers to continue their professional development through the DELTA and MA.

VS I find that that a good way to encourage students to be communicative without worrying about grammar mistakes is to tell them I will record the errors (generally the grammar points we have been working on) during conversation classes. I give them a handout later with the recorded errors and ask them to work in pairs to correct them, then we go over them on the whiteboard. Most students I have taught this way enjoy it because no individual student is singled out. In academic writing, instead of correcting the errors I use a marking code and the students have to correct their own errors in the next draft before I grade their essays.

B.