Job Discussion Forums

[Phil_b]

There have been a few posts here wondering how one could move to Spain permanantely: The consensus seems to be that as an EFL teacher it's quite difficult. Well, We're looking at this in the medium term - nothing like a couple of years in London to make you yearn for a bit of climactic and human warmth.....

We're looking to do the whole set ourselves up, start a family get a house (or flat... perhaps more likely) and are wondering about the stages to go through - I wondered if anyone with experience had any feedback on my na�ve ideas....

The cities that I've seen mentioned with the most work are Madrid, Barcelona and Valencia...

I'm English, so there's no issue with paperwork. I've got about 5 years teaching experience (mainly English, a bit of Spanish) in Paraguay,Argentina and the UK, I've got a CELTA, a Level 5 Certificate in Further Education Teaching stage 3 (a CertED) and the Level 4 Certificate for ESOL subject specialists. (I don't expect anyone in Spain to have heard of those last two - but they were a damn sight more useful and harder to get than that the CELTA!) and I'm currently studying for the Institute of Linguists Diploma in Translation. I speak fluent Spanish and good-but-rusty-and-needing-practice Catalan. My wife is from Argentina and works as a project manager in a translation agency, she's studying for a Masters in Translation...

Most of the posters here seem to suggest that it's best if you can combine Teaching with "other work" whatever that may be in order to make ends meet... Translation's obviously an option that appeals, but I'll have to see what else I can find.

Barcelona is the city that I'd fallen in love with - it's the whole reason I ended up studying Spanish and teaching English... but I'd pretty much ruled it out as it appears to be jaw-droppingly expensive - it really doesn't seem any cheaper than London and my income would be much lower there... But then I saw a Masters that I really want to do at the UAB and there doesn't seem to be anything quite like it near the other cities that I though of. I was wondering which areas of Barcelona people thought were good for getting cheap(er) rents? I don't mind places being a bit scuzzy (I've lived in downtown Asuncion..) but I don't want to get mugged too often.... I've done a little bit of research and surprisingly it seemed that the Eixample was as cheap as anywhere to live - it looks pricey to me... I assumed that the outskirts would be cheaper, but they don't seem to be. The other option of course would be to live somewhere outside the Barcelon�s comarca... Sabadell seemed to be a nice option - big enough to have things closeby, just a 30-min train ride from Barna and dead close to the UAB - flats that cost around �800/month in BCN seem to be more like �650/month in Sadadell. Has anyone lived there or similar - any advice - I'm expecting to have to work in Barcelona, I'm used to commuting across London, it can't be any worse than that surely?

The recieved knowledge on this board seems to suggest that Madrid is the best place to find work, I'm assuming that costs are similar to in BCN but that earning potential is higher - What about dealing with August when EVERYONE leaves - is that easier/harder than in Catalunya? I had been very tempted by Madrid, until I saw the course in Barcelona - I don't know it as well as Barcelona, are there outlying parts of the city which are more bearable in terms for the ����?

Of course the other option would be Valencia - I like the look of Valencia, on the coast, reasonably sized, nice climate - I'm guessing that it's a fair bit cheaper than BCN/MAD and that there are fewer Guiris out looking for work. Of courses, wages are probably a bit lower - is the cost of living/earnings ratio going to be better?

I'm just looking for suggestions and advice if anyone has any to offer? Are there other parts of Spain that I should think about (Zaragoza? Bilbao? Sevilla?)

Muchas gracias por adelantado...

[workingnomad]

I am surprised no one has responded to this post?

[spiral78]

Well, I haven't much in the way of concrete advice to offer here, BUT - for what it's worth - the 'better' jobs usually go to people with local connections and reputation.

With that in mind, one logical progression would be to find The Place, go there, get set up in a starter situation, and spend a bit of time gathering possible useful contacts.

It seems to me that you would likely have the qualifications for a university position - you might start by locating yourself in an area with a selection of international schools and universities. Jobs in either are usually much better than newbie-level positions could ever be, in terms of pay and benefits (and long-term security). But openings are relatively rare, and, as noted above, they usually go to people on the ground, with local contacts and good reputations in the area.

Good luck.

[Phil_b]

Yeah, I fully expect the first couple of years to be a bit of a hard slog as I try to find some enchufes

About Valencia, this thread http://forums.eslcafe.com/job/viewtopic.php?t=62595 has quite a bit of useful info on it... It does sound interesting, but I think working as an aut�nomo doing company classes seems to be the best bet - and Valencia's more orientated towards the kids market...

On that point I recently learnt of the existence of a Teaching Business English cert accredited by LCCI - I'd never heard of this before... is it any good? Either from the professional development angle or in terms of increasing employability?

University teaching sounds interesting. Is it possible without a Masters? UK unis wouldn't touch you without one... Is it a realistic and worthwhile long term goal?

[jonniboy]

[Moore]

I think the reason why not so many people responded to this post is that not so many people have in-depth longer-term experience of both Madrid and Barcelona, and of course it's impossible to have done both and have recent information about both.

I reckon that by now I have a decent knowledge of the teaching scene here in Madrid, but what I know about other cities tends to come from people who have moved to Madrid after trying other cities and so tend to have rather negative opinions about the teaching scene in those places.

From everything I have heard, Madrid seems to be the best city from a financial point of view: tons of work and wages are definitely decent here.
The only major drawback (which I suspect applies to every Spanish city) is the August thing: there's just hardly any work because there are hardly any students to teach.

Apart from that, Madrid has the real disadvantage of having no beach, nor even much of a river to speak of, but we do have the enormous Casa de Campo park which is superb for Sunday mountain biking and the Sierra mountains just an hour and twenty minutes away by public transport. The weather here doesn't look great on paper as described by the guidebooks: very cold in winter, and very hot in summer, but the reality is that Madrid almost always has clear blue skies, the cold is a dry not damp cold so is bearable and the very hot summers are also dry not humid so it's not suffocating. Culture-wise, Barcelona wins hands down: Madrid is much more of a business capital than a cultural capital, but there are more and more little cool arty bars and shops so it's catching up a bit. Also, Madrid is not as saturated by tourists in summer as Barcelona, and I'm told that it's much easier to integrate into having Spanish friends and girlfriends here.

So basically I'd definitely recommend teaching in Madrid, having lived in many other cities around the world but not in Spain.


_________________________________________________________________________
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...send your c.v. around ALL the schools in Madrid, Barcelona or Berlin in one hit with our c.v. sending service... www.lingobongo.com

[workingnomad]

[spiral78]

Particularly since it's a Europe-wide 'problem,' certainly not confined to Spain or any one city inside it.

[Moore]

The thing is about the August work thing is that it's not just August: many big companies where a business english teacher teaches stop all their classes during July and August and only start re-allocating classes to their workers by the end of September.

Most teachers find their hours drop off heavily during July, August is rubbish, and September only gets going at the end of the month. That means you have 2 months with half pay and one month with almost none: you'd have to go on a seriously long holiday to deal with that. And of course this financial hit can wipe out any savings you've accumulated during the year.

The difference between Spain, and say Paris, is that many teachers there in Paris are often on 12 month contracts so get summer pay: in Spain that is extremely rare, normally teachers are offered a nine month contract which of course is not very useful.

The only courses left open to teachers here are:

...weather it out with your savings (but the wages, though comparitively good in Madrid, are not that easy to save up to live off for 2 months and go on holiday)
....go and teach summer camp in Spain (not everyone's cup of tea and it usally means doing a residential course so people whose partners are Spanish and stay in Madrid it's a non-starter)
...go to the UK and teach for summer (same problem and anyway, you're supposed to be living in Spain)
...cobble together as many privates and other work such as translating to try and stop the money haemorrhage as much as possible.

Believe me, every year as great many people get sick of this and up sticks to somewhere where contracts do last all year round or move to "conventional" jobs here (IBM has a big international department here and that hoovers up many disillusioned teachers every year), but for those of us who have decided that they want to stay here long term and want to stay in the teaching profession it's a yearly ball-ache that is a real test of your commitment to staying here in the TEFL business.

I don't want to get all negative about teaching here though: the quality of life here is excellent, and the students are the nicest I have ever taught (maybe not the most studious students, but certainly very friendly, warm and talkative which makes teaching here a pleasure), but the summer thing is a major issue to consider for anyone thinking about coming here for the long term.

_________________________________________________________________________
...Jobs and language exchanges in Madrid, Barcelona and Berlin... www.lingobongo.com

...send your c.v. around ALL the schools in Madrid, Barcelona or Berlin in one hit with our c.v. sending service... www.lingobongo.com

[jonniboy]

As Spiral says, it's a Europe thing. People want to be sitting on a beach or an outdoor cafe in the Summer months not in a classroom. The other option for teachers is just to head to UK and do temporary work in some other field in the Summer. I did lots of finance and accountancy based work before teaching so it's usually very easy to fall back on that. It does get a little frustrating though.

[Marcoregano]

A surprising number of Spain-based EFLers come out to HK in July/August - stacks of summer work here I'm told, though I don't get involved. I know the Brit Council here run a lot of summer courses.