Job Discussion Forums

[Dalian Veteran]

Hello everybody! I've returned to the States after my three and a half year ESL teaching/management tour in China. And now, I want to discuss the very thing that affects Western teachers' morale more than anything else. Perhaps the most difficult culture shock item of all, even more than the staring & gawking. The thing which is the largest contributor to disgruntledness and negativity as reflected on the Dave's ESL Cafe posts. That is, traditional Chinese management.

Now, I'm in no way prejudiced (for I've had some liberal Chinese managers as well). Nor am I one of those snots who like to preach Western values. But to be honest, management is definitely something that needs to be improved, both in the ESL industry and in the country of China as a whole. And its not just the Westerners who complain about traditional Chinese management - many of the younger generation Chinese, including the teaching assistants & adult students that I knew, as well as my Chinese wife and her co-workers in the civil aviation sector, are also fed up with traditional Chinese management styles. The only ones who favor this type of management are either very traditional & conservative themselves or are benefiting from the connections with this type of management.

So, are you sick & tired of or fed up with: guanxi, "face", hiring relatives, rule-by-power instead of by principle, treating the contract like a piece of paper, finding excuses to take money out of the salary, authoritarianism, favoritism, lack of communication or feedback, disregard for employees' rights, seeking petty revenge for loss of face, glass classroom doors/walls or even letting parents observe classes, corruption, da pianzi, and many other irking things?

Well, this is the place for you to safely rant and rave and release pent up frustrations in a safe, nonconfrontational way. Let's light this candle, baby! And rant and rant.

Check out the poll, too.

[Dalian Veteran]

Here's a brief story of my experience. Now, I'm not going to tell you who my former employer was, since that job experience occupies a large portion of my resume, and since I want to maintain good relations with them. So, my previous employer's identity is a secret. Like what Tom Cruise says in the movie "Top Gun": "That's classified. I could tell you, but I would have to kill you."

But anyway, my employer had both Western & Chinese management. In the past, it had a segregated management system where the Chinese manage the Chinese and the Westies manage the Westies. But later, as the company grew with multiple locations, they desegregated the management system, which I agreed with in principle and which worked out O.K. in some of the locations, especially whenver there was Chinese manager who was liberal and understands Westerners. But our city-level director was very traditional, and that created a lot of friction. The more power she got over the Western teachers and managers, the more that morale plummeted. Many teachers compared her to the Empress Dowager Ci Xi of the late Qing Dynasty. The common saying was, "The W Brothers pump money into the company, but the Empress Dowager is the one who actually runs it."

Basically, this Empress Dowager is a classical traditional manager who hires relatives, exercises her power without principle, and makes unpopular policy decisions with little regard to employees' rights. For example, her cousin, who has no college education and very little English ability, manages the flagship school, while her buddy who used to spy on other managers and staff, yet also has no college and little English, is managing one of the schools in the suburbs. In the past, the location Chinese managers were liberal, creative, and clicked well with Westerners. But since then, they have been replaced by the Empress Dowager's loyal henchmen (or actually henchwomen). And on top of that, the Empress Dowager often took petty revenge whenever Western teachers & managers criticized her management and made her "lose face."

And that's just the tip of the iceberg. While nickeling and diming the employees, the Empress Dowager invests a fortune on glass doors, ridiculous name tags, time card clocks, and hideous yellow uniform shirts. Its just like when the real Empress Dowager took funds for upgrading the Chinese navy and spent the money instead on a useless marble boat in the middle of a pond. And there's more and more and more.

But anyway, I'm sure many of you have similar experiences.

[Roger]

Sometimes, a Chinese employer shows generosity and solicitousness;
for example he might try to broker a liaison with a member of the opposite sex. One of my bosses even took me along on his womanising trips without his wife, during which time he showed himself from his most generous side.
But he was like most Chinese - a lot of verbal smoke, and hardly any action! Promises were routinely made, and almost as routinely forgotten.
At the same time, he liked to see himself worshipped. It was often my job to introduce him to Chinese as "The General Manager"; once he referred to himself in the presence of his staff as a "god".

I wish Chinese men could be more realistic, less delusional, less grandiloquent.
I wish they could defer to reason and law rather than expecting everybody to accept their whims and arbitary decisions.

[Dalian Veteran]

This is going to sound strange. But anyway, after I came back to the States, I watched the Mel Brooks movie "History of the World Part One." By far the cheesiest and corniest part of the film was the scene depicting the Spanish Inquisition where they are dancing and kicking their legs up while singing "We're the inquisition! We're the inquisition!" All at the tune of shmaltzy Broadway-like music. Well, later that night, I had a dream of this scene, but this time it was all the traditional Chinese managers and staff that I had known, kicking up their legs and singing, "We're traditional! We're traditional! We'll screw you in everyway we can!" All to the tune of that shmaltzy Broadway-type music.

Pretty weird stuff, huh? That's messed up. But then I woke up and released that I was back in the States with a pretty good job, promising myself never to be employed in China again until I get an M.B.A.

Speaking of M.B.A. - if you have Chinese students planning to study abroad, tell them to go for the MBA. China has plenty of engineers, scientists, and computer programmers. What China needs most is better management. What good are hi-tech skills if you don't have good management?

[Redfivestandingby]

I just recently had problems with my school due to management. So that's probably skewed my perspective on this. The last answer seems the more PC one but in my heart it's choice A all the way.

[struelle]

[Dalian Veteran]

Good posts.

I was also wondering, has anybody had to deal with foreign upper management that have been in China so long that they develop traditional characteristics? In my school, it was not only the Empress Dowager that contributed to morale problems, but also this British so-called "H.R. expert" who lacks people skills and is prone to temper tantrums. Its this Sino-British management pair that caused most of the morale problems when I was an assistant manager at one of the locations. Most of the teachers gripe about these two more than they do about anybody else. The British guy was fine during the first year, but after while, he really became a classical Ebeneazor Scrooge. Whenever I see him, the words "Bah-humbug" are the first things that come to mind.

I lived in China for three and a half years, but when it comes to management, I'm still deeply rooted in some the principles I was raised with. Provided I wasn't perfect either, as I lost my motivation during the third year and spent most of my work time surfing the web and neglecting my duties. But during my entire three and a half years, I never got any feedback whatsoever, both in teaching and in management. There was nothing that really motivated me or challenged me. I sort of became like the starring character in the 1999 Mike Judge movie "Office Space." The only time you got feedback in my school was if a customer complains or if you piss off the wrong person. Is that common in your schools, too?

[Dalian Veteran]

Here's an idea:

Foreign teachers can organize a labor union. That may sound like a far-fetched idea in China, but actually, it could possibly work given that the authorities are often conscious of China's image as an open country under the reform and openning up policy. Of course, that may not be a good idea for public schools, but for private English language training schools, some of the authorities could possibly go for such an idea given their bias that private schools are businesses that cheat Chinese parents of their money. In order for such a movement to be successful, there would have to be hundreds or at least a thousand FTs organizing the movement all across China. If just a few FTs got together, the movement would be dead from the beginning.

This may sound far-fetched. But if there was such a thing, that would really improve teaching quality in China. If a labor union isn't feasible, the foreign teachers should at least be able to use an education lobby group that sends delegates to the Chinese People's Political Consultative Congress, China's top political advisory body (often unfairly called a toothless advisory body by the Western media), so that they can present their views to the central government and National People's Congress for passing legislation on basic labor laws concerning foreign workers. Currently, the law doesn't even recognize our existence. We're at the mercy of our employers. Foreign teachers' labor rights are still just a courtesy, not a written law.

[Roger]

That's not a feasible way, mate! Labour unions in the PRC are strictly the business of the GOvernment and the PC. There is but one union, and it takes its orders from the Zhongnanhai complex in Peking. Foreigners? They are slaves in a system that does not respect them and what they have to offer.
Four modernisations? Yes, but the Chinese edefinition of 'education' does not square with a realistic concept of it.
We are here in a token capacity, not to enhance the system! We are lending this system more credibility than it deserves!
Why else do Chinese decide who passes English exams, not us?
And wy do CHinese decide what, and how we should teach???

[Dalian Veteran]

Hey everybody! I thought more and more people would rant with this post, being a hot topic and all. Maybe being in China for three and a half years tends to enhance one's disgruntledness towards traditional management, whereas one-year or half-year contract newbies tend to look at things more positively. Plus, many of the teachers around me complained a lot because they chose my employer specifically because they wanted a Western employer, only to be disappointed later. On top of that, my Chinese wife had bad experiences with traditional management when she worked at the airport. So, this may have skewed my view of traditional management a little.

So, is it just me being negative, or is traditional Chinese management really an issue of concern?

[Roger]

Dalian Veteran,
what would you call 'traditional" Chinese management?
To me, it's a contradiction in terms or a paradoxon. The Chinese I come across do not seem to have "traditional" management methods. What defines a Chinese manager is his or her aloofness, his poor communication competence, his inaccessibility. In other words: he makes decisions but does not ponder over the details. He sees the goal but not the steps leading there. He is in it for the money but he forgets whom he owes money for whaqt. He advertises but he forgets to plan. His mugshot is on every flyer, but he can't be found when things get out of hand. He makes rules but he does not care about national laws.
His secretary does not know where he is and his foreign visitors have to wait, wait and then wait some more.

[NumberOneSon]

[Dalian Veteran]

You know what, I'm sort of freaking out here. I just realized that it is possible that my former employer may have seen these posts and guessed my identity. The foreign bosses often check Dave's ESL Cafe. Unlike the short-term teachers who come to China to travel and play, I intend to put this long China experience on my resume. But probably, my former bosses are too busy at this time of the year. Usually by now, they are simultaneously preparing for the winter term and having to cover classes after the second wave of disgruntled teachers quit, if the past turnover rate is an indicator. But just in case they are not busy, I want to write this dislaimer:

"Hey guys, no hard feelings. Actually, I have nothing against the company, the CEO, or most of the other upper management. I also had positive experiences worth remembering as well, plus without you, I wouldn't have had this China experience to begin with. The only two individuals I disagreed with were the ones whom I have given the call-signs "Empress Dowager" and "Mr. H.R." Right now, I'm just releasing pent up frustration from the past and expressing myself with this new freedom after having returned to the States. But I wanted to do it without burning bridges, which is why I never released the identity of the company or school. Basically, I'm just getting this out of my system. Also, my post was about Chinese management practices in general, rather than stabbing at any particular school. If any readers guessed the company's identity, my sincere apologies. But probably only insiders would be able to guess. But anyway, I hope we're still buds. Take care."

To all the outsiders, this message might seem like a nuissance, but I didn't want to e-mail them, or they'd guess my identity for sure. Plus, there's the chance that they never caught these posts from the beginning.

[Peter]

Since corruption is so deeply rooted in China, mamagement practices numerous practices:
No one is trusted
Money is checked three or four times in a chain of people; it ensures that foreigners are never paid on time.

Planning is ad hoc
Cooperation is unknown, the boss decides
Professional competence is a variable factor since there are no national independent bodies to lift and set a srtandard; no trade unions.

Party meddling is everywhere, the latest sign was an attempt of the ex Shenzhen mayor to streamline admin; he now is the vice gov of Hunan.
The planned system eliminated the power of the party

We could be grateful for the chaos; China is one of the easiest countries to get into and work illegally without any adoo, try to do so anywhere else you are in deep trouble indeed.

Getting into NZ for the same purpose; disguished as a tourist; 4 months waiting, then be in trouble soon for working illegally.
Here I go to HK and get a year's worth of living in one day.