Job Discussion Forums

[DMPT]

Hey,

I've a TEFL, a TESOL (both from Thailand) and an online TEFL (I did just to see what I'd be getting into before doing a course). I've a one year national certificate in Businees Studies from an Irish college and about 3 years Teaching experience between Thailand and China. I don't have a degree though.

Obviously the top jobs in the M.E. are out, but are there jobs out there for people with a few years experience but not a degree?

I'm a 28 year old (white - if that matters - it does in Thailand!) Irish national. Over the next few years I'll hopefully do a CELTA followed by a DELTA.

I've spent about a year in Egypt and Israel in my late teens so know a bit about living there.

So are there jobs out there for people without degrees, even if they are the lower end of the market, or is it absolutely essential to have one to organise a full-time job?

Thanks.

[Cleopatra]

Do a search on this site - if you don't have a degree, you won't get a job in the Gulf. Even if you find an employer willing to take you (and any employer who would take a degree-less teacher would be a lousy one) it's unlikely that the relevant embassy would grant you a visa. The fact that you dont' even have a genuine TEFL cert is obviously not going to help either. The situation may be different in the less wealthy, non-Gulf Arab nations, but I'm not familiar with them.

[scot47]

I have known of people without degrees getting low-level teaching piosts in KSA, but they were altready in kingdom as dependants of someone working here.

The rule is generally : no degree - no teaching job.

As you would have seen if you had tried a search.

I cannot see how spending time in Israel has pepared you for the Gulf !

[mishmumkin]

Someone on this board recently got a decent offer for work in Dubai with a salary that was higher than what I made as a BA holding, non-qualified teacher in the UAE. That said, this poster had a good bit of relevant experience in the region and is wrapping up the bachelors/teaching credential in the next year. So...possible? Normally I would say "no," but there are some very rare exceptions. Sorry to say that your experience and credentials do not seem to be enough to be one of those exceptions.

[Mia Xanthi]

I agree with the others that the problem is not finding the job, but getting a visa without a degree. Most countries will not issue a work visa unless you can prove you have the relevant qualifications. (I guess this is to prevent people from "hiring" you as a teacher and then putting you to work as a taxi driver.) The relevant qualification for any teacher is at minimum a BA, so you would not be eligible for a work visa. Were you to come here as a dependent, you would most likely find work.

If you had a BA in anything plus the DELTA, you would be qualifed for some good jobs here in the Gulf.

[DMPT]

Cheers.

[orangepeel1]

DMPT

Have you ever considered Lebanon? It is a wonderful country despite the political problems...

Just to give you some backgroud, Lebanon is a country where French is (was) the traditional choice as a second language, but times they are a'changin'! Everyone wants to learn English here now! There are just tooons of new English schools opening up, and here, being a native speaker goes a loooong way. You won't be able to get one of the top jobs on your qualifications, but a secondary school position, or work in a language center is certainly an option.

I dont know how you feel about interviews, but Lebanon is a country of haggling and negotiation. If you can sell yourself, if you can prove that despite your qualifications, you can get the job done... it will take you a long way. Ability and experience say alot here... Many times, if you enroll to take the CELTA here, you can work and study at the same time...this will make you more marketable.

Where you want to work will also be a factor. If you are willing to work with younger kids, I can assure you that you can get a job. If you must work at the university level, it may be more difficult. My advice would be to try for a language center or a secondary school in the south. Many people have qualms about South Lebanon but the entire country takes 4 hours to drive across. Nothing is too far away! If you want to go to Beirut everyday, its no big deal. In the south, there arent as many ex-patriots therefore your chances of finding work are much higher...

If you have any questions, or need a push in the right direction... feel free to PM me and I will see what I can do! Good Luck man!

orangepeel1

The fact that you have been to Israel is a problem. I dont know if you can get into this country if you have that stamp on your passport. In case you didn't know, Lebanon and Israel were at war just 2 years ago. You would need to contact the American Embassy here. Its in Awkar.

[Cleopatra]

Lebanon is indeed a wonderful country to visit, but are you sure about the prospects for work there? I know that there is high unemployment in Lebanon, and this, combined with a well-educated workforce, may well mean that it would be very difficult for a foreigner to find work as an English teacher. Of course, that's only a presumption on my part, and could well be wrong.

[orangepeel1]

Oops! Thats right, the poster is Irish... well then I would suggest contacting the Irish Embassy here (Thanks Cleo)... Actually contacting any Lebanese governmental office is difficult at best. They usually dont have an email address and take ages to get back to you... when they do its in very poor English... actually the chances that your email will be ignored because they can't read it are high.

Cleo- the problems with the job market here are centered on Lebanese and Palestinians alone. The job crisis does not reach into the ex-pat community. The unfortunate truth, well unfortunate for the Lebanese, is that a holder of a western passport will almost always get the job over a Lebanese citizen. My husband, who is Lebanese, has resorted to humiliating measures to bring in a meager salary so you are right in respect to the native people here....The Lebanese have a huge preference for native speakers! Its really something to say, my kids are taught by an American or by a Brit. I had parents fighting to have their kids in my class, and threaten to remove their students from the school if they were not placed with me. They really seek out that perfect accent.... its insane if you ask me...

I've been working here for 2 years, and I visited many times in previous years so I'm fairly familiar with the situation. Like I said, the country is experiencing a shift from French being the dominant second language, to English taking the lead. English teachers are in demand in every city of the country it seems! One could make a living here simply by teaching private lessons! I know 2 gentlemen actually who setup classrooms in their homes and they teach students all subjects from Math to History, all in the English language, from the students' school workbooks. They live comfortably. As most HS graduates here are interested in moving to Canada, UK, USA, or the Gulf, they all realize that English is a must. Not to mention those who must pass TOEFL or SAT requirements...

Lastly, with the 2006 war and other political strikes, a large portion of the working ex-pat community left Lebanon. Since then, the demand for native speaking English teachers has risen a great deal. I have had so many different types of offers this year, and as some of you might know, I do not have the qualifications that one might think necessary to teach in a reputable institution... however I do So... if anyone has questions about the ins and outs of finding a good position here... PM me. Ive had a lot of good advice and help on this board so Im more than willing to return the favor! Good luck to all!

orangepeel1

[Cleopatra]

[orangepeel1]

Cleo- technically you are right about the Israel stamp on DMPTs passport... but I don�t think there is a place on earth where the rules bend more than they do in Lebanon. Here it�s ALL about who you know. You can get anything and everything you want if you know the right people. I�m not saying its right, I�m just saying anything is possible. If DMPT got a school interested in him, and they had a well connected contact in the Ministry of Ed, as most schools do here, stings could be pulled so to speak. That is how many teachers can work here without the same level of qualifications that other teachers have.

You said that you think it would be odd for DM to contact his own Embassy. That would be odd in any other country�Things are done in a roundabout way in this place. If he calls the Lebanese Embassy, he won�t likely find anyone who speaks English well enough to answer a question concerning a matter like this. (Granted, that is that he actually gets someone on the phone!) They will possibly tell him, no way -to whatever it is, when that is not actually the case. There�s no such thing as a no here�my students remind me of that daily, although I try to convince them otherwise! His embassy, which is used to the chaos that is Lebanon, will naturally have the answers to questions that are commonly asked by confused visitors or would-be visitors to the region. And you can trust me on that one because I�ve been employed here, married here, I immigrated to the US with a citizen from here, I was widowed here, I applied for various visas here, and I applied for residency here� the list does not end there!

As for the teachers I know�.some are married to Lebanese and some are not. I was not married when I began working in Lebanon. The school or center that employs you will provide for your work permit here... and this is so very common!!! You are way off track when you say, I don�t understand why the government would issue permits for a job that a local could do....First of all, THE language was French here until very recently...like I said.... There are not enough English teachers to match the level of demand for them. And also, there is a certain level of prestige that comes with being a native speaker, not for us obviously, but towards the reputation of the school� The point I�m trying to make is, that here, the locals who teach English are not sufficient in the eyes of the employers. Just to be clear, I don�t agree with this practice, but I�m not going to get into a debate on the pros and cons of being a native-speaking English teacher vs. one who learned the language�

This is all solely based on my personal experience�so take it or leave it!

[DMPT]

It's ok, I've gotten a new passport since then. Thanks, it's interesting reading.

[miski]

You will get a job in Kuwait , no problem. And most of the employers are 'lousy' so don't worry on that score- the job is what you make of it.
Go online and get a list of schools ( Kuwaitiah.net) and write or phone them directly, or check the tes.co.uk site. Even if the ad specifies degree, write anyway, what the heck.

Many people here working for the more reputable schools would like to have you believe that their school only employs ''qualified staff'', but I can name you at least 3 people at each of these 'reputable schools' who haven't got more than GCEs or BTEC....

Schools however to completely avoid as they are way up there on the lousyometer are :

KNES-
ABS
FBS

Also, private language institutions here may be interested. try BITE.

(PS They love the Irish- oh and I am qualified , before someone sharpens the knives ..... )

[miski]

Here's one but I would get their e mail / number and call them directly
( cut out Mr Middleman)

Primary School Teacher

Gulf English School, Kuwait

Will they delete this?

(MOD edit... yes they will)

[scot47]

You should accept that for those without a university degree, it is VERY difficult. Get a degree.