Job Discussion Forums

[Haft]

I'm an American, soon to be recognized as an Italian citizen in March or thereabouts, I have a Bachelor's of Arts in Philosophy, I have a graduate certificate (not degree) in paralegal studies and I have been drafting post-judgment legal documents for a law firm for the last year and a half. Is the CELTA, in addition to all of that, enough to expect a decent salary? (I definitely don't want to wait in getting started once the citizenship comes through.) Or is it just hopeless these days? I'm single, will definitely have no dependents. I have quite good savings. Ownership of a vehicle is pretty doubtful. I'm not sure where to get an international driver's license either way. I like books though, being able to enjoy all that philosophical literature in the original is probably going to be irresistible. I'm not interested in remaining single. So there's another money pit. I am of course willing to consider other careers, though savings opportunities in countries where EFLing makes sense financially have a definite long term appeal. Besides, what could a guy with the above background do besides go back to school all over again? Unless a "fachidiot" really does have the opportunity in Germany to take remedial trigonometry and someday become a chemist. That'd be cool. I really just want to go to learn German as best as possible though (for the philosophy). I have started already, and I do have a good grasp of the grammar.

[spiral78]

The economy's generally weak these days, and English lessons are usually considered a bit of a luxury in the business community. So, salaries for teachers at the newbie, private-school level are pretty low (this is where most students are businesspeople, and is by far the main market for newbie level teachers Europe-wide).

The credentials needed to get more stable/lucrative positions in universities, international schools, and the like are high - related MA + fluent German + local connections....

Count on it being subsistence-level only, and any little extra will be gravy for you.

[BerlinCELTA]

In addition to what spiral 78 says, you should be clear that the idea of getting a position in ELT/EFL in Germany which gives you a "salary" in the traditional sense is unrealistic, even if you hold EU citizenship, as very few schools find it viable to employ teachers.

Therefore working in ELT in Germany means working freelance, with the income variability that this entails. What is certain is that very few schools which pay middle-range and up will work with a teacher without qualifications in ELT, so investing in some form of certified and recognised teacher training, if only for this reason of professional entry and financial leverage, makes a lot of sense.

Of course, this is to take as given the good of being trained to teach in its own right, from both the point of view of the teacher and that of the learner.

And, of course, being a CELTA tutor based in Germany, I would say this, so consider the above comments with this in mind! Partiality aside, If you want to work in ELT, even for a short while and even as a "side-line to pay the bills", it really is in your interests to get trained, whether it be with Cambridge ESOL or another board.

Hope this helps.

[Kootvela]

[Sansibar1]

Hi Kootvela,

A university position in Germany means a fixed salary (a pretty good one), help with all the necessary documents, and high level students.

I have a good friend working as a business English lecturer at the University of Bamberg and he's always talking about how much he loves the job.
The difficulty is getting such a position. Like spiral78 said, very good German skills and a related MA are a must. My friend had first applied for a position at the University of Magdeburg and they actually held the interview in German!

[spiral78]

I've got a university position just across the Dutch border (in Netherlands). I'm extremely lucky to have had the local connections and reputation here to land this rare position (and also have 12 years of experience - 7 at uni level- and an MA TESL/TEFL).

Count my blessings daily. These jobs are few and far between.

[Haft]

Maybe I should have said "decent wage"? I misswrote what I really meant. It would be premature to get a master's in a field I haven't even started in the first place.

[spiral78]

Sorry, not trying to talk you into an MA! Just that salaries come with the jobs that require them, as I think you realize.

Decent wage...well, you can probably scrape by these days. Really, the German economy is officially in recession and newbie-level teaching salaries haven't been exactly keeping pace with inflation over the past several years already.

Really, it's just scraping by. You might get lucky and get something a bit better, but if you're going to do it, be realistic. It's subsistence level.

[Haft]

I still think I might give it a go. I have been hoping and praying for a totally legitimate way of just going there and staying there. So once I have gotten there I will want to stay (at least for a year or so, possibly plenty years more).

[spiral78]

Well, digging yoursefl in is the best way to ultimately end up with something good. It takes more than one year, usually, but if you are really committed to the area and willing to pay the necessary dues, you're likely to make it work out somehow long-term.

The key is your EU citizenship- without that, your chances would decrease dramatically