Job Discussion Forums

[Newfoundland]

Just your general do you know of it and if so what have you heard?

[MyTurnNow]

What kind of Rockies are you talking about???

MT

[Newfoundland]

Rockies English School in Dalian pardon the confusion.

[latefordinner]

I don't know anyone who has worked there, but Rockies started advertising aggressively this summer past. It seems to be just another sausage factory/ language mill. A lot of new schools have opened in DL recently, its possible that they just now have the enrollment to justify hiring an FT. Dalian Vet would be more likely to know if anyone has worked there yet. If you're the first FT, then caveat emptor. If things go as badly as possible, the upside is that the market here is constantly in flux, so a new job isn't impossible to find

[Dalian Veteran]

I've never heard of this one. It must have started as I was leaving.

But I would be really careful about the private language schools in Dalian, especially the locally-managed ones. Too many teachers have had bad experiences there. Generally, Dalian is an excellent place to live and a good place to make friends. But working there is another story. If I were you, I would go for one of the foreign-managed schools, which are a little better. The unversities don't pay well but they generally treat their foreign guests very well. Many of the private language schools in Dalian were started by rookie entrepreneurs who just want to make money. The worst one I've heard of was called "New Century." I've never worked at that one, but my school had cases of many defectors leave that school and beg us for employment. The defectors said that the management there behaves like mafia thugs, never respects the contract, and even hires 19-year-old kids with only a high school diploma to be English teachers.

As for my former employer, it wasn't the worst, but it wasn't the best either. I won't reveal the identity of my employer since I want to keep this past experience on my resume and may need contact references. It is basically a large chain of Sino-U.S. English schools with both foreign and Chinese management, and the benefits package was pretty good by Dalian standards. However, the problem was in the city-level management of the company's Dalian schools, managed by a traditional Chinese manager whom we referred to as the "Empress Dowager." During my last year there, the management was basically a Charlie Foxtrot (military acronym for "cluster f_ck"), with high teacher turn-over rates and a disorganized mess compounded by a boss-heavy organization and many staff who are relatives hired by guanxi. When SARS hit, it showed all the symptoms of a dying regime.

[rick_martin_78]

...just be wary. Shop around and try for a shorter 6 month contract, and extend if you like the place. Every school seems to have it's extra-cirricular muck... Never met a laowai with no complaints about his/her school.

and yes, new century - not so good...

but as a former dalian Newf, I recommend it highly. Aside from the chilly winter...
good luck.

[yvechina]

Hey..... I wonder if Rockies School belongs to Goldens brother....remember him, Rick???

[JamesD]

They started recently. (Co-)Owned by a Canadian who worked for the same school as Dalian Vet. Small school near the stadium with 1 or 2 FTs. The school is actually in a hotel. I have no specific info on working for them but do know that they pay lower than the Dalian average and have a high turnover.

[Newfoundland]

I have phone interviews setup with rockies and AES in the upcoming days. I am on my way back to Dalian after spending close to 6 months there 2 yrs ago. I started my teaching at " New Century" and let me just say Dalian Vet hit it right on the head about them. Had a much better situation at Wall Street in Beijing. I just wanted to start back in the PRC in familiar surroundings and when i was there AES seemed to be the most solid of all the schools around. So if all goes well I should be at AES and Daves bar just before the start of the Winter Intensive.

[Dalian Veteran]

My advice to you: go for AES. I've heard from other teachers that, if you're going to work for a private school in Dalian, that's the one to go. But if you ever deal with their Chinese city manager or British human resources director, extreme tact is necessary. Don't piss off those two individuals, and everything will be fine. I've heard that the best locations are #1, #2, #3, & #4.

From what I heard from other teachers at Dave's Bar, be mentally prepared for the following things:

(1) If their pay policy hasn't changed, I believe the salary is prorated for vacations and holidays and that 6,000 RMB is only a theoretical amount. But don't quote me on that, they may have changed their pay policy. Anyway, even if they haven't changed the policy, it's still better than the other schools, because your taxes and rent are not taken out of the salary. Your salary is your take-home cash. Rent, tax, and health insurance are paid by the school.

(2) Overtime pay for substitutions only comes if you substitute on a day off (which you have a right not to substitute if you don't want to) or if your total hours aggregated for the whole month exceeds the hours/month (based on hours/week rate) stated on your contract. So if you are under hours and are substituting on a work day, don't be disappointed if you don't get extra pay for it.

(3) Expect a long lag time before housing problems are taken care of. Also, expect a lag time for other things, too, as the city-level office functions like a bureaucracy. Communication is often lacking.

(4) The upper management may, from time-to-time, introduce policies that are not very popular to the teaching corps, such as once-a-term presentation classes and double-weekend make-up classes. But what ever you do, don't blame your foreign location manager. He or she is a middle manager and has little say in changing the directives from above. If you take issues to the upper management, be polite and tactful, and try not to be too blunt, even when talking to the foreign upper management, who have been there so long that they are just like the Chinese as far as face is concerned.

But other than that, it should be a great school to work for, and many of the T.A.s are very friendly and will go above and beyond in helping you. It is certainly better than the other private language schools in Dalian. If you have to work for a private language school in Dalian, that is the one to go for. It won't be totally like working for a Western company, even though it is actually American-owned, but it is still better than the other alternatives. (Place it in the context that Chinese labor laws don't really cover foreigners and that our rights are really just a courtesy, not a law.)And read the contract so that you know what you are getting yourself into.

[Dalian Veteran]

Another add-on to the above post:

The city director has placed loyal henchmen (or henchwomen) in most of the locations. So be tactful to any Chinese staff that you talk to. Many of them were hired through guanxi. But that's the same for other schools and companies in China as well. That's a China-wide phenomenon. Where most teachers go wrong is that they are under the illusion of working for a Western company, exercising their Western-style bluntness, when the school actually has many Chinese characteristics. Use the same caution that you would in Chinese-managed schools, and think the worst. Then, your experience there will exceed your expectations and turn out fairly positive.

[Dalian Veteran]

Another thing to keep in mind about AES:

This actually applies to most private language schools in China and is probably nothing new to you, since you have already worked at private language schools before. But anyway, when it comes to overhead costs, they will often go above and beyond in keeping the costs down. Many of the Western teachers use the word "cheap" to describe it. Whether its about photocopies, use of paper, reimbursement for transportation when sent to a far-away location, finding apartments, charging extra if you don't want a roommate, supplying teaching resources, the size of the staff room, etc., etc., their cost-cutting may seem extreme by Western standards. And generally, air conditioning is installed in classrooms and places for customers, but the staff rooms are like an after-thought. But once again, most schools and companies do this in China, and it might even be worse in other schools. The only way you can teach in the same conditions as in the West is if you had a Master's in Education and worked for one of the high-class schools in Beijing or Shanghai, or the Maple Leaf school in Dalian.

On a positive note: some of the information I provided might be outdated. I've heard they have a new assistant city manager, a young American guy who is one of the CEO's favorites. I don't know him very well, but he seems pretty cool. My hope is that with him, there will be more intercultural checks and balances to their conservative Chinese city manager, and thus better teacher morale. But don't quote me on that. That's just an educated guess. Their previous assistant city manager, an older Canadian guy, was also pretty cool, but the company kept him so busy with the recruiting that the city manager was given free reign to rule the empire as she saw fit. So maybe things will be better. I've also heard they have a "teacher's advocate", which enables foreign teachers to air their grievances through a mediator so that they can complain without pissing off the people in power.

[Dalian Veteran]

Another positive thing about AES:

They don't discriminate against non-white teachers. They also hire overseas Chinese and black teachers. If the ignorant customers complain, the staff generally tries its best to explain that these are bona-fide native English speakers with standard pronunciation, and that the individuals were born and raised in the countries where they have citizenship. So for minorities, AES is definitely the place to go to. The overseas Chinese generally get by without complaints whenever the parents ask them questions in Chinese and find that the teacher can't speak Chinese, or that the teacher's Chinese pronunciation "sounds very white." At first, students will feel hesitant in having a non-white teacher, but once they get to know the teacher and about his/her life back in the home country, they know that he/she is really an American, Canadian, Australian, British, etc. So, those other schools that have discriminatory hiring practices cannot use customer demand as a valid excuse.

[MyTurnNow]

I did NOT have a good experience with a foreign-managed chain English mill being discussed in this thread. IMHO I was dealt with very dishonestly, and I am not alone in this experience. I absolutely cannot recommend working there. They have a history of suppressing negative comments (even this one may not stand long!); I will send a bit more in a PM.

Oh, by the way, please make sure you receive a Z Visa at any school you sign on with anywhere. Some schools bring in a lot of people on tourist or business visas, especially for intensive sessions. Not having a Z visa makes you illegal migrant labor in a communist country; you will probably not be exactly beaten over the head with this information by most employers.

Unfortunately by and large the only really decent employers in Dalian are the universities...I have heard good things recently about a private school there called 'Talenty'.

MT

[gmat]

FWIW:
Regarding a certain school in Dalian that people are talking about: I was out with a few teachers from this school and they would probably give Dalian Vet one of these for his positive posts.

Having said that, I do not know of any good private schools here to recommend. I work at a uni here. MyTurnNow has recent and direct experience.