Job Discussion Forums

[kiaoi]

I have been planning to go to Taiwan with my partner to teach English. She has been offered some jobs through agencies but from the postings we decided to go to Taiwan and look for a job that way as we thought it would be better. However we didn't consider the fact that my chances may be hindered by my appearance (asian looking. This is all news to me, after reading the other post "Employment and Ethnicity" and also contacting some agencies I have become quite concerned at my chances of employment as a teacher. I was told by an agency for a Korean school that they had never been successful in finding a job for someone non-caucasain. I do thank them for their honesty.

I am male (apparently this is bad also as teaching is viewed as a female profession), 24 y.o graduate Australian but was born in Laos. I regard myself as being a native english speaker however a school from China has rejected me without even talking to me on where I was born.

We have already purchased a return ticket to Thailand and were going to buy another ongoing one from Bangkok to Taipei when we get there, but now this is a bit uncertain. I would like to hear your views on whether I have a chance in finding a job in Taiwan, and if not Taiwan what's the next best country for a job? My qualifications include tutoring and some teaching experience in Thailand, also a double degree in engineering/business.

Kiao

[brian]

Its not clear from your post whether you have a passport from an English speaking country - if you do then you at least qualify for employment as English teacher here in Taiwan. Not having this minimum document does not proclude you from getting a job as a teacher, but would make it next to impossible. If you don't have this documentation then I would advise against coming here to work as an English teacher unless you have your heart set on it.

Your appearance will make it difficult to get a job but not impossible. Your gender won't make too much difference as the majority of foreign English teachers do seem to be male.

It is wise to avoid dealing with recruiters if you can avoid it. Having said that, there is one recruiter that seems to get quite a good rap. His name is Christopher and he is based in Australia. It seems that you are from Australia and therefore he might be worth contacting. His company is Australian Academic Circle (AAC).

If you choose to come here by yourself you shouldnt find too much trouble in getting a job. Yes, it will prove more difficult than if you were the atypical caucasian - but not impossible. Dont let rejections get you down. Whilst it is clearly racial discrimmination in practice, the parents of the students in the schools are often concerned about being charged for a foreigner while being given a local teacher. You should do fine.

[kiaoi]

Thanks for your insight Brian. Very helpful! Yes, I have an Australian passport.

[Therkiel]

[matchstick_man]

Your wife has the possibility of working illegaly (like most of us do for at least one month). The easy solution is enrolling in Chinese lessons but it will eat into her earnings.

[Aristotle]

I am sorry to tell you this but you will have a dificult time finding work and you will most likely be forced to accept a much lower wage than your WASP co-workers regaurdless of your qualifications.
Sorry but far too many of the people on Taiwan are racist idiots and many of those are goverment officials.
A

[brian]

Kiaoi - Aristotle makes a good point about the wages, but you can avoid this problem. Generally speaking some schools will offer returning or overseas Chinese a 'Chinese teacher' or 'full time' teaching position at the school in order to take advantage of your English language abilities, without paying you the full amount that you deserve. The fact that you are originally from Laos, and I assume do not speak Chinese, should actually work in your advantage as they won�t be able to take advantage of you so easily.

Stick to your guns about wages and you will get the standard wage that you deserve which should be NTD530 and up to start with.

Therkiel - You may have some problems for your wife to get a job teaching English. Even with a Finnish passport she should be able to get a job provided that her English is good enough to pass as a native speaker. The fact that she doesn�t have a degree will almost definitely put an end to any chance that she has of getting any legal work as an English teacher. I agree with matchstick_man that she could work illegally, but this would not be the best for either of you I wouldn�t think.

You might be best to pursue a spousal ARC and visa for her if at all possible and then see if she can pick up some work when she gets here - maybe doing something other than teaching English. A student visa may also prove suitable if she is interested in studying Chinese.

[TaoyuanSteve]

I would consider carefully whether or not it's worth coming here. I agree with "Aristotle" on this one. Schools here are looking for a white face. Period. This is the main qualification for work over here (Oh, yeah. It also helps if you're young and attractive). This, of course, is totally absurd considering the large non-white populations of most English speaking nations. But I don't think teaching ability or qualifications get factored into hiring over here too often. It's my opinion that your wife "sans" degree/ native speaker ability and/ or English speaking country passport would find it easier to get a job over here than you. Ironic/ moronic? Yes. Also, I don't know that I'd agree that your not being Chinese would be advantageous to you. I arrived here with my foreign born Chinese girlfriend fully prepared to support her off my salary because I feared she would be unemployable. I needn't have worried. She works for a foreigner owned buxiban that requires Chinese ability (no co-teachers) and gets paid handsomely. I know another ABC who also makes a bundle. I never see any other non-white westerner races teaching, however. I think the only way to get around the white thing is to be a foreign born ROC citizen who can also speak Mandarin (even then some schools won't even interview you). I don't want to come across as being excessively negative and discouraging; I don't want to sugar coat the racist reality of this place either. Seriously reconsider your plans.

[kiaoi]

SIGH,
Alas.... it is all too late, tickets are booked, my partner has accpeted her job and we will just have to see it through. Thanks for the warning TaoyuanSteve.

[TaoyuanSteve]

Good luck to both of you. Write in to give us your impressions when you get here.

[Mozilla]

It will be tough, but not impossible for you to get a job. From my experience, the schools that are willing to discriminate against you based on race are schools you DON NOT want to work for anyway. So look at it that way...

[daily chai]

FYI, I'm in Taipei and just called a school advertising on Tealit.com. The contact person had trouble understanding that I was an American, so I said "wo shi mei guo ren" (I'm American). Then she told me flatly they are looking for foreign teachers (American is still foreign), *NOT* ABC's. (American-born Chinese, for those who don't know.) Ugh. I'm not ABC, but it's just another example of the racism encountered here. Reminds me of the "No Irish/Italian Need Apply/NINA" signs my ancestors faced in America.
Last night I interviewed for a job where they asked for my age, height and weight on the application. Hey, it ain't America. Just come with that in mind. HTH!

[TaoyuanSteve]

Discrimination is more widespread than some think. Even the "good" companies do it. This was what my girlfriend and I experienced. I blame the school companies less than the parents. Parents want to see a white face. That's why the companies so heavily favor them.

It won't be impossible for the original poster to find work. That's true. It's good that he is coming with someone who will more easily find work. He can take a little more time to find work himself. Or they can come as a package and work for the same company. It is true however, that he will most likely experience greater difficulty in securing a job and quite possibly forms of discrimination even once hired (You're a director at a cram school. You've opened a new class. Which foreign teacher do you assign to this class? The young blonde white guy that the kids and parents will love or the Asian-looking guy who, in the parents' view, isn't sufficiently foreign? Bear in mind it's a competitive market. There's always "ABC mei yu" down the street ready to scoop your students.). It's not all bleak, though. My girlfirend has won over alot of parents through merit and hard work. I imagine "kiaoi" can do so, too. But the way things are done here is pretty far from fair. Let's face it.

[alfetta]

[TaoyuanSteve]

I wonder if one of the origins of the white only unofficial policy is the local people's great distrust for each other. People here distrust government and business people far more than people do back home. I think there's a good reason for this; these people very seldom can be trusted. I think looking for a white face is one of the only means parents, who often don't speak English, have of ensuring their kids are studying with a genuine native speaker and not simply a local who claims to be one. In this place it wouldn't be much of a stretch for the imagination to envision locals with poor English ability applying for jobs as native speakers if, in fact, they could. Of course there is always the freak show, kids-staring-at-you-and-pulling-your-arm-hair-fascination-with-caucasions reason for whites only, too. Whatever the reasons, it is unfortunate that capable people are kept out of this line of work here.