Job Discussion Forums

[daniel_hayes]

I am in the 3rd year of an English Lit degree in the UK. When I graduate, teching English as a foreign lanuage seems the most likely option.

However, I also hope to study for an MA. A few good Universities in the UK offer distance learnin and online MA courses.

This would allow we to travel, live abroad, and continue my studies. But I need a country that:

- Is interesting to live and work in
- Decent earning potential
- Decent lifestyle
- Availability of part time work

Is Taiwan such a place? Ideally, I could work 10-20 hours a week, which would leave me enough time to study.

[Nevermind]

I don't know what school you are thinking about getting your MA from, but a friend of mine got her MA while teaching full time in Taiwan, over the internet. She studied hard and dedicated about 2-3 nights per week to it, and maybe one whole day per weekend while getting the degree, but it was easy, according to her. Now, an online degree may not mean as much in the UK as it does when teaching ESL anywhere, but after she got her MA, she went to the Middle East for several years and made an absolute killing.

So, if you are planning to have ESL be your career. I would go to Taiwan and teach full time after you get your degree. Work on the MA online at your own pace over that time. Stay, enjoy the new culture, be patient work hard through the inevitable problems you will face (it will make you a better person!) and do that for several years. If you are fresh out of college, you will be able to save money/pay down your loans, etc. well in Taiwan, if you manage your money well. In 3 years you should have a nice stash of money again, if you take care of your money well.

Then, you will have experience and an MA, which are REQUIRED 100% to get the best jobs in UAE, Bahrain, Kuwait, etc. Then you can make thousands and thousands in cash, invest it, and when you are 30-35, if you are a smart money handler, you have the possibility of being a very wealthy person. But again, you must have the discipline and dedication to see it through until you have a nice nest egg that will either allow you to keep traveling/teaching overseas, or go back to UK and start a new life/career with a nice stash of cash. Good luck.

[daniel_hayes]

The MA is from a Uni in the UK. I would be interested in working in the ME, some time in the future. So it's good to know than an MA would help.

Just how much could a person save in a year there?

Also, it sounds like your firned had a good experience doing her MA whilst workinf full-time. That has certainly given me food for thought.

[Nevermind]

If you are asking about the Middle East, I am not exactly sure how much total. I just remember she was making somewhere in the 3-4k range per month, no taxes, and had to pay for living expenses and cheap rent, and she was frugal, so I imagine at least 2-2.5k per month. But I did not ask her specifics so I don't know exactly. I have written her recently so if she responds I will ask her specifics. She is still there, but now in Turkey.

In Taiwan, on a similar exchange rate to the USD as of today (about 33:1 NTD to USD) my wife and I saved about 20k USD in one year. This was working our asses off though. We worked 5 days per week from 8-4, 4:30-6 and 2 nights per week teaching private lessons each. So again, you will have to be dedicated and serious about saving money. My wife and I were somewhat relaxed with our money while there spending approx. 7000-8000 NTD (~250 USD) per week on luxuries. But we had our meals provided to us (except Sat and Sun) and our rent paid for by the school. On the weekends we were a little more loose with our cash than we should have been. Lots of beer, movies, TGI Fridays (we made ourselves eat Chinese food 5 days per week free by the school, so we usually ate a western restaurants/pubs on the weekends), Lots of travel throughout the island.

Trust me, in this economy, you would be brilliant to go to Taiwan, work as hard as you can, have fun and get some good teaching experience, deal with the various life and cultural BS, make some great friends and travel buddies, and save, save, save. Once you get your MA, you can go back home, or to the Middle East for a couple of more years, saving even more, and you will have a nest egg that 95% of your friends, people you know never had and never will have. Not to mention just the sheer excitement and crazy experiences you will have on the road. But again, you must be nice person who gets along well with the most difficult people in the world, frugal, industrious, flexible and EXTREMELY street smart to navigate the light and dark sides of teaching ESL overseas.

I would give anything to have the information I am giving you now when I was in my early 20s. I would be a rich man.

[Nevermind]

[daniel_hayes]

[Nevermind]

Yeah, It is a question we all have to struggle with. But please don't mistake this opportunity for being easy. It will be very, very difficult to take the overseas ESL route, no matter where you go, but at the same time could be deeply, deeply rewarding. Not only with teaching, but the new cultures and experiences you will have will be great!

Even on a tight budget, from Taiwan you will be able to travel the island, go to Hong Kong, Thailand, Vietnam, Malaysia, Indonesia and Cambodia with relative ease and low costs, especially if you don't mind staying in hostel type hotels, for next to nothing. So even with saving, you can really enjoy yourself.

Stick with the Taiwan Green beer and oolong tea, eat at your school if and when possible, learn to like hotpot, take Kung Fu classes (I did and loved it), take Chinese classes, find your city's WB Movie Theatre, learn to love ji pi and ji kwai with basil, and the most delicious fruit and fruit drinks, watch out for the jaded, bitter expats (there are lots of wonderful expats but some are the epitome of self absorption and "only out for myself" personalities who are probably nuts, literally, and have taken to overseas work because they have been driven out of their own country or they have driven themselves out of their own country due to other nefarious reasons. YOU MUST WATCH OUT FOR THESE PEOPLE, hence the need for extreme street smarts), and you'll be fine. Let me know if you have anymore questions. I will be glad to help you with whatever little bit of advice I have.

[forest1979]

Can we be realistic before we get carried away.

The OP wants a decent lifestyle on a minimum of 10 hours of work a week? He has to fly from the UK to Taiwan in the midlde of a global recession, just walk into a job, and hey presto earn while he learns! There's a lot of ifs in the story for this to happen.

Why not just stay in the UK and do a MA in the classroom rather than online. Online degrees are not yet accepted as having the same value as 'paper degrees' so why take a chance.

And also how many people just walk into jobs in the Middle East these days. TEFL work there is highly sought after and one of the recent conditions to emerge in the job market is the seemingly mandatory ME work experience. The days of serious money being made in the ME are not as easy or open as it once was. If it were so easy to make big cash everyone would be there, and the fact that everyone isn't speaks for itself.

OP. Don't take any unnecessary risks. You'll be a new graduate amongst many trying to find work in a market that is having problems if you come to Taiwan. Whilst holding a dream is certainly not wrong, just be pragmatic. As I said before you need a hell of a lot of ifs to fall into place, and Taiwan at the moment is neither the place nor time to do it.

[daniel_hayes]

Forest. The cost of an MA in England scares me off. Not only is the tuition fee around �4,000, but rent and expenses for a year is about the same.

MA is self-funded. No tuition-fee loan. I think I would get some kind of maintenance loan, maybe 2-3grand.

I do understand that nothing can replace study in person. However, distance-learning would allow me to keep my discipline in a new place. Live abroad while continuing my study.

Also, the MA I am interested in is of exactly the same value as a regular MA. It is from a good Uni. Saying all that, I am worried that it wouldn't be as effective as staying here for another year.

[forest1979]

What about Career Development Loans? Are they not available now?

Have you contacted your local TEC? I got a grant from them as my region had a high unemployment rate. I wrote a letter and got a grand off them.

[daniel_hayes]

The problem with Career Dev. Loans is that I don't intend on staying in the Uk. If I was the Gov'mt, I wouldn't give me any money.

Can you see a way around this? I could get a bit of help with funding - from hardship loans etc., but that'd only be a few hundred quid. It ain't enough.

If I moved abroad, took a year to set myself up, started the online MA, I could pay the fees (just about can afford that) and support myself by teaching.

[forest1979]

If you move abroad and "set yourself up" you will need to spend a lot before you get any back.

Lets be straight. How will you pay for a plane ticket? The housing deposit? Wont this cost you 1000s? If so, won't you need a loan anyway to pay for it?

What about in Taiwan? How will you afford "a decent lifestyle" on 10 or so hours of teaching at just US$20 an hour? In a place like Taipei it would be very difficult to have a decent lifestyle and be saving on a few hundred $s when you factor in costs of living.

To me you will need to spend a lot before putting money away in the bank.

If I were you I would save up before contemplating what to do. At least it would buy time to fully appreciate what you want to consider. At the moment whatever you want to do will cost you money, which you don't have. Coming to Taiwan as a means to this end will not work out for you. You'll just end up back in the UK even more frustrated and debt ridden than now.

[daniel_hayes]

Forest: I have a bit of money set aside. Somewhere in the region of �10,000. But, this is my stash - to get me started on the rest of my life. To spend 7-8,000 of it getting an MA seems wasteful and unnecessary.

Perhaps even the 3-5,000 it'd cost me to do it by distance-learning is similarly wasteful.

Lots of things to be decided. Thanks for the input.

[forest1979]

Sorry. I just don't understand your logic.

To fork out for a MA, an extra qualification, a higher level qualification, one that will boost your ability to compete in the market place, and one that will enhance your ability to earn a good salary, is "wasteful"! I'm at a loss as to why you posted in the first place.

[daniel_hayes]

I posted because I am confused. At a place of undecision. Hence the changes and strange change of direction.

Apologies.