Job Discussion Forums

[Yes Sir I Can Bogey]

Although not a big fan of TV in HK, I did see an interesting TV show this evening on TVB Pearl at 6:55pm, namely, the Pearl Report. Tonight it examined the NET scheme. Did anyone else see it? Any comments?

[ChrisRose]

Dam I missed it, but I think it repeats. Does anyone know the day the repeat will be on?

Chris

[Honky Nick]

Didn't see it but heard about it. Interested to read people's thoughts.

Saturday 1215, Sunday 1855 and Wednesday 0055

[RiverMystic]

Sunday's Pearl Report on the NET Scheme is now viewable online: http://mytv.tvb.com/news/pearlreport/22168

[Yes Sir I Can Bogey]

http://mytv.tvb.com/news/pearlreport/22168

Excellent! Thanks for that, River!

I just watched it again and have some comments. I'd be interested to hear the thoughts of others.

That South African teacher Benita Smith seems to be fortunate in having a principal who is of the opinion that it is not worth her while making NETs stay for Cantonese-language meetings. In my experience such 'progressive' (ahem) principals are exceedingly rare. Many say they cannot excuse NETs from such meetings, even if they cannot understand a single word, as 'the local teachers would complain'.

The woman Mrs. Smith was seen co-teaching with mentioned that she sometimes works till 12pm or 1am. This may be true, but what worries me is how this is often the mark and measure against which NETs' hours are compared and by which their performance is often evaluated. There are two points here: first, what are they going to do? Advertise the NET scheme in western states with the following, 'Come and work from 7am till 1am six days a week in HK'? How many applicants do they think they would get exactly? What sort of applicant would they get? And why on earth should anyone ever have to work such ridiculous hours? Why is this crazy state of affairs allowed to continue? I doubt if even Li Ka Shing does so many hours. Also, a local teacher may well be at school from 7am till 1am, but are they really working all that time, or are they also having cooked meals out at restaurants, making personal calls, doing online banking, doing mountains of marking (rather than have the students self-correct or do peer correction), and openly sleeping at their desk? Also, I often see such people seemingly go out of their way to create tonnes of work for themselves, often, it seems, in order to to themselves a reason not to go home.

It is mentioned in the Pearl Report that both NETs and local teachers start on HK$22,985, but it then goes on to note that NETs also receive a monthly 'housing allowance' of HK$14,425 (they are in fact incorrect; it is not a 'housing allowance', but a 'special allowance' which most if not all NETs choose to use for rent, but also often for other bills and expenses, too). But, they fail to mention the fact that NETs, as foreigners, are not entitled to public housing like locals and SE Asian immigrants are (and many local teachers do indeed live in public housing with their parents).

And, even if NETs were entitled to such government-supplied housing, how many professional, qualified, experienced teachers from western states would ever want to live there? Again, what are they going to say in the advertisement? 'Come and to HK and spend practically half of your salary on decent, family-sized housing?' After all, if they really want mature and reliable, qualified and experienced teachers from abroad, that is, stable, family people, then they will have to expect such people to expect and demand (by local standards) decent housing. Have these people got any idea just how much a (to a western person) decent, family-sized middle class flat in HK costs these days? It is not as if the top bods at the EDB don't get housing allowance, and they are mostly local! Indeed, they also receive an educational allowance for the express purpose of sending their kids abroad for their education. That's how much they think of the local system in which NETs have to struggle!

I found that Nora Tse � the retired local teacher � to be quite objectionable. So because 'she' (that is, 'her' school) had problems with a few NETs, she is therefore against the NET scheme in all its entirety. The first NET she said they had came in drunk, and the second, a young lady, "had no idea of education", and their third NET "really worked by the clock", saying that he would get up and leave a co-planning meeting when the clock struck 4pm. She seemed to quite proud of the fact that she had sent more than twenty emails to the NET section of the EDB reporting on and complaining about her NET. I wonder if she ever approached him and actually discussed the issues with him in person, as normal adults would be expected to? In fact, even without knowing anything about this case, I do also find myself wondering whether she ever even so much as spoke to him, or any of 'her' other NETs about anything! I just detect some anger in her general demeanor, and some recalcitrant changes in her facial expression at the mere mention of her previous NETs. I wonder whether perhaps she is one of those many, older, (typically unmarried), female, bitter/embittered local teachers who is tangibly insecure in the mere presence of westerners, and indeed, any 'outsiders'. My suspicion is that any managerial 'action' she took would all have been hinter der Kulisse, as it were, i.e., the typical local 'management' style of behind-the-scenes conniving, backstabbing, gossip spreading, and rumour mongering.

I for one of course am not ever going to try to defend anyone going into work drunk, or smelling of alcohol, especially not a school, but I also know of one NET who was hauled in front of a kangaroo court and made to account for himself as a result of being seen on a Sunday afternoon by an unnamed local teacher with a 'young foreign girl of obvious SE Asian descent' openly drinking a beer in public in Lan Kwai Fong. After all, the students could have seen him and the parents 'wouldn't like it'. Did he have a drink problem? Did he find himself having to have a drink? And even if this guy in the Pearl Report did go in hung over, is that really any worse than the local teachers going in to work in their usual 'I have not slept for two days because of all the marking/assignments for my course' daze/stupor?

As for the young lady who it is alleged did not know anything about education, I am sorry but most local teachers I have met can write what they know about education on the back of a postage stamp. As for the guy getting up and leaving a meeting at 4pm despite the fact that not everything was "settled" (I simply love the semi-bellicose vocabulary), was it really a meeting, or was it the normal HK situation in which someone rambles on and hectors for three or four hours � in Cantonese � simply because they have nothing to go home to and/or are frightened of being the first to leave? Left to their own devices they would � and often do � sit there till the cows come home, just going around and around in circles. I was at one such 'meeting' once, and everyone present � all 20-odd � was informed that they would have to speak for a minimum of ten minutes on, pretty much, a subject of their choice connected to items on the agenda! Why? The first person made a valiant effort at finding something to go on about for his allotted time (this had been sprung on those attending), and then pretty much everyone else just repeated what he said, or paraphrased items on the agenda. Is that really meant to be constructive? Is this really meant to be a success for education in HK? When 'adults' in the education field behave like that, and allow themselves to be treated like that, is it really any surprise the students that get churned out by the local system are, at best, passive recipients of information/data but without critical thinking skills and who lack any capacity for independent thought? That is, people who can be trained but who cannot reason?

In the case above, was this NET ever asked for his opinion and input at these 'meetings', or was he expected to be a passive observer? Although people with no experience in HK often do not believe me, I have also been to 'meetings' in which some attending openly slept with their head resting on their folded arms on the table in front of them. If this was a problem the chairman of the meeting did not say so. But then as those of us with such experience well know, it is not really a meeting, and thus the 'attendees' are not really expected to be consciously present. It is okay to sleep, as long as you are physically there.

I found it strange that Andy Lok at the EDB was asked whether the school could terminate the contract with a NET. Are the makers of the Pearl Report really unaware that NETs have been sacked from their respective schools for crimes such as appearing in promotional posters for films with their shirt off?

And is it just me or was this Nora Tse suggesting the need for a NET 'blacklist'? I found her semi-overt anti-western attitude quite disturbing. I can just imagine her busying herself trying to find out what school that NET she so detested went to, and calling up the EPC to spread malicious rumours. I can see it all. I also found her comment that it would be better not to have a NET so they could "really concentrate" on their "work" downright disturbing. What is 'their work', exactly? Paperwork, of course! They like to hide behind it. Teachers such as Nora Tse don't like NETs as they actually engage the kids in activities and conversation. 'They should be drilled', is what 'teachers' such as this Ms Tse say. After all, 'It's the HK way!'

It seems however that, to judge from the Pearl Report at least, the best gravy train-style job to get is with the EDB! I like the way it stated that "Last year, [the EDB NET] team flew to Toronto, Vancouver, and London" and only recruited six (!) NETs. Was it really necessary to actually fly a whole squad of bureaucrats to these destinations? Does the recruitment of a mere six NETs really justify this? After all, they conceded that some 65 NETs were hired through video conferencing and local interviews. But it is a nice little overseas jaunt for the EDB NET team, isn't it? Maybe they used their time in Canada and England to visit their children who attend schools there, paid for of course with their educational allowance.

Another aspect that surprised me was just how openly camp Simon Tham is. This is actually the first time I've seen him and heard his voice. I wonder how the homophobic local teachers at conservative, indeed, draconian, Catholic schools feel about him gracing their school with a visit! Now, that must raise a few eyebrows!

I have to say that I found the comments of 'Kevin' to be sad, but sadly all too typical for a NET. And, in a morbid sort of way, I am 'happy' the show gave so much time to his thoughts, albeit through a disguised voice (who exactly is he 'testifying' against? Local Triads?). He is quite right, of course: if anyone ever tries to do anything in even just a slightly different way from the local teachers then they are often condemned. He is also quite right when he says it is somewhat odd to invite a stranger from a different country and culture to come and do things differently, and then to expect them to do things the same way as the locals. The only thing he neglected to mention was that, if indeed one chooses to do things the 'local way', then the local teachers just complain that the NET is not needed as he does not do anything the local teachers can't do!

I am happy that David Stead was given some time as he articulate, calm, and balanced, but again I found it disturbing that his Panel Chair (? Or principal?) stated that NETs have "certain strengths", for example, "native level oral proficiency"! No! What, really? Never! You mean to say that native speakers are, well, native speakers? Well, would you Adam and Eve it! Note also how she stressed oral proficiency. In other words, at the very best, NETs are just accidents of birth; those who just happen to have been born into an English-speaking environment. What do NETs have to do to be taken seriously? When will such people come to learn that some of us can read and write a little bit of English, too?

I also found Amy Tsui (Chair, Language and Education, HKU) to be quite objectionable. Her tirade against the phrase 'agent of change' � in that phony upper class British accent � made it clear what her stance is. Her allusion to 'culture' is one of the most puzzling aspects of education in HK. Why is it that, the very second anyone just suggests doing something a little bit differently (such as eliciting answers from students rather than drilling the living daylights out of them 24/7), people such as 'Professor' Tsui snap back with references and appeals to culture, and/or the 'HK/Chinese way'? Do they really think that their system is the very best in the entire world? And what does it have to do with 'culture'? How does wanting to do something a little bit differently for what is essentially just twenty minutes a week for most kids mean the NET does not 'respect' the 'local culture'? Besides, it is all very well for this Amy Tsui to claim that nothing in the HK education system needs changing, but it is from the vantage point of someone who did their PhD at the University of Birmingham, in the UK. Why did she not do it at one of the stellar institutions in HK? Her other degrees are from local establishments. I am also forced to wonder how much classroom teaching this Ms Tsui has under her belt. She may well go in for some 'parachute'/'safari' research at local schools when she does her 'fieldwork', but I doubt if she has ever actually ever taught at a local primary or secondary school.

[2 over lee]

My time on the Chinese mainland is over...but I've always toyed with the idea of applying to be a NET in HK, although I'm not a qualified teacher I have some experience teaching A Levels and IB. However, this documentary has completely put me off the idea.

'We would rather have no NET, so we can concentrate on our work', the disgruntled woman says!! Sounds like she and the rest of the staff HAD NOTHING better to do than talk about the NET. Well, they sound even more myopic and inward looking than mainlanders, but with better English.

No thank you, I think I'll just enjoy my Tsim Sha Tsui, Mongkok etc. by just passing through...really 22,000 plus 14,000 isn't a great wad of cash....and I would want to leave at 4pm every day - because really once you know your subject what exactly do you need to hang round for, what's wrong with doing your marking at home with a glass of red and some classical music?

[RiverMystic]

[Susie]

Fantastic!
Yes, it's all about face. How do you get face? Look what happened to Tung Che Wah! In light of that, can NETs expect to be given any face.

About two weeks ago, I was told to scan 10 chapters of the assistant English panel head's book for her, onto her computer, (she has just completed her PGDE)! Yesterday, I was told to scan worksheets for the newly-arrived associate teacher (he's about 22 years old), he has taken the place of an English teacher who left in April. The reason I have to do his work is that he's busy doing something else. Today, I was told to type up a list of English readers, as the English language assistant is on holiday.

If you want to teach in HK, make sure that you are able to tolerate the intolerable and respect the disrespectful.

As of 7 July 2009, The school is advertising again for
English Teachers,
Physical Education Teachers, and
Liberal Studies Teachers,
if anyone wants a job!

Looking at England now, there's a report about a science teacher who seems to be in a spot of bother:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/england/nottinghamshire/8142428.stm

[Mosley]

Keeeerist! After seeing that video, I miss the benign xenophobia of S. Korea!

Years ago, I had a NET inteview, after the most extended, intensive b******* application process I've ever been through. Then the rudest interview I've ever had. Nope. Didn't get in. I admit I was disappointed & even angry at having been turned down. Now I'm convinced I was done a backhanded favor.

"Good" money & all that? Fack dat noise. Why put up with that crap?!

Boot all native speakers out of the wonderful SAR & let the HKers develop the superb wonderful Engrish as exemplified by the HK teachers!