Job Discussion Forums

[nicam]

I've read some mixed things about saving money on this forum. Some say it's easy to save $1000 USD a month, and some say more like $500, and some say it's nearly impossible to save anything anymore with new tax laws, etc. A lot of the posts are a year old or better, and I'm just wondering how much things have changed.

I'm part of a couple, so that makes saving easier, but I'm wondering if $1000 USD a month per person is still a realistic goal on a salary of $65,000 NT.

Also, I've been thinking more about Taipei lately, but would be happy with Taichung and/or Kaohsiung. Is Taipei out of the question for saving money, even for a couple? Some say the earning potential is greater in Taipei...

Thanks!

[TJA]

To be honest, I think this is a very personal question. It comes down to choices. Some people choose to spend first, and ask questions later. Others save and invest first, and spend what's left. The latter route will let you save more.

Eg: I save a bucketload each month, working in the Taipei area. However, I also choose not to go to the movie theaters, or drink alcohol at bars.

My point is, everyone's method is different. You need to plan out what way will work for you, and then have the discipline to stick to it.

...well, that's my 2c...
TJA

[steve_c]

I've been here a year, and my experience is that it's probably going to be more difficult to save much at the beginning, but you'll be able to increase that amount as you get used to life here.

At the beginning, besides your "settling in" costs (housing and utility deposits; initial furniture; health check/ARC, etc.), you'll probably find yourself regularly eating more expensive Western food, because it's familiar and because it's easier to locate and order (thank goodness for 7-11) when you don't know Chinese. You might also take taxis more frequently at the beginning, until you figure out the cheaper transporation routes, like the MRT/bus, or until you buy a scooter (another expense).

Also, in my particular situation, my employer helped me find my first apartment, but I later discovered that there were plenty of cheaper places available. I think they felt that I, as a foreigner, would be more comfortable in a more expensive "all amenity" building. My lease is expiring next month, and I'll be moving from a NT$9,500 (+utilities) place to a NT$3,000 (utilities included) place just two blocks away. I can't wait to start pocketing that savings!

That being said, once you've been here awhile you'll discover where and what cheap Chinese food you can buy. Also, you'll likely have made some local friends who can point you to cheaper stores and places to live. And, of course, as you learn Chinese, you'll discover even more frugal treasures.

I wouldn't sweat it. There's definitely the potential to save money. However, it may take a few months or a year to really start. I work about 25 hours a week at a cram school, live by myself, and am saving about US$600/month, which will increase once I move.

Of course, I don't have expensive habits such as frequenting bars (well, I do like to play mahjong, but only for small stakes), so as the previous poster said, it's up to the individual.

[BigWally]

Its easier to make money away from Taipei, because there are fewer foreigners in other cities taking the good jobs, and the rent/cost of living is typically cheaper.

[OuterBanks13]

Yes, other cities would be preferable if making and saving money is the objective. And, just what would be the better small cities to work?

[123Loto]

Here are some numbers for the OP:

65k - 20% tax equals 52k in the hand.

Rent would be $10,000/m in Taipei county, bills at $3000, and $27000/m to live on. That will be enough to live comfortably in Taipei County: eating out once a week, drinking at a bar, DVDs, movies, books. You could save more if you tone down the lifestyle.

On this budget and with an income of 65k a month you'll save 12k a month, but more like 17k if you are sharing accomodation. If you arrive before July in the calendar year you will get a significant tax refund in the following year. Your second year will be better because of no start up costs, the tax rate dropping to 6% in the second half and you learning how to operate in Taiwan. (No more accidently telling the cab driver YangMinShan when you wanted to say HsiMen!)

BigWally is, however, correct that saving is easier down south.

Start up costs will depend on how lucky you get.

Rent start up will be $10000 first month's rent plus 2 month's rent bond equals $30000. (If you share it will be less or if you live in south Taiwan).

Second hand AC will be $4000, second hand fridge $4000, new mattress will be $2000 - possible to get a new frame for another $3000. Sofa set will be $10000 at IKEA. Desk will be $5000 at IKEA. Scooter will be $20000. Large new flat screen TV = $20,000 .

So total could be about $98000 (78000 if you don't need the TV). However, if you get into shared accommodation a lot of these costs can disappear. You don't necessarily need a scooter in Taipei County (you do down South I hear).

So as I said, the costs will depend on luck to a certain degree.

Good luck!

[Ki]

I'm sorry but how is it easier to save more money outside of Taipei??? My estimates must be out of wack because I just can't see how.

Wages are generally higher in Taipei (city and county) than elsewhere. Although each job varies greatly so it really does depend. I would say 600 an hour is fair for a new teacher in Taipei, depending. Stay away from salaried jobs as you usually tend to lose out on those. Do the math and you will find that a lot of these salaried jobs give you maybe 450 an hour. What can the average joe expect elsewhere?

The one huge benefit to living out of Taipei is of course accomodation. Here you will find you get much more for your money outside of Taipei. But you could still find something for under 7000 if you don't mind flatmates.

I find food and beer to be the same price. Of course there are the more expensive western style restaurants and more expensive clubs in Taipei that you don't always find so plentiful elsewhere but you really don't have to go there to eat and drink.

So how is it easier to save $$$ outside of Taipei??? I see a small saving on accomodation but a smaller wage to at least even things out. Am I missing something here?

[123Loto]

Fair point. I made my statement on the basis of rent only. I haven't lived in the South so we need someone else to contribute some numbers. I do, however, have a pretty good idea of what 10,000 gets you in different parts of Taipei county.

And there's another point: compare apples with apples. We can't compare a studio apartment in Taipei County with sharing a 3 bedroom apartment down South very meaningfully (unless we are asking a question more like "What does 10k a month get you?")

So we should compare how much a serviced studio apartment costs in the different areas.

HsinTien: 12000-15000/m
LuChou: about 10000/m
SanCheong: 10000-12000/m
HsinChuang: about 10000/m
YongHe: 12000-13000/m
BanCiao: 12000-15000/m

Now, of course you can find unserviced apartments for less - but remember to compare apples with apples.

So if, (and that's only IF) you can get a similar place down south for 5-6k/m then you'll see real savings.

Going by the budget I already outlined (earning 65k/m) then the OP's savings would go from 12k to 17k. An almost 150% increase in savings.

btw I have never heard that pay is at a lower rate down south?

Also, for the record, I live in Taipei County and wouldn't go down south for love nor money!!!

[dangerousapple]

Pay is the same in Kaohsiung. The only people who think it is different are people that don't actually live here. It's also a lot easier to get a full-time job at one location here (although not as easy as it used to be). For cash in hand at the end of the month, Kaohsiung very easily beats Taipei.

[BigWally]

Assuming you are a single person, living alone, and living an average lifestyle here's some "Southern" numbers.

Rent (bachelor apartment) - $4000-$8000
Utils (water, elec., etc./month) - $400-$750
Security (if offer at your building) - $250-$500/mth
Food (2-3 meals per day @ restarunts, stands, etc.) $400-$1000/day
Food (buying groceries and cooking at home) $200-$600/day
Scooter:
Up front purchase - $5000-$25000
Maintenance (per month) - $100-$500
Gas (weekly) - $50-$150
Beer/Drinks:
@ 7/11 - $35-$75/can
@ local "and way more fun" bars - $30-$60/pint/bottle
@ foreigner bars - $60-$150/pint/bottle
Trip to Kenting:
Taxi Ride there (car of 4 ppl) - $1200 ($300 each)
Hotel - $800-$2500/night


Average first year teacher salary: $575-$600
Average 2nd year teacher salary: $630-$650
3rd and beyond: I know of people making up to $750/hr


Hope this sheds some light on the south.

[JZer]

[thewileycoyote]

[JZer]

thewileycoyote, I am quessing that there are also less jobs in Kaohsiung. I think for someone who is willing to work anytime of the week and wants to make 90,000+ Taipei is better.

If you are talking about finding a job making 70,000 at one school Kaohsiung may be better.

There are some very good part time jobs in Taipei if you make the connections.

[thewileycoyote]

Taipei will have the most jobs overall. What you say makes sense, if you can get a good first job Taipei should be better to top up with part-time jobs. Sorry I was not thinking along this line when I posted.

I am comming next year after I save up money. Hopefully having a lot of Taiwanese friends in Canada and some who have moved back to Taiwan will help me.

Bruce