Job Discussion Forums

[mozzar]

This thread will be mostly relevant for people familiar with British universities.

I have a TEFL Certificate, a B.A. in English literature and am looking into doing an Advanced Diploma in Applied Linguistics from the Open University. My only question is: will this increase my job prospects? I've only recently started my EFL career but plan to be doing it for quite some while.

Advanced Diploma Link

Would this be enough to ensure i get the better jobs? Or is the market saturated with people who have full blown masters degrees?

[Glenlivet]

Really, who cares. After 2-3 years your experience/commitment counts for more than paper qualifications. I am 46 with no formal degree (although a business management bit of paper) and many years in management. After 3 years teaching I think (hope!) that the lack of degree doesn't really matter unless I want to go to a country that requires a degree as part of the visa process.

If you're good and have relevant experience you'll do OK.

[Justin Trullinger]

Gotta disagree with GLenlivet, though only a little bit.

I'd be cautious about the advanced diploma in applied linguistics, unless you specifically know a job that is asking for it, or you can later use the credits towards an MA. It's not a well-known enough qualification to get the attention of employers, though it sounds like it would be kind of interesting.

This is the "disagree" part. In some fields, and in my experience business is one, once you get in, it's what you've done, not what certs you have, that matters.

But in education, education counts. My experience is that if you don't keep getting further qualifications, you hit the ceiling pretty fast.


Best,
Jusitn

[txmsk]

Personally, I'd just go for an MA Applied Linguistics/TESOL.

Why? Well, after one potential employer rejected me into their EFL/EAP program in China, I kindly asked the director to explain what would better qualify me to teach English for Academic Purposes. I have the CELTA and nearly 5 years of teaching experience focused on all skills, not only on speaking skills.

Anyway, he told me to get a DELTA.

Personally, I think that the DELTA is not worth my time. In Moscow where I am currently located, it's only offered once a year and they want you to study, if I remember correctly, for about 5 or 6 weeks for nearly 8 hours a day.

I'd rather spend the extra time and money in a good, solid 'brick and mortar' program MA program on the ground that is spread over the course of at least a year. Becoming a qualified, knowledgeable teacher of ESOL takes time, and is something, I believe, that should not be rushed or overly compressed. It is a process that requires guidance and an actual practicum component, which is looked favorably upon by potential employers.

I thought about doing an online MA, but decided not to after I found that some employers look down on them (due to the lack of observed teaching) and because I prefer an interactive classroom environment. Not all online programs are the same - some are purely 'correspondence' in nature, with only cursory support offered by the instructors.

Anyway, so back to your question. Of course a DELTA is better than a CELTA.. it is more in depth. Of course an MA is far better... and just wait, in about 5-10 years, employers will be demanding a Ph.D or similar qualification.

[nickpellatt]

Ive completed U211Exploring the English Language and I am currently doing E303 English Grammar in Context. This will give me a diploma in English Language studies as part of my BA.

U211 was actually quite an interesting course to do, and I would recommend it heartily ... E303 is pretty horrible, and I wouldnt recommend it at all. Its the first OU course I have disliked ... and I'll be glad to see the back of it!

I cant get to grips with it really ... and the functional approach to grammar isnt something that I feel has lots of relevance to what I do in the classroom. The corpus study is interesting though.

For personal development, it might not be a bad idea ... but for professional development I do feel studying modules towards a Masters might be a better idea. I complete my BA this year with just the most basic Open BA without honours. People keep telling me I should go for the honours degree ... but I think I would be better off moving straight onto a Masters ... the 9 months the honours module would take would be better spent completing 1/3 of a Masters.

[txmsk]

Just out of curiosity, what is the difference between a UK BA degree and a BA degree with honours?

How might either of those compare to a US BA degree?

[fladude]

Depends. I have a quasi relative (one of those not really related but at the same event types) who has a Masters in that subject and got a job at a well respected university in the ME. However... their MA is from Harvard...

[nickpellatt]

fladude - this isnt a Masters though ... its a step or two below that really, and is probably an interim qualification that doesnt carry a lot of recognition.

txmsk - I dont really know the difference between a BA and a BA with honours myself. All I do know is when I have got this bloody horrible grammar course over and done with ... I will have earned enough credit to qualify for a BA. The honours part would take another 9 month course.

How it compares to an American BA, I really dont know. In terms of time studied etc ... I can only refer to my own experience. My BA will have been earned by completing 5 modules, each of which last 9 months and have approximately 14 study hours per week

[naturegirl321]

I disagree with the experience thing. If you change counts, your experience doesn't seem to count. I'm trying to leave Peru and am dealing with starting at the bottom all over again.

[gungediana]

I can clear up the difference between a B.A and a B.A Honours.

A Batchelors degree with honours is the same as what you Americans would call a bog standard Batchelors degree. A Batchelors degree without the suffix honours is where the student has nearly but not quite met the requirements of a full degree.

I agree with Justin etc, bite the bullet and do the Masters. It will be hard, super stressful and it will cost a lot of money. But all worth it in the end. An M.A/MEd in TESOL (and Applied Linguistics) studied on campus is the gold standard qualification in this industry.

[spiral78]

After 2-3 years your experience/commitment counts for more than paper qualifications.

This is perhaps largely true at the private language school level, but I have to disagree for those who want to make a career in the field. At the university level, as in international schools, paper quals count.

I've recently interviewed a guy with 10+ years of experience, but NO formal quals. He's got no chance here, I'm afraid. Well, not only because of no quals, but to try for a uni position without them indicates a bit of disrespect for the field...and the teaching methods and approaches the guy has developed on his own over the past ten years are very incompatable with what we do here.

[mozzar]

[dirimini]

[gungediana]

mozzar- I believe that a course studied on campus is considered better than an on-line course.

I have heard that some employers don't accept people with on-line Masters degrees.

That's an awful lot of studying you have to do to gain those qualifications. It might be easier to get the M.A TESOL but also take a teaching assistant course. Then you would be employable back home, but you can avoid the palava of applying for a PGCE gaining QTS etc.

Good luck with it all anyway.
I'm hopefully doing the M.A TESOL myself this year.

[mozzar]

With regards to doing a PGCE. It's possible to gain QTS without doing the PGCE course. You're essentially placed in a school as a trainee teacher (for which you're paid) and then at the end of the school year you'll be a fully qualified teacher (just without the PGCE qualification).


I may have to rethink my options if a campus course is considered to be superior. Do employers think there is a noticeable difference? Even if it is from a reputable university?