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Rooster_2006
Joined: 24 Sep 2007
Posts: 984
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 Posted: Mon Jul 20, 2009 1:14 pm Post subject: Is it worth waiting to enter Japan to become a JET? |
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Basically, I have two choices.
1. I can rush my degree/graduation and enter Japan in 2010, but since I'll have missed the deadline on degree timing, I won't be able to enter JET and will have to work at an eikaiwa.
2. I can take a more leisurely pace and enter Japan in 2011 through JET. I'm fairly confident I can make it in since I already have CELTA, teaching experience, and speak Japanese.
My big question is this:
Are the perks of JET worth waiting up to an additional year, and the risk that I'll be rejected?
How do JET hours compare to hours at a normal eikaiwa? Are they longer or shorter?
Personally I'd rather just enter Japan sooner. I'd rather not wait. On the other hand, JETs get an extra 50,000 yen a month in salary, and that can't be ignored either. Do they have to work extra hard for it? Is there a difference between someone doing JET and someone working at an eikaiwa for 250,000 a month with some part-time lessons to reach 300,000? Are there any drawbacks with JET? |
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aynnej
Joined: 03 May 2008
Posts: 53
Location: Pittsburgh, PA, U.S.A.
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| Posted: Mon Jul 20, 2009 2:17 pm Post subject: |
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I work for an eikawa. I'm usually able to pick up enough extra work to earn around 300,000 yen per month -- sometimes a little more, sometimes a little less. I'm fortunate enough to work for a company where 29.5 hours really does mean 29.5 hours, so I have enough time to take on the extra shifts (though I do spend about 2 hrs a week on lesson prep at home).
I believe JET is considered to be more prestigious, so if you think you have a decent chance, it might be worth waiting for. It is very competitive. One thing to consider, though, is if you want to live in the countryside or in a metropolitan area. Most of the JET placements are in rural areas. One advantage of the JET program is that (I believe this is still true) they will pay your airfare. Most eikawas won't offer this.
Whatever you decide, good luck! |
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GambateBingBangBOOM
Joined: 04 Nov 2003
Posts: 2021
Location: Japan
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| Posted: Mon Jul 20, 2009 2:27 pm Post subject: Re: Is it worth waiting to enter Japan to become a JET? |
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| Rooster_2006 wrote: |
Basically, I have two choices.
1. I can rush my degree/graduation and enter Japan in 2010, but since I'll have missed the deadline on degree timing, I won't be able to enter JET and will have to work at an eikaiwa.
2. I can take a more leisurely pace and enter Japan in 2011 through JET. I'm fairly confident I can make it in since I already have CELTA, teaching experience, and speak Japanese.
My big question is this:
Are the perks of JET worth waiting up to an additional year, and the risk that I'll be rejected? |
For me they were, but every situation is different (ESID- the mantra of the JET program). I wouldn't be all that confident, if I were you. They turn down people with high qualifications and accept people with absolutely none, other than a BA, all the time. It's a crapshoot.
| Rooster_2006 wrote: |
How do JET hours compare to hours at a normal eikaiwa? Are they longer or shorter? |
Generally, the number of hours are about the same, what you do in those hours is usually totally different. I've been an elementary JET ALT and had to teach every single class each day (six classes a day, sometimes seven if I have to teach English to home room teachers, of being super energetic, usually not getting a chance to go back to the teacher's room between classes. Often you are pouring with sweat by the end of the first or second class). Before that I was in junior highs (with some elementary visits). On a normal basis, would have no day with more than three classes. Four was considered about the maximum. Two was about the norm at small schools, often have at least one day a week with no classes scheduled. This means you have a lot of down time (but you are at school) so if you can afford it and have enough experience, you could do an MA in TESOL by distance, for example. You could also study a lot of Japanese.
The other thing is that JET is a m-f 9-5 job. That's a LOT better than having to work on weekends and not having two days off in a row, and working evenings as well. With an eikaiwa schedule, you basically can not do marital arts or other clubs other than your day off because they only happen in the evenings.
On the other hand, in JET you are more often than not in a rural area, often not allowed to drive and there may not be any other foreigners to talk to in your town, so you may be sort of stuck in your small town until the weekend.
| Rooster_2006 wrote: |
| Personally I'd rather just enter Japan sooner. I'd rather not wait. On the other hand, JETs get an extra 50,000 yen a month in salary, and that can't be ignored either. Do they have to work extra hard for it? |
Overall, they usually work less, for more pay and better conditions.
| Rooster_2006 wrote: |
| Is there a difference between someone doing JET and someone working at an eikaiwa for 250,000 a month with some part-time lessons to reach 300,000? |
Ummm... no...? It's the same amount of money. But you could easily teach privates after work while on JET (although you're actually not allowed to, it's against your contract, but many JETs do it- and occasionally get denied recontracting because of it- it's an excuse the BoE can use, if they just don't want you around any more). If you work in an eikaiwa, then there's a good chance that the only time you would have to do privates would be on your non-consecutive days of, or else teaching early (like starting at 7am) classes through another eikaiwa for business people.
Another difference is your plan for being in Japan. Do you want to stay for a long time? If so, JET is specifically designed along the lines of people staying a couple of years and then leaving the country. JET often does not look good on resumes for Japanese employers because they have a reputation for doing nothing. Depending on what you want to do in Japan, eikaiwa experience may or may not be useful. It's useful for other eikaiwas. Unless you get up to the head teacher position (several years of experience) then eikaiwa doesn't look all that great on a resume either. Basically, what looks good is a recommendation from someone the company already knows, having Japanese language skills and having university qualifications in teaching (k-12 teacher for example) or teaching English (post grad certificate in TESOL from a university is better than Aunt Sally's four week TESOL program. CELTA means next to nothing in this country. Where they look to foreign education as a guide, they look at the US, which doesn't have a lot of use for the CELTA either).
| Rooster_2006 wrote: |
Are there any drawbacks with JET? |
Entirely depends on where they put you (keep in mind that if you live in a city, it's a lot easier to get another job and network than in the countryside), and (like any other job on the planet) who you are working with (especially in rural areas it's pretty common to see a hierarchy of nationalities, starting with wherever the town has a sister city relationship with, then the US, then the UK, and that's about it. If you're from Canada, Ireland, Australia, New Zealand etc and there isn't a sister city relationship with your country in that small town, then some people, including at your BoE and your JTEs, may consider you a lesser ALT). Also, JET is decreasing, and so people keep finding out that they cannot recontract, though the number of years you can stay as a maximum is creeping up to five from three. |
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Mr_Monkey
Joined: 11 Mar 2009
Posts: 661
Location: Kyuuuuuushuuuuuuu
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| Posted: Mon Jul 20, 2009 4:09 pm Post subject: Re: Is it worth waiting to enter Japan to become a JET? |
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| GambateBingBangBOOM wrote: |
| With an eikaiwa schedule, you basically can not do marital arts or other clubs other than your day off because they only happen in the evenings. |
I don't know, Gambate... Maybe you just need to be a little more adventurous?  |
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seklarwia
Joined: 20 Jan 2009
Posts: 1546
Location: Monkey onsen, Nagano
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| Posted: Mon Jul 20, 2009 9:19 pm Post subject: |
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If you prefer the JET hours and prefer working M-F but are willing to work for for 250,000 to get here sooner, you could consider ALT dispatch. Just like JET, ESID in ALT dispatch. You might get the afore mentioned 6 classes/day elementary school gig, or you might end up with something like my JH school placement where the norm is 2-3 classes/day. Money and benefits are definate perks to JET, but if get hired through dispatch to arrive in March, then locations avaliable is a perk to dispatch.
I'm slightly confused about your gradution schedule though. In the UK, we can apply to JET in our final year. Most of us don't officially graduate until June/July time, but many of us already have our final results by May, so we can get the official letters of confirmation from our uni before graduation so that the visa process can be started in time for an August arrival (if we are accepted by JET in the meantime, of course). If this is similar for you, then you can apply to JET this Autumn. Of course, you should also apply to other jobs too. That way if you don't even make it to the JET interview stage, you might hopefully have something else lined up. |
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Glenski
Joined: 15 Jan 2003
Posts: 12844
Location: Hokkaido, JAPAN
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| Posted: Mon Jul 20, 2009 9:46 pm Post subject: |
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I'm also confused about your graduation date. Exactly when it is (rushed or otherwise)?
I wouldn't exactly say that JET ALT work is more "prestigious". There are plenty around that recognize eikaiwa and JET as low entry level work. The biggest differences with JET that make it a more positive job are:
better hours than eikaiwa (as mentioned already),
better pay (plus health insurance guaranteed; some eikaiwas refuse to copay so you have to apply by yourself, including for pension),
and
less responsibility than eikaiwa (where you would teach by yourself instead of with someone who could handle disciplinary matters and language issues)
JET also has a support network plus supplemental training/lectures, whereas with eikaiwa you are completely on your own.
As for hours, I believe most classes with public schools (JET work) are 45 minutes long. Eikaiwa could be 45-80 minutes per class. Already mentioned are the consecutive vs. non-consecutive days off and 9-5 vs. evening hours.
| Quote: |
| Is there a difference between someone doing JET and someone working at an eikaiwa for 250,000 a month with some part-time lessons to reach 300,000? |
Sure, the eikaiwa + PT work adds up to more teaching time and less to yourself. You may make more contacts with those PT lessons that are helpful in the future, but it's hit and miss.
| Quote: |
Are there any drawbacks with JET? |
Sure. Housing may not always be the greatest. ESID.
Support is not always as good with every position. ESID.
Your JTE may not care to have you there, or may treat you badly (the "human tape recorder" syndrome). ESID.
Most assignments are in the countryside; some people don't like that because they want to be in Tokyo or Kyoto. ESID.
With most eikaiwa, you work only in one place. With JET, you probably end up dealing with several schools, which loses a lot of consistency in your classes. ESID.
JET is a limited term (3-5 years).
| Quote: |
JET often does not look good on resumes for Japanese employers because they have a reputation for doing nothing. Depending on what you want to do in Japan, eikaiwa experience may or may not be useful. It's useful for other eikaiwas. |
Yes, but it depends on how you leverage either experience. I went from eikaiwa to private HS. Most direct hire positions seem to want experience in Japan, even from eikaiwa or JET. Case by case. |
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GambateBingBangBOOM
Joined: 04 Nov 2003
Posts: 2021
Location: Japan
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| Posted: Wed Jul 22, 2009 2:24 pm Post subject: |
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| Glenski wrote: |
As for hours, I believe most classes with public schools (JET work) are 45 minutes long. |
Elementary classes are 45 minutes. Junior and senior high classes are 50 minutes. |
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Amarok
Joined: 02 Jun 2009
Posts: 47
Location: pineapple under the sea
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| Posted: Wed Jul 22, 2009 4:25 pm Post subject: |
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| Rooster, don't put all of your eggs in one basket and just assume you'll be accepted to JET. From what I've seen from my own experiences applying/interviewing and those of my friends, it's not necessarily about your Japanese ability or ability to teach. In fact, sometimes they'll take candidates who don't know any Japanese and who have no teaching experience over those who do, so it struck me as kind of a crapshoot. Don't just assume you're in and build all your plans around that one opportunity. |
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G Cthulhu
Joined: 07 Feb 2003
Posts: 1373
Location: Way, way off course.
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| Posted: Wed Jul 22, 2009 11:43 pm Post subject: |
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| Amarok wrote: |
| Rooster, don't put all of your eggs in one basket and just assume you'll be accepted to JET. From what I've seen from my own experiences applying/interviewing and those of my friends, it's not necessarily about your Japanese ability or ability to teach. In fact, sometimes they'll take candidates who don't know any Japanese and who have no teaching experience over those who do, so it struck me as kind of a crapshoot. Don't just assume you're in and build all your plans around that one opportunity. |
It is not a crapshoot. There are standardised systems in place to evaluate candidates (allowing for the usual variation in scoring from interviewers) and if you didn't get in after an interview it's for one of two reasons:
1. You sucked at the interview, and/or
2. There simply weren't enough places the year you applied and you weren't high enough up the rankings to get in.
In my experience, #1 is the reason more often than not. |
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GambateBingBangBOOM
Joined: 04 Nov 2003
Posts: 2021
Location: Japan
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| Posted: Thu Jul 23, 2009 4:38 am Post subject: |
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| Funiki is one of those standarisd systems. It boils down to 'aaa, no. Wrong atmosphere. We're looking for blond hair / female / male/ 'multicultural' image / stereotype 'anglo' image this year. DENIED' |
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seklarwia
Joined: 20 Jan 2009
Posts: 1546
Location: Monkey onsen, Nagano
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| Posted: Thu Jul 23, 2009 8:13 am Post subject: |
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| G Cthulhu wrote: |
| Amarok wrote: |
| Rooster, don't put all of your eggs in one basket and just assume you'll be accepted to JET. From what I've seen from my own experiences applying/interviewing and those of my friends, it's not necessarily about your Japanese ability or ability to teach. In fact, sometimes they'll take candidates who don't know any Japanese and who have no teaching experience over those who do, so it struck me as kind of a crapshoot. Don't just assume you're in and build all your plans around that one opportunity. |
It is not a crapshoot. There are standardised systems in place to evaluate candidates (allowing for the usual variation in scoring from interviewers) and if you didn't get in after an interview it's for one of two reasons:
1. You sucked at the interview, and/or
2. There simply weren't enough places the year you applied and you weren't high enough up the rankings to get in.
In my experience, #1 is the reason more often than not. |
I think its a bit unfair to say that most the people who don't get accepted were crap at the interview.
JET is down sizing. They have raised the age limit. Current JETs are allowed to stay on longer. People with degrees are a dime a dozen unlike only a generation ago when most people left education after their O Levels. With the state of the economy in many of our home countries, lots of people are looking abroad for greener pastures... All these things means you are competing against ever more people now for far fewers positions than people who applied only a few years ago.
And what do you consider standardised scoring? It's not based on a test with clear right/wrong answers. It's not based on your uni subject or results. Previous experience and/or Japanese experience doesn't always win you points.
When scoring for personality, are the panel counting the number of times you smile? Or is down to whether you just click with the panel?
I think alot is more to do with panel pot luck. What one panel might find an attractive quality in a candidate, another panel might not find to their taste, disregard or not even notice. |
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GambateBingBangBOOM
Joined: 04 Nov 2003
Posts: 2021
Location: Japan
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| Posted: Thu Jul 23, 2009 8:34 am Post subject: |
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| seklarwia wrote: |
| What one panel might find an attractive quality in a candidate, another panel might not find to their taste, disregard or not even notice. |
Exactly. But that is explainable in that the panel is looking for people to be representatives of their city / area (because ***that*** doesn't lead to abuses, especially when not a single person on the panel is a human resources professional, and some may not even be aware of what is and is not legal to ask in an interview in that country [many people don't even seem to be aware that if you are interviewed in a job in Canada / the US that takes place in Japan, then it is the law of the country in which you interview which is the law you go by]. "It seems your poorly conceived plan carried out by rank amateurs somehow failed."-- paraphrasing Chief Wiggam). |
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seklarwia
Joined: 20 Jan 2009
Posts: 1546
Location: Monkey onsen, Nagano
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| Posted: Thu Jul 23, 2009 9:01 am Post subject: |
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| GambateBingBangBOOM wrote: |
Exactly. But that is explainable in that the panel is looking for people to be representatives of their city / area |
Don't know if that really works in the UK though. Applicants get a choice of two interview locations. At either, you may be faced with a panel that has never even heard of your town/city/village, let alone know anything about it. So you may get turned down because you don't fit whatever they believe to be true of people from your area. |
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GambateBingBangBOOM
Joined: 04 Nov 2003
Posts: 2021
Location: Japan
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| Posted: Thu Jul 23, 2009 10:48 am Post subject: |
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I'm guessing that the person's accent will have a lot to do with hiring decisions in the UK. There wouldn't be much point in sending people that even native English speakers from other ('inner circle') countries needed translators for, there would be about a 0.00000000001% chance of Japanese Teachers of English understanding them.
But yeah, I agree with you that it's whatever the panel happens to believe is true of your area. |
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G Cthulhu
Joined: 07 Feb 2003
Posts: 1373
Location: Way, way off course.
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| Posted: Thu Jul 23, 2009 7:07 pm Post subject: |
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| GambateBingBangBOOM wrote: |
| Funiki is one of those standarisd systems. It boils down to 'aaa, no. Wrong atmosphere. We're looking for blond hair / female / male/ 'multicultural' image / stereotype 'anglo' image this year. DENIED' |
Thanks for sharing. However, unlike you, I have seen the selection materials and done interviews and screened applications. You're wrong. Yes, JET may have been a crapshoot when you got in (you do realize what that implies about you?!) but it isn't much of one now IMO. You need to lighten up on your bitterness about JET. It has lots of still-current targets to aim at if you want.   |
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