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Is it even Possible to get ANY job in Europe these days ...
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Joined: 29 Jul 2006
Posts: 1005
Location: Caput Imperii Americani

PostPosted: Sat Aug 01, 2009 3:53 pm    Post subject: Is it even Possible to get ANY job in Europe these days ... Reply with quote

over the internet? Seriously I have applied to about 30 jobs the last 2 weeks and most don't even answer and when they do it's always no. I know I am not the BEST qualified but also not the worst. Is it just the economy or is it something else? Do you have to be in a place to find a job there? It certainly makes more sense to do that but I can't personally afford to move some place and spend weeks and months looking for a job. I am reaching my wit's end, all the while having to finish my thesis. I don't deal with stress well. Any miraculous advice or info I don't know about?

Anything, Anybody...????? Shocked Confused
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spiral78



Joined: 05 Apr 2004
Posts: 11534
Location: On a Short Leash

PostPosted: Sat Aug 01, 2009 4:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ok, you know what I'm going to say and I reckon you're really seeking a fresher perspective. Sorry - I'll throw in my two cents' worth anyway Very Happy

But no - you know that most jobs don't happen over the internet in this region, and definitely not this year, with the economy in the tank.

I think, worst case scenario, you have to take some basic job for a contract period, somplace you like (try to consider an area where there are some good universities or other kinds of places you would LIKE to get work) and try to build your chances and contacts there.

If you can accept the idea that the worst case is one more year at a basic level job somewhere NICE that you LIKE - then maybe you can find some peace with it - and you might get lucky - it does happen occasionally.

Best of luck with the thesis. I know how that black cloud over one's head feels (I have a minor one myself this weekend - starting a very big, important intensive course on Monday that I haven't QUITE finished developing yet!!). Wish me luck, too, for that matter.....

Best of luck with your thesis (returning to the more important point here)Smile
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spiral78



Joined: 05 Apr 2004
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Location: On a Short Leash

PostPosted: Sat Aug 01, 2009 5:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

By the way, you know everyone's on holiday until September, right Very Happy

Really, don't worry - it's not because of your quals. You'll find something...

Have you done any research on 'tolerance of ambiguity?' It a quality of good language learners (and good language teachers, too, I think:))
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Joined: 29 Jul 2006
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 01, 2009 6:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

spiral78 wrote:
Ok, you know what I'm going to say and I reckon you're really seeking a fresher perspective. Sorry - I'll throw in my two cents' worth anyway Very Happy

But no - you know that most jobs don't happen over the internet in this region, and definitely not this year, with the economy in the tank.

I think, worst case scenario, you have to take some basic job for a contract period, somplace you like (try to consider an area where there are some good universities or other kinds of places you would LIKE to get work) and try to build your chances and contacts there.

If you can accept the idea that the worst case is one more year at a basic level job somewhere NICE that you LIKE - then maybe you can find some peace with it - and you might get lucky - it does happen occasionally.

Best of luck with the thesis. I know how that black cloud over one's head feels (I have a minor one myself this weekend - starting a very big, important intensive course on Monday that I haven't QUITE finished developing yet!!). Wish me luck, too, for that matter.....

Best of luck with your thesis (returning to the more important point here)Smile


I just applied for a job as a proof reader in Brussels. It would be nice if I got it...I am really all over the board with applying to stuff, in every possible sector. My dream would be: francophone, non English teaching...but beggars can't be choosers...cheers for the advice...
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spiral78



Joined: 05 Apr 2004
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 01, 2009 6:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I just interviewed a guy who was a proof reader in Brussels until last week Shocked
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Joined: 29 Jul 2006
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 01, 2009 6:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

spiral78 wrote:
I just interviewed a guy who was a proof reader in Brussels until last week Shocked


With any luck maybe I will be in his former shoes. Honestly have no idea why someone would switch to EFL though.

Why did he stop?
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spiral78



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PostPosted: Sat Aug 01, 2009 6:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

He said he wanted to work in a university situation because he thought it would be 'more laid back.' He didn't get the job Shocked
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Joined: 29 Jul 2006
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 01, 2009 6:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

spiral78 wrote:
He said he wanted to work in a university situation because he thought it would be 'more laid back.' He didn't get the job Shocked


Is that why you didn't hire him?

Everyone hates stress, yet everyone wants to pile it onto people and when they are honest about it they get rejected. I hate this world.
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spiral78



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PostPosted: Sat Aug 01, 2009 7:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

He was doing freelance proofreading and occasionally teaching English conversation classes to businesspeople who didn't want to lose their English competence.

In my university situation, we are often teaching in quite high-stakes situations - in some cases, kids can lose their place at the uni if they can't write to standard, for example.

Laid-back, it's not. Challenging, diverse, rewarding - it is.

A reasonable level of stress is healthy and productive. This guy's idea of a reasonable level of stress was just too low to fit this teaching context.

I'm not quite sure in what world chatting in English to businesspeople with very low expectations for learning anything could be considered 'stressful' enough to lead someone to seek something less so Shocked

Basically, much less stress and one would be comatose!
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 01, 2009 8:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

spiral78 wrote:
He was doing freelance proofreading and occasionally teaching English conversation classes to businesspeople who didn't want to lose their English competence.

In my university situation, we are often teaching in quite high-stakes situations - in some cases, kids can lose their place at the uni if they can't write to standard, for example.

Laid-back, it's not. Challenging, diverse, rewarding - it is.

A reasonable level of stress is healthy and productive. This guy's idea of a reasonable level of stress was just too low to fit this teaching context.

I'm not quite sure in what world chatting in English to businesspeople with very low expectations for learning anything could be considered 'stressful' enough to lead someone to seek something less so Shocked

Basically, much less stress and one would be comatose!


Mhmm...good question; the problem I have with EFL in general and 'business' EFL is that it is all very fickle and arbitrary and dependent much less on your ability than random, uncontrollable factors. Maybe some guy doesn't like your look, maybe they don't like your voice. I had a friend that 'got along with' all his students and he would get away with anything; others were not so lucky. I'll be honest. At the end of the day I think EFL is just a bunch of bullshite and ultimately entertainment. I am not a very good entertainer and thus want out. There are other things but that is the main reason for me. I cannot for the life of me understand why anyone would call it 'rewarding'. Yes, it is challenging but not in a positive or interesting way, for example the way syntax and semantics is, it is more of an irritating challenge. It isn't rewarding. I don't get how you can say that. Even at a fancy uni like yours where it is probably a bit better I reckon it can't be that rewarding. It is certainly not an intellectual activity.
Kids, adults, teenies; all edutainment. This is just my view. I know others feel differently. I like working independently and by myself, which is why I reckon I am not cut out for TEFL. In fact I am even applying to hard labour jobs over some EFL ones...anyway, rant over. Uni gig is probably better but I bet speaking English all day isn't helping your Dutch, eh? Wink
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spiral78



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PostPosted: Sun Aug 02, 2009 6:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hmmm. Actually, my job (and jobs like it) aren't even EFL. I don't actually teach language as the primary focus - only in small bits to support the bigger goals, which are content-based, in fact. We're definitely not concerned with entertainment, though I agree that it does take some form of engaging personality to get through effectively.

What I like most about this job (besides the fact that I work exclusively with adults - that's a basic rule of mine!) is that I teach across faculties - Economics, Health Sciences, European Studies. It's very rare that we do anything with general English, our students being required to speak at B2+ to begin with. It's the content that I like...
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spiral78



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PostPosted: Sun Aug 02, 2009 6:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

True about my dutch, though Embarassed My Czech's still vastly better and I'm far more comfortable with it.
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 02, 2009 10:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

spiral78 wrote:
Hmmm. Actually, my job (and jobs like it) aren't even EFL. I don't actually teach language as the primary focus - only in small bits to support the bigger goals, which are content-based, in fact. We're definitely not concerned with entertainment, though I agree that it does take some form of engaging personality to get through effectively.

What I like most about this job (besides the fact that I work exclusively with adults - that's a basic rule of mine!) is that I teach across faculties - Economics, Health Sciences, European Studies. It's very rare that we do anything with general English, our students being required to speak at B2+ to begin with. It's the content that I like...


It does sound like you have a nice set up, vastly better than what most schlock EFL teachers have.
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 02, 2009 10:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

spiral78 wrote:
True about my dutch, though Embarassed My Czech's still vastly better and I'm far more comfortable with it.


That is bizarre considering Dutch is 10x easier than Czech is! Shocked
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spiral78



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PostPosted: Sun Aug 02, 2009 10:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeah, I paid my dues and got lucky on top of it!

You'll get there too, no worries.

Czech's closer to my heart Very Happy
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