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vuloshin
Joined: 02 Oct 2004
Posts: 23
Location: Buffalo, NY USA
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 Posted: Mon Dec 24, 2007 10:59 pm Post subject: Is this a scam?-Employmnet agency |
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Hi Everyone!
It's been a while since I posted something but I'm looking for an ESL teaching job in the Middle East and need some advice.
There was a job posting on another website. The job ad said it paid 9K SAR's/month. I e-mailed my resume/cv and the guy that placed the ad responded by asking me to call him in Saudi Arabia because he said the number I gave wasn't working.
So I called him and he said:
1) They are an employment agency and they will take out 1/2 (HALF!) of my first months salary and it will go to the recruiting agency.
2) He said they can get a visa for me within a few days. This sounds weird.
How long does this usually take?
So I never even had a formal interview over the phone and the guy couldn't even remember the schools name (he said: "Oxford Academy...something).
Another question:
I know most schools in the KSA pay for airfare, but do you have to pay for the ticket first or does the school usually send you a ticket with your visa? How does this work?
p.s. I'm a convert to Islam, which is why I'm searching for a job in this area of the world. I have a BA in math, TESOL certificate, and three semesters experience in Poland.
Thanks in advance for any help.
-Vuloshin |
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mouse5
Joined: 11 Jan 2006
Posts: 142
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| Posted: Tue Dec 25, 2007 9:10 am Post subject: Franchises |
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| Avoid the franchises, such as Berlitz, Inlingua. WallStreet, English First and Oxford Academy. They have the highest staff turnovers. |
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Kootvela
Joined: 22 Oct 2007
Posts: 513
Location: Lithuania
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| Posted: Tue Dec 25, 2007 9:41 am Post subject: |
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Though I'm not an expert, but some things struck a chord.
One, the phone is not working. The person can email you and say that and ask for another one or to check it. If you call on your own expence, they save money on -international?- calls. And calls about jobs can last long.
Two, airfare reimbursement. As looking at my own contract offers, they said I pay my own airfare and they return me money half after I arrive and half after the contract ends, but no more than (insert sum here) in total. I doubt that any school would pay in advance because what if the teacher is a scam and doesn't show up? |
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desert_traveller
Joined: 28 Nov 2006
Posts: 335
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| Posted: Tue Dec 25, 2007 9:49 am Post subject: |
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Last edited by desert_traveller on Sun Jun 03, 2012 5:18 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Kootvela
Joined: 22 Oct 2007
Posts: 513
Location: Lithuania
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| Posted: Tue Dec 25, 2007 10:45 am Post subject: |
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| desert_traveller wrote: |
Could I just add International House and Bell International to mouse5's list.
These franchise schools usually only recruit for other (Saudi) companies in the KSA.
If you spoke to an agency that recruits for one of these 'recruiters', well, I would not proceed with my application if I were you. You might end up in a terribly complicated employment situation where you report to 3 different companies regarding different things, all 3 not knowing what the other 2 do.
The fact that they asked you to call them back is atrocious.
Try to get a direct hire at a college, uni or oil company. Do some research on the net, it will be time well spent on the long run. Do not go for the first job you are offered without considering at least a few other offers.
Imho.
Good luck. |
I did not want to put IH because people might start talking I'm seeking my personal revenge for bad working situation that I used to have but since I did not mention it first, I can second it.
Also, desert-traveller gives a good advice on direct hire. Maybe you can establish yourself as a private language consultant/trainer and work on your own? If you manage to get a few in-company groups, that will be good because you can keep all the pay for yourself and not be paid 10% of the real price while working for a language institute. |
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Cleopatra
Joined: 28 Jun 2003
Posts: 3657
Location: Tuamago Archipelago
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| Posted: Tue Dec 25, 2007 12:35 pm Post subject: |
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| I doubt that any school would pay in advance because what if the teacher is a scam and doesn't show up? |
Actually, every Saudi employer I've ever had has paid for my ticket in advance. It's standard practice. I was once asked to pay for my own ticket, and told that I would be reimbursed later on, but I refused and insisted they pay for the ticket. It's not that I thought they wouldn't pay me what they owed me, just that I expected the whole procedure would be a massive headache and it would be many months before I saw the money. The experience of colleagues who paid for their own tickets proved I was correct.
BTW it's possible, but unlikely, that a teacher would back out at the last minute. Getting a Saudi visa is an expensive and time-consuming process, and if someone was going to back out, it's likely they'd do so somewhere between the medical and the degree verification process, rather than just before stepping on the plane.
As for the OP, alarm bells are ringing loud and clear. Avoid that 'agency' like the proverbial plague. |
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scot47
Joined: 10 Jan 2003
Posts: 15343
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| Posted: Tue Dec 25, 2007 12:36 pm Post subject: |
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"Maybe you can establish yourself as a private language consultant/trainer and work on your own? If you manage to get a few in-company groups, that will be good because you can keep all the pay for yourself and not be paid 10% of the real price while working for a language institute."
Suggests the lady with the interesting hair. Alas not possible in Saudi. To get an entry visa you need a sponsor, i.e. employer. |
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vuloshin
Joined: 02 Oct 2004
Posts: 23
Location: Buffalo, NY USA
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| Posted: Tue Dec 25, 2007 1:05 pm Post subject: |
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Thanks for all the advice everyone, keep it coming!
You guys say that it is time consuming to get the visa, but the guy I talked to said it would only take a few days.
I'm glad to hear that sometimes they do pay for airfare ahead of time. This is important because I don't have enough money now to pay for a plane ticket and living expenses for the first month.
I might take the advice of a PM I got recommending I try the University of Hail.
Does anyone know how much Hail pays and how many teaching hours there are per week? |
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Cleopatra
Joined: 28 Jun 2003
Posts: 3657
Location: Tuamago Archipelago
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| Posted: Tue Dec 25, 2007 1:11 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: |
| the guy I talked to said it would only take a few days. |
That alone is reason to consider this agency a bad joke.
Getting work visas for KSA does not take a few days, or even a few weeks. It generally requires about two months from the time you accept a job offer to the day that visa is stamped into your passport. And that's assuming all goes smoothly - which it very often does not. There are no short cuts - the visa is obtained not by a foreign agency, but by a Saudi sponsor who must apply to the Ministry of Foreign Affairs in Riyadh. Once their application is successful, then, and only then, can you start the lengthy and sometimes frustrating process of applying for the visa from your nearest Saudi embassy.
Steer well clear of these jokers. |
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Kootvela
Joined: 22 Oct 2007
Posts: 513
Location: Lithuania
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| Posted: Tue Dec 25, 2007 1:18 pm Post subject: |
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| scot47 wrote: |
"Maybe you can establish yourself as a private language consultant/trainer and work on your own? If you manage to get a few in-company groups, that will be good because you can keep all the pay for yourself and not be paid 10% of the real price while working for a language institute."
Suggests the lady with the interesting hair. Alas not possible in Saudi. To get an entry visa you need a sponsor, i.e. employer. |
Interesting hair? 
Judging from all the post here, getting a visa is a terrible procedure. Why is this so? I mean, promoting business should be a good idea for any government. Are they trying to protect their inner market from foreign workers? If I had to wait for a visa for several months, let alone if it is not issued withou any problem, I wouldn't go to that country. Sure, the original poster has the reasons to go there, but I'd opt out for something else.
Is it not possible to get an entry visa individually, only with the sponsor's help? |
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Cleopatra
Joined: 28 Jun 2003
Posts: 3657
Location: Tuamago Archipelago
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| Posted: Tue Dec 25, 2007 1:23 pm Post subject: |
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| Are they trying to protect their inner market from foreign workers? |
Ummm...... no. Foreign workers are essential to the Saudi economy, and basically all menial jobs and many professional jobs are held by foreign workers. The reason getting a Saudi visa takes so long is because a) it's a two-track process, which you can't start until your employer receives authorisation from the MFA, b) you need to do an extensive medical, and c) you need to have your degrees stamped by the Min of Ed. in your home country. If you have any 'complications' - such as family travelling with you - the whole process can take even longer.
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| Sure, the original poster has the reasons to go there, but I'd opt out for something else. |
Well, if your other options are elsewhere in the Gulf, as far as I know the procedure is not very different.
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| Is it not possible to get an entry visa individually, only with the sponsor's help? |
It is often possible to enter KSA on a business or visit visa, and these can be obtained much more quickly than a work visa. Some employers take this route, especially if they need you in a hurry. However, having such a visa transformed into a proper residence visa can be a real pain, so if possible it's much better to get all the paperwork done before you come to KSA, rather than afterwards. |
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veiledsentiments
Joined: 20 Feb 2003
Posts: 17644
Location: USA
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| Posted: Tue Dec 25, 2007 3:28 pm Post subject: |
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| Kootvela wrote: |
| I mean, promoting business should be a good idea for any government. |
Hiring EFL teachers and promoting business are two unrelated issues. Teachers are closer to indentured servants.
VS |
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desert_traveller
Joined: 28 Nov 2006
Posts: 335
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| Posted: Tue Dec 25, 2007 4:33 pm Post subject: |
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...
Last edited by desert_traveller on Sun Jun 03, 2012 5:19 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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scot47
Joined: 10 Jan 2003
Posts: 15343
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| Posted: Tue Dec 25, 2007 6:38 pm Post subject: |
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| I can be quite postive about KSA when I am in a good mood but I have to agree with the last poster. NEVER, EVER come to KSA on a business visa ! |
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vuloshin
Joined: 02 Oct 2004
Posts: 23
Location: Buffalo, NY USA
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| Posted: Tue Dec 25, 2007 7:30 pm Post subject: |
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Well, the employer just e-mailed me and said he will start issuing a WORK visa tomorrow. This is making me really nervous. I don't know what to do. I didn't even have a formal job interview with these people.
I was really excited when the job ad said it was only a 6 month contract because going there for the first time I wouldn't know if I'd like it or not even being a convert to Islam.
Mouse5: Is Oxford Academy a franchise? I think that is the franchise I might be working with here.
Is 30 contact teaching hours per week a lot?
Could I live on 4500 SAR my first month?
Could I save money the 5 months I would make 9000 SAR (in Jubail, I think)? |
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