Job Discussion Forums

[elliot_spencer]

I have been offered a job with a university just outside of Shanghai. Offer is for 19 face - to - face teaching hours. The pay is 8000RMB per month with an allowance for accommodation at 4000RMB so in total that is 12,000RMB a month. Is that a good salary? I mean for those who have been in Korea, schools there pay like 13,000 to 14,000 RMB and I am sure that Seoul is more expensive than shanghai!!

Thanks guys

[alter ego]

That's a pretty good salary for China. It's a uni job, which is better than a hagwon gig any day of the week. It's decent pay for the hours (figure around 100 rmb per class hour) plus you get winter and summer breaks. China is generally less expensive than Korea and a nicer place to live and teach. Unless you're a party animal or lead a lavish lifestyle, you can live comfortably on that salary/housing allowance and still save money. If you have a uni offer in Korea it's a coin toss and depends on where you want to live and teach. If not, jump on it!

[elliot_spencer]

Thanks for your reply. The winter break is paid but the summer is not, the contract will be from the start of July and if it's renewed there will be a payment of 8000RMB and during the summer I won't receive a salary but I will continue to receive the allowence of 4000RMB. In Seoul it's for the SMpensiOE so a public school, with 12 salaries a year. So, would u still give the same advice? I've not been to Seoul or Shanghai but I was thinking Seoul would be an easier place to live, am I wrong? Also, is Shanghai cheaper than Seoul? Also, in Korea there is a pension plan but in China no.

Thanks

[alter ego]

I've lived in Seoul (outside metro area) but I haven't lived in Shanghai. If I were you I'd take the uni job in China. Public school jobs in Korea can be rough, so can uni jobs but at least it's higher education and the kids are older and generally more mature. Public school jobs are generally 40-hour work weeks, 8 AMish to 5 PMish schedules with office hours. Uni gigs are generally teaching your scheduled classes and then going back to your apartment. I prefer the freedom and flexibility in that, others prefer the extra money.

You'll probably do a lot more teacher busy work in Korea, testing, marking homework, and grading. Uni gigs in China are generally easier in the paperwork department. You won't get the pension plan, which means more money for you in Korea, but I've taught middle and high school kids in Korea and for me teaching Chinese university students is much more enjoyable.

I'm sure others here can give you some good advice. How soon do you have to decide?

[elliot_spencer]

What did you think about Seoul? I have been to Japan and imagine Seoul being a bit like living in a Japanese city! I have a degree in TESOL and CELTA grade A. I am currently applying to do the DELTA and then I plan on doing a MA. I am in this job for life . Do you t5hink its easier to live in China than ROK?

I was also attracted to Korea as the SMOE offer a pension plan, which if u plan on being in this game for a while really helps. Also, is China really cheaper than Seoul?

[ShanghaiSurprise]

I live in Seoul and work for a good university. To give you an idea of my situation here, I get a free 2-bedroom apartment and make a lot of won per year including overtime/extra stuff.

For me, I can't wait to get to China because I like to earn extra money on top of my salary. In Korea, if you want to do privates you live the life of an undercover spy, always walking forward but looking over your shoulder. However, with that said, I think you earn more in Korea (on average) than in China for privates. From everything I know and hear, China is much more relaxed in general.

Downsides of Korea:

In Korea you had better marry a Korean girl to get the F-visa. If not, you're always going to be swimming upstream, and never really getting anywhere. Having an E-2 visa is very limiting, as I'll mention later.

In my opinion, Korea doesn't really care for CELTA or DELTA, mainly because their education system is drooling over the USA. Same reason the students don't know what IELTS is, but they all are aware of TOEFL.

If you get your DELTA and MA, I believe you would be much more appreciated in China. Also, if you are in this for life, please understand that since China is so much larger in terms of population, you will be able to find many more opportunities.

Now, some people will say "yes, more opportunities, but also many more competitors."

However, if you get DELTA, then there will be almost no one with that, comparatively speaking, and therefore you'll be very unique. Also, remember from above that I said that Korea doesn't care for your DELTA.

Korea has TONS of MA's, so you'll just be "some guy" here. In fact, it's basically a pre-requisite at any decent job. In China, I still know of a lot of people that have good jobs with only a BA. I can verify this by seeing their resume on the school's website because it's up for show for students to see.

In Korea, exchange rates are also a problem. Currently, Korea's exchange rate is getting a bit better, but in general it's unstable. China has less foreign exchange risk because China tries to control its currency.


Please, also understand that from a long-term perspective, I think China might offer you more.

1) Travelling internationally from China is cheaper than from Korea (sheer numbers... volume of travellers keep the price down...)
2) Travelling within China is cheap and can be dirt-cheap if you go to the right cities.
3) China has so many cities, big and small worth working in. Korea, as almost anyone will tell you, revolves around Seoul. Busan is developed, but the entire country feels that Seoul is where everything is.
4) Clothing in China is cheaper than in Korea (Korea protects itself from outside competition)
5) Shopping in general just has more options. In Korea, most things you buy are Korean. The government rarely lets in competition, and when it does, it taxes them huge. Iphone and Blackberry are FINALLY just coming to Korea....that says it all. (Blackberry will only be available to businesses to start.) Seriously, protectionism at it's finest.


I'm sure there are going to be a lot of people that disagree with some of my points, but as I've said many times, they are just my opinion.



I'm in the running for some good jobs in China, (not in Beijing/Shanghai) and I can't wait to go there; by September 2010 I'll be in China. Not only do I know my money will go further in China, but I also think long-term I have 100 times more chances in China because it's more "open" in my opinion.

Just realize, on an E-2 visa in Korea you are really held back. I think you lose a lot of freedom in this country for extra legal work and having multiple jobs on the go. If you want to work hard, then Korea isn't the place in my opinion.

In China, you might not always make as much "foreign currency" like USD, but the money you're earning in China will give you a much better life than in Korea.

Finally, renting an apartment in Korea is BRUTAL. Your deposit is SOOOO much it's not even worth mentioning. And even then you have to pay HUGE rent on top of that. If you're willing to always be tied to the string of your employer, then you're okay in Korea. But having your own housing means if things ever go wrong then you're a bit safer. In Korea, that's so hard, and trust me, renting really is brutal.

Please realize that regular department university jobs don't include housing. They have LOW hours, and tons of vacation, but apartments are your own responsibility. You'd better have $10,000 USD ready for a low-end deposit ...and even then you're still gonna pay tons in rent. If you want a good apartment then your deposit will be a lot more, and don't think "good" apartment means "great". It just means "good" as in better than what all the regular foreign teachers get. I'm hardly impressed with housing here. I get mine free and I'm guessing it would be expensive if I had to pay for it on my own.

If you want more info on Seoul, feel free to message me. I don't check this account much because I'm normally watching the Korean forum, but given my upcoming move to China, I'll be coming to this forum more often.

Oh by the way, the public school jobs in Korea pay what you said, but don't forget that their housing is free. So their 13000 rmb per month is including housing, which would have to be compared to your 8000 rmb per month.

To be honest, in Shanghai I don't think 8000 is a lot. I was offered a free 1-bedroom apartment and 18000 rmb last year in Shanghai but turned it down for my job here in Korea.

When you get your DELTA and MA I'll tell you where to make at least that kind of money money in China.

Take care, and good luck.