Job Discussion Forums

[AndrewR]

I ask because I have no college degree (and can't afford to get one) but I'm pretty sure I can ace the CELTA with a Pass-A grade.
Would a degree holder with a lower pass level or a less prestigious TEFL cert still have an advantage with employers?

*I'm asking this only for the countries where one can get a legal work visa without a college degree. I don't want to work illegally.

thanks

[Justin Trullinger]

Have to see the whole resume- for a lot of countries, as you rightly observe, the degree holder would be the only option. So no fair comparing.

Assuming a place where the degree isn't necessary to get a visa, I'd also need to know about:

Age. Not having a degree isn't necessarily a barrier in Ecuador, but not being old enough to have one often is.

Degree area. Some are more relevant to teaching and to languages than others.

Work experience. Any relevant experience? When you weren't getting a degree, what were you doing? How can it relate?

Alternative education. Look, not having a degree is one thing...but teaching does, or should, mean that you value education. If you don't have a degree (and I have hired and worked with excellent non-degree holders), what do you have? If you don't show that you value your own education, frankly that's a black mark, in my book.

Three other things-

One) Not to bring you down, but I don't see how you can be sure you can ace the CELTA. My experience of CELTA grads is that most found the grading criteria a little erratic, hard to understand even AFTER a grade was awarded. Knowing beforehand seems next to impossible.

Two) No matter what grade you get, I think you're exaggerating the importance of the grade. I've worked with CELTA grads from all grade bands, and have not found that those with higher grades work out any better than others. Sometimes the contrary. THe grading criteria on the CELTA may not always relate to likelyhood of success in the workplace, and most employers will know this. I'm answering questions about "Degree vs CELTA" as relevantly as I can, but want to be clear. When I'm considering resumes, having CELTA counts. THe grade you got on it is of passing interest, at best. Less significant than a LOT of other elements of your application.

Three) The "lesser cert" comment is going to wind some people up. Nobody is going to argue that CELTA isn't the most famous EFL/ESL certificate qualification on the market. But this just means well known. Most people wouldn't argue that it's truly superior to other qualifications of similar standing, just better known.


Best,
Justin


PS- didn't vote, for the reasons mentioned.

[denise]

Justin raised a lot of good points (and yes, the "lesser cert" comment can be offensive--I have one of those non-name-brand certs, and as far as I know it has never hindered me). Still, I voted, assuming that all other factors were equal. If two candidates were the same age, had similar work backgrounds, and both had TEFL certificates from ANY reputable program, I'd choose the degree-holder. Why? Because it shows a commitment to education (despite the cost and the time involved in getting a degree) and a respect for educational institutions--factors that I think are crucial for teachers.

I get the impression that listing what pass grade you got on a CELTA is sort of like recent grads listing their GPAs--nice, but probably not a deciding factor, and just used to pad a CV.

d

[Sashadroogie]

Some good points made by Justin.

However, another factor that needs to be considered is that student perception. They themselves are normally drawn from the higher educated sections of society and really view with suspicion a teacher who doesn't hold a degree. They cannot see how a non-degree holder, i.e. an uneducated person in their opinion, could possiby work in an academic role, or ever teach them something. Even holding a degree in a non-linguistic field raises some learners' eyebrows. How many times have we heard the question, "What's your real job, Teacher?" Naturally, when it comes to recruiting teachers, non-degree holders then pose problems. Many past colleagues who didn't have degrees were told in no uncertain terms by the school-owners to never, ever divulge this to the students. Students are usually not so progressive when it comes to evaluating other relevant skills or experience. I have known students, usually corporate clients, who require to see the teacher's CV before accepting them in the classroom. Obviously, not having a degree would disadvantage you out of the post in that situation. Sorry.

[norwalkesl]

[Glenski]

I don't think whatever grade you get matters. Neither does GPA in many countries.

You have the CELTA or you don't. That's what concerned employers look at. Not the grade.

[denise]

[AndrewR]

[AndrewR]

[spiral78]

But I've always had an intuitive grasp of language/grammar/spelling, etc and was always at the top of my class for those subjects in high school

While I'm not going to say you couldn't 'ace' a CELTA or equivalent course, I would like to point out that an entry-level teacher training course is focused on much more than a candidate's grasp of the language.

Obviously a good grasp of English is a vital piece of the puzzle, but the ability to convey language points effectively to a variety of students is a very different skill set.

Some of the least successful teachers I've had to work with have been those with post grad degrees in English, for example, but who were very weak in terms of working with students IN the language, as opposed to presenting it in all its glory...

[naturegirl321]

The degree holder. Just because they passed normally and not with honours doesn't really matter. In many countries you must have a degree to get a job, so that person would get it over the one without a degree.

[AndrewR]

OK, then it's unanimous: I'm SOL.
With this global recession turning TEFL into a buyer's instead of a seller's market, with an increased supply of degreed applicants, I shouldn't even waste my time getting started. Correct?

[spiral78]

As I've said before, you have a reasonable shot at newbie level jobs in Central/Eastern Europe where a BA isn't required and where professionalism and a responsible attitude are valued.

The problem comes if you want to do it long-term. You won't be competitive for the few 'better' jobs around without a degree, and a newbie-level salary is really just enough to get by. To save up for the future would be extremely difficult.

[naturegirl321]

[norwalkesl]