Job Discussion Forums

[Sashadroogie]

One of my previous DOSes had a habit of going through fresh student feedback and questionnaires and tossing the Japanese and the Swiss German sheets straight into the bin. When I asked him why, he replied that the feedback was as good as useless as it told him nothing. The Japanese never complained about anything, never had a critical remark worth mentioning, while the Swiss Germans were the polar opposite, even to the point of insisting that bad weather was the fault of the administration. At least that was the way of it in that school.

Not sure what cultural foibles were behind these different approaches to feedback, though I'd guess that 'face' would explain a lot about Asian feedback. So, wide open question: are there any specific cultural aspects that influence students' feedback re their classes etc where you work/teach?

[johnslat]

Dear Sashadroogie,

Well, pretty much the usual: if a student doesn't like a teacher (often because the teacher is a "hard marker", won't mark the student present when he/she is actually absent, etc.) there could be derogatory feedback.

Teachers who are "easy" - don't assign homework, "help" students out with grades, mark them present even when they're not - can get positive feedback.

But, of course, not all - or even that many - students play it that way, at least in my experience, thank God.

Regards,
John

[gaijinalways]

The Japanese students here range in extremes in lodging complaints; from not reporting the teacher for not showing up for the first 5 classes until after the 5th time (though this happened a few years ago), to complaints about never using the textbook when it was used every class .

It used to be in Japan that teachers were gods; short of killing your student (and getting caught red handed) teachers had a free pass. Nowadays, forgetting a student's name once can get you on their bad side and may lead to very many negative survey results as that student may try to convince their friends in the same class to comment badly about your teaching.

Or complaints to the admin if the student's grades don't meet their satisfaction, regardless of the lack of merit behind the complaint. In recent years I have gotten the first complaints about Cs where as before students only tried to avoid failing (which some of the unis here still don't allow, mine does ). Now we are required in some cases to give makeup exams or work even when the reasons stated for missing classes are dubious at best.

We have also had parents now coming to confirm if their sons and/or daughters are going to their classes (this is also the most common reason for some students failing, just simply not bothering to turn up). Sometimes it comes down to all the teachers saying the student has not been turning up all term, even while the student is telling their parents how they have been faithfully attending every class, and of course the teachers are out to get him/her.

The admin unfortunately tends to look upon the students as 'piggybanks', and often doesn't want to boot out even obvious bums, as long as they have a few spare coins. It puts teachers in the unenviable position of having to teach students sometimes multiple times for the same courses until students can graduate in a 'speedy' 8 years.

[naturegirl321]

Student feedback has to be taken with a grain of salt. It basically comes down to whether the student likes the teacher or not.

[johnslat]

Dear naturegirl321,

"It basically comes down to whether the student likes the teacher or not."

Rather like the way we tend to elect our presidents, senators, representatives, etc. in democracies.
Facts, qualifications, and abilities are so often totally irrelevant.

Regards,
John

[evolving81]

I know I don't have the experience of some of you so I could be dead wrong. Also, I don't know what the feedback instrument consisted of in this particular case but perhaps the feedback instrument could be adapted to receive positive and critical responses.

[Deicide]

[Justin Trullinger]

And politics too?



J

[LoPresto]

"Rather like the way we tend to elect our presidents, senators, representatives, etc. in democracies.
Facts, qualifications, and abilities are so often totally irrelevant"

I guess I WILL be the next President of the USA then!

Thank God. He knows I need a new "job".

[johnslat]

Dear Justin,

"And politics too?"

Good heavens - doesn't EVERYONE hate politics, except, of course, for the politicians, all the innumerable "hanger-ons" (Hmmm, or should that be "hangers-on?" "Hangers-on," I believe) and the lobbyists.

Regards,
John

[Justin Trullinger]

I don't know- as pretty much an outsider, politics is a heck of a lot more fun to watch than say, soap operas.

About student feedback on teachers- the instruments of feedback have to be pretty carefully designed, don't they?

In Ecuador, we use anonymous surveys, frequently solicit verbal feedback, and (maybe most significantly) watch indicators like attendance, punctuality, and performance of students. Peer observation and director observation also play a role.

THe biggest thing though, is that the interpreters of the information we get like this HAVE to be well immersed in Ecuadorian culture. YOu have to hear what students say and know what it means to them.

When I hear things like "the teacher is unfriendly," for example, as a native Iowan, I picture a grumpy teacher, surly and short with students.

Within Ecuador, though- "unfriendly" is often a code for "I don't know him or her very well." And that tends to mean that a teacher isn't sharing much about his or her life. (In the US, it seems like teachers often don't. But a lot of latin people can't feel they know you if they don't know at least a bit about your family, your life outside of class, etc.)


Best,
Justin

[johnslat]

Dear Justin,

"THe biggest thing though, is that the interpreters of the information we get like this HAVE to be well immersed in Ecuadorian culture. YOu have to hear what students say and know what it means to them."

A VERY good point. You can't automatically assume that the students' answers in whatever country you're in will be just like, say, the answers of students back home. The same words CAN mean different things.

Regards,
John

[naturegirl321]

[Deicide]

This is what I truly hate about EFL. It is totally random and arbitrary and has precious little to do with your knowledge or your ability to transfer that knowledge to others. This epecially true when you teach children but also true in a different way with adults. It's all about whether they like you or not or if they are having a bad day or not or whatever. Moreover some people think because they are taking an English class they will leave that class speaking fluent English (I have also seen idiot monoglot Anglophones with this same attitude regarding other languages). I want to work in a field where it is about my competence, my knowledge and my ability to complete work well not random moodiness, edutainment and all the other bullshit I so hate...I once had a closet gay guy who had a crush on me in one of my classes and because I didn't reciprocate his 'interest' he whinged to the boss and I got sacked. Another example is little Korean brats complaining about the white monkey sweating in the summer when it is nearly 40 degrees (imagine that)....by all the gods I hate this mierda.

[johnslat]

Dear Deicide,

Any job where you deal with the public has pretty much the same downsides.

Maybe you should push paper, instead.

And, as I implied, student evaluations have never been a problem for me since the vast majority of my students don't let personal feelings get in the way (besides which, I pay well for good evaluations.)


Regards,
John