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Options with an MA
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sisyphus



Joined: 20 Sep 2009
Posts: 170

PostPosted: Sat Nov 21, 2009 7:09 pm    Post subject: Options with an MA Reply with quote

What options do you have with an MA(Tefl) ? For example in the ME? Universities, International schools? Where are the rotational contracts as thats something which interests me...cheers..yours Sisyphus
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spanglish



Joined: 21 May 2009
Posts: 742
Location: working on that

PostPosted: Sat Nov 21, 2009 10:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

In Colombia you could get a great deal with a university. For example, I know of a girl who has a masters and teaches at a major university here for 4 hours once a week. She makes $750/month, which is pretty good for half a day a week.

But I know of another girl with a masters (but no prior experience) who teaches at 2 prestigious private universities (which are located more than an hour apart). She's making an hourly wage on part time contracts and it's the same that a fresh CELTA would get, around $15-$17/hour, good for a CELTA, not so much for a masters.
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Glenski



Joined: 15 Jan 2003
Posts: 12844
Location: Hokkaido, JAPAN

PostPosted: Sat Nov 21, 2009 11:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just an MA will not be good enough for most uni jobs in Japan.

Pick a country, and perhaps options will be clearer. Also, if all you have is the degree, what's it in, and how much experience do you have? Any publications? Language fluency?
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GambateBingBangBOOM



Joined: 04 Nov 2003
Posts: 2021
Location: Japan

PostPosted: Sun Nov 22, 2009 4:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

You would be able to teach ESL in universities in your own country. Not in Japan, though. There is status placed on learning ESL in an inner circle country (US, UK, Canada, Australia, New Zealand, etc) in Japan, though.
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Chris_Crossley



Joined: 26 Jun 2004
Posts: 1797
Location: Still in the centre of Furnace City, PRC, after eight years!!!

PostPosted: Sun Nov 22, 2009 6:47 am    Post subject: You may need the DELTA to teach ESL at uni in the UK Reply with quote

GambateBingBangBOOM wrote:
You would be able to teach ESL in universities in your own country. Not in Japan, though. There is status placed on learning ESL in an inner circle country (US, UK, Canada, Australia, New Zealand, etc) in Japan, though.


Without the DELTA or the Trinity Diploma in TESOL, you might find it difficult, if not just simply impossible, to get a job teaching ESL at a university in the UK even if you have a master's.

I should know because I found out that one university in England has (or at least the three tutors who interviewed me have) an almost snobbish, elitist attachment to these qualifications. It seems that, without holding at least one of them, one has virtually no chance of landing such a job.

I have 4 1/2 years of experience in teaching EAP plus two master's degrees in education and an MBA, all from UK universities, but that wasn't good enough for those three tutors, apparently.
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sisyphus



Joined: 20 Sep 2009
Posts: 170

PostPosted: Sun Nov 22, 2009 8:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks. Im amazed by that Chris. It sums up everything I dont like about Britain. I suspect however that there were 'other' reasons why you never got the job which have absolutely nothing to do with you. My brother wasted his time at an interview with Cheshire Council last week-they had already selected an internal candidate. I have 14 years EFL experience, have been dos at my own language school so im interested possibly in business development aswell as just efl teaching. I dont have any formal efl quals.thats why I plan to do the MA Tesol.I thought for Universities worldwide would be more aposite than a Delta. Im not interested in returning to teach in UK. Probably MEast. Ideally some rotational type jobs although that I think is unlikely.
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Dedicated



Joined: 18 May 2007
Posts: 972
Location: UK

PostPosted: Sun Nov 22, 2009 3:31 pm    Post subject: EAP accreditation Reply with quote

At present, since the new immigration laws earlier this year, UK universities (and language schools) are under great pressure to qualify as Tier 4 sponsors.

To be a Tier 4 sponsor, you must be an education provider that offers courses of study to students, but the courses must be accredited. At university level, you must be inspected and have valid accreditation by QAA and/or Ofsted. Language schools must be accredited by a British Council scheme, Accreditation UK.

At universities, accreditation includes being a member of BALEAP (British Association of Lecturers in EAP), and all staff must have a relevant MA and the DELTA.

This may explain why they didn't accept you - but they could have told you!
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Chris_Crossley



Joined: 26 Jun 2004
Posts: 1797
Location: Still in the centre of Furnace City, PRC, after eight years!!!

PostPosted: Sun Nov 22, 2009 3:37 pm    Post subject: Re: EAP accreditation Reply with quote

Dedicated wrote:
At universities, accreditation includes being a member of BALEAP (British Association of Lecturers in EAP), and all staff must have a relevant MA and the DELTA. This may explain why they didn't accept you - but they could have told you!


That figures - they did not tell me any such thing at all! Evil or Very Mad

I would call this failure (or "oversight", as they would have euphemistically dubbed this) a dereliction of their duty, not just their actual failure to check my credentials properly to see that I actually don't have the DELTA or equivalent that caused me to waste my time and money in coming halfway around the world to see them in the depths of winter when there were snow and slush on the ground, picture postcard-ish though that may have been for the locals...


Last edited by Chris_Crossley on Mon Nov 23, 2009 11:01 am; edited 1 time in total
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DaveW125



Joined: 18 Feb 2007
Posts: 54

PostPosted: Mon Nov 23, 2009 10:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

What about international schools? Some schools have TEFL departments so would an MA in TESOL be enough to get you into a job there or would a teaching cert still be required?
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spiral78



Joined: 05 Apr 2004
Posts: 11534
Location: On a Short Leash

PostPosted: Mon Nov 23, 2009 11:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Depends. Most want certification + experience in your home country. Further, int'l school jobs simply aren't that abundant...I am not sure I would aim specifically to get quals for one, unless I had some contacts who could get me into one of the relatively rare openings.
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Chris_Crossley



Joined: 26 Jun 2004
Posts: 1797
Location: Still in the centre of Furnace City, PRC, after eight years!!!

PostPosted: Mon Nov 23, 2009 11:09 am    Post subject: Getting a job at an international school with/without an MA Reply with quote

DaveW125 wrote:
What about international schools? Some schools have TEFL departments so would an MA in TESOL be enough to get you into a job there or would a teaching cert still be required?


If one wanted to teach in an international school in Europe, a teaching certificate that allows one to teach in state-run schools in one's own country is an absolute must because I do not believe that any such school would consider a candidate who did not have one.

On the other hand, it may (and I use this modal advisedly!) be possible to get a job in China without one, although that largely depends upon whom one approaches for a job.

A friend and former colleague of mine at a state-run primary school in China that we both worked at (I worked there for one year, he did for three years) went to a joint-venture Chinese-Canadian school in Dalian for two years in spite of the fact that he was not qualified to teach in state-run schools in his country and possessed only a CELTA and three years of primary teaching experience.

However, because he was neither so qualified nor Canadian, he could only take an ESOL teaching job that placed him at the bottom of the teachers' pay scale; it was also the only teaching job at that school open to non-Canadians, apparently.

He is now back in his own country pursuing an initial teacher training programme which, when completed successfully, will allow him to teach in state-run secondary schools. (I have been so qualified for the past 14 years.)

As for the idea of gaining some kind of advantage by having an MA, I suppose that it rather depends upon what kind of MA one has. Certainly, one in education may help, yet there is no guarantee that having one will "automatically" lead to a much better chance of teaching in an international school, though it never does anybody any harm to apply to one when armed with this graduate qualification.

I possess two master's degrees in education myself plus an MBA.
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sisyphus



Joined: 20 Sep 2009
Posts: 170

PostPosted: Mon Nov 23, 2009 3:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I am planning to do an MA Applied Linguistics and EFL...I would have thought in many countries that this , for Universities , would be more appropriate than a PGCE...but then again im not sure...
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Chris_Crossley



Joined: 26 Jun 2004
Posts: 1797
Location: Still in the centre of Furnace City, PRC, after eight years!!!

PostPosted: Mon Nov 23, 2009 3:18 pm    Post subject: PGCEs are not needed for teaching at universities Reply with quote

sisyphus wrote:
I am planning to do an MA Applied Linguistics and EFL...I would have thought in many countries that this , for Universities , would be more appropriate than a PGCE...but then again im not sure...


You don't ordinarily need a PGCE to teach at a university since these qualifications are designed for those wishing to teach in the state primary, secondary and FE sectors.

An MA in Applied Linguistics would certainly be of help, though universities, especially those in the UK, may insist that you also have either the Cambridge DELTA or the Trinity Diploma in TESOL, neither of which I have studied for (so far), since it is not a requirement for my present job, nor is it necessarily for me to have it where I'm working now.
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Glenski



Joined: 15 Jan 2003
Posts: 12844
Location: Hokkaido, JAPAN

PostPosted: Mon Nov 23, 2009 10:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

For international schools in Japan, you usually need a teaching license from back home, plus 1-2 years of experience there.
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Pelican_Wrath



Joined: 19 May 2008
Posts: 490

PostPosted: Wed Nov 25, 2009 12:33 pm    Post subject: Re: Getting a job at an international school with/without an Reply with quote

Chris_Crossley wrote:

A friend and former colleague of mine at a state-run primary school in China that we both worked at (I worked there for one year, he did for three years) went to a joint-venture Chinese-Canadian school in Dalian for two years in spite of the fact that he was not qualified to teach in state-run schools in his country and possessed only a CELTA and three years of primary teaching experience.

However, because he was neither so qualified nor Canadian, he could only take an ESOL teaching job that placed him at the bottom of the teachers' pay scale; it was also the only teaching job at that school open to non-Canadians, apparently.


however, it was a pretty good 'gig' as far as ESOL jobs in China go.

According to him, at any rate.

I haven't seen him in a while, the scoundrel. He keeps promising to go for a beer and then not phoning me Laughing
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