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DMcK · Joined: 12 Jun 2008 Posts: 111 Location: Madrid

OK so I apologise if there is a thread somewhere in this giant haystack of a forum but it's not easy to find a thread in a haystack and the search function is pretty poor.

Anyway, I have a bunch of absolute beginners and have been working with them for 2 months.

All but 2 are fine.

Said 2 have had about 8 lessons and I still have to go over the absolute basics every damn time. It's like they have no speaking skills of any kind and forget everything as soon as they even get near it.

I break down every sound and go over it until they get it then expand the sound to eventually get them to repeat a word; this takes a long time. After all this time they can't even remember how to say "I am"; moreover, they even forget the meaning of "I am". It's like I'm teaching people from circa 3 million BC.

I've tried to do it with and without letting them see the words written but it doesn't really make much difference apart from making them say it badly when it's written down.

I understand we all learn in different ways but when it is the very basics what can you do differently to modelling and drilling?

I've even started using some Spanish in there which I hate to do but when the dude tells me he doesn't know the meaning of something I've gone over a hundred times, I just can't spend more time on it and have to move on.

I ask them every time: "Hi, how are you?" and "What's the weather like today?" We've done this every class and still they don't know, even when I repeat the gestures that have worked for everyone else.

Anyone any had any similar experiences or have any ideas about the best way to help them?

Sashadroogie · Posted: Wed Nov 25, 2009 8:26 pm Post subject:

Have said 2 students joined the group late?

spiral78 · Joined: 05 Apr 2004 Posts: 11534 Location: On a Short Leash

Some people are just less talented at languages than others. All you can do is keep trying. If you could open up their heads and put the language in there, well, you'd be rich and famous!

JZer · Joined: 16 Jan 2005 Posts: 3898 Location: Pittsburgh

You have not listed the ages of your students or what kind of class it is. Some students just don't care.

spanglish · Joined: 21 May 2009 Posts: 742 Location: working on that

Yep, I've got a class with the exact same problems. Some possible reasons:
These students are from a lower socio-economic background than my other students. I don't think they've had any university and they certainly didn't attend elite private schools and have native speaking language teachers.

Most importantly, bad learning experiences beget more bad learning experiences. Maybe we can train ourselves to not learn. Some don't seem to take much responsbility for their own learning (i.e. being tuned in during class, taking notes, studying outside of class).

My biggest challenge is with a student who to begin with was my weakest. He didn't come to class for 2 months, then suddenly started coming again.

I've found that I need to lavish personal attention on the weaker students and often use Spanish to get the glazed look off the eyes. Then once the concept is clear, I push them to use it. I'm also pushing them to start a once a week study group (they wanted to do classes twice a week; I told them their money would be better spent studying together for free).

It has been very difficult. If I were starting the class again, I would have made them buy the supplemental exercises book and made a big deal about them doing all the homework. Also, I would incorporate classroom and study strategies into the classes, the types of things that I took for granted but that they apparently aren't aware of.

Learning how to learn is the key. When we have a successful learning experience we can build on that for the next time (i.e. this is how I felt before I got an A on that test and this is what I had to do to get it). I find that if I can give my students a sense of accomplishment, that's a real boost for next time.

Glenski · Joined: 15 Jan 2003 Posts: 12844 Location: Hokkaido, JAPAN

mozzar · Joined: 16 May 2009 Posts: 339 Location: France

I have a similar student in a one-to-one class that refuses to learn because I lack a pair of *beep*. Nevertheless, I've kept at it for two months and am slowly getting a response after trying nearly every damn thing I can think of to get him interested. The worst part is he's recently given up smoking.

DMcK · Joined: 12 Jun 2008 Posts: 111 Location: Madrid

Both are in their 40's. I presume they both have a university education.

I need to give them more homework and make a big deal out of it, I think.

They both want to learn for sure. Their company operates only in Spain and they have no business necessity to learn so it's through free choice they go to the classes (paid for by the company).

JZer - "What kind of class it is"

Is there something I'm missing there because an absolute beginners class is the same regardless, no?

Glenski · Joined: 15 Jan 2003 Posts: 12844 Location: Hokkaido, JAPAN

tommchone · Joined: 27 Oct 2009 Posts: 108

I have been pulling my hair out over this exact same thing. I teach second year college oral English; ALL of my students are English majors. Some of them have had formal schooling in English for ten years and can't say ANYTHING in English unless they've memorized it or are reading it. I expressed my concern to one of the administrators; i.e. how did they manage to pass FIRST year college English (not to mention all of the high school, middle school, primary.....etc.). He didn't know and I got the impression he didn't care. I'm just hammering away (repetition) and I have offered some of the more advanced students extra credit to tutor them outside of class. It's working with a couple of them, but there are still some students who CAN NOT, WILL NOT, DON'T WANNA. I don't have an answer. You can lead the horse to water........

santi84 · Joined: 14 Mar 2008 Posts: 1317 Location: under da sea

I have seen in my French class (I am a student in the class).

I sit next to a woman who is 50 years old (she has an old BA in Lit), and still can't respond to simple questions about weather or time. Other students are able to have full conversations in fluent French.

She tells me she has trouble for a variety of reasons- she is shy, she is ashamed that her pronunciation is so poor, and she thinks she is "too old" to learn (she wants to learn!). Truthfully, she is pretty bad at even basic French structures ("Je suis... I am") that we reviewed over one year ago.

I wonder if your students experience some of the same feelings? Some people just aren't good at learning a language.

Or they don't care!

JZer · Joined: 16 Jan 2005 Posts: 3898 Location: Pittsburgh

JZer · Joined: 16 Jan 2005 Posts: 3898 Location: Pittsburgh

Chris_Crossley

strictly_nicky · Joined: 14 Apr 2009 Posts: 25

I get at least one of these cases each year--students who just seem totally and utterly hopeless, whose brain possess language centers impervious to new knowledge of L2.

This year, I have a private student, 17 years old, in Bachillerato (equivalent I guess to the last two years of HS in the States). In school they're using a text which prepares them for FCE. Meanwhile, my student is incapable of understanding and answering any question more complicated than "How are you?"

And of course, since I'm basically working as his private tutor, if he gets bad grades on his exams at school on Future Perfect, Future Conditional, or Dependent Prepositions or whatever the hell else, then that obviously reflects poorly on me as his teacher, and therefore Mami and Papi are clearly entitled to think poorly of me. Rolling Eyes

If this kid gave a flying rat's ass, he could probably study, read, do extra work outside of class, and maybe remedy the situation. But he just doesn't.

Yes, if a student doesn't care about learning, that's tough to deal with.
If they're one of those that's just not naturally linguistically inclined, also.
But a combination of those two...ouch.