Job Discussion Forums

umpotato · Joined: 17 Nov 2009 Posts: 10

Hello, I hope this is the correct place to post.

I'm having a hard time deciding which course to take in Australia.

I am 24 and do not have a degree or any experience, and am hoping to teach for a few years - preferably in Russia or Ukraine or similar - but not really fussy.

The only courses I have come across are:
Teach International, Australasian Training Academy and I-to-I. To me I-to-I isn't as appealing as the other two but I'm really not sure.
I am located in Melbourne and also would be willing to do the course overseas.

Which course would be best suited to somebody who has no degree and experience? Any other suggestions for me? I would be able to do classroom based courses, however I haven't come across any offered in Melbourne yet.

I have been in contact with these course providers and honestly they only convince me that they want my money! I can include links to the courses but I am not sure if this is against forum rules.

Cheers, Danny

norwalkesl · Joined: 22 Oct 2009 Posts: 366 Location: Ch-Ch-Ch-Ch-China

You might want to consider a CELTA to get yourself more interest from employers. With your qualifications you are limited to China, Russia/CIS, Eastern Europe, Mexico and Latin America. You will definitely be getting the lowest salary offers.

You will need to send out more applications than others to get a job, but don't let it discourage you!

umpotato · Joined: 17 Nov 2009 Posts: 10

I was under the impression that CELTA was for already established teachers?

I haven't undertaken higher education after I finished high school, however English was my strongest subject at school (though I'm unaware if this will be relevant to TESOL/CELTA).

Would it be wise for someone like me who is inexperienced to take a CELTA course?

I'm not concerned about course costs or duration, my issue is that as far as I'm aware a $400 TESOL course (I-TO-I) will get me the exact same certificate as a $3000 TESOL course (TI, ATA) in the eyes of employers - however I want to learn as much as I can though before I do teaching.

Teach International claim that their Certificate IV is CELTA equivalent, but would I be right in assuming that employers would not accept this to be the case?

Cheers, Danny

GambateBingBangBOOM · Joined: 04 Nov 2003 Posts: 2021 Location: Japan

Chris_Crossley

According to the Cambridge ESOL website, there are 18 centres in Australia that currently offer the CELTA, four of which are stated as being in Melbourne.

The relevant link is below:

http://cambridgeesol-centres.org/centres/teaching/search.do?source=teacheraward&country=AU&qualification=10&Input=Search.

umpotato · Joined: 17 Nov 2009 Posts: 10

I will call some of the CELTA schools tomorrow, however I'm not confident about getting accepted as from looking at the applications they appear to prefer people with tertiary education.

Getting a degree right now is not something I'm willing to do. I don't want to open up a can of worms but personally I rather get work experience in relevant industries where possible instead of going to school.

If CELTA falls through, would I still be worthwhile attending one of the TESOL courses I mentioned?

Cheers, Danny

Chris_Crossley

umpotato · Joined: 17 Nov 2009 Posts: 10

Well the CELTA courses don't start until January, so what I will do is get some books from the library and do as much preparation as I can before applying to a CELTA course.

Since five schools seem to offer CELTA in Melbourne, I'm hoping I will get accepted into one of them.

I will do a search around, but what would be the best books to read so I am better prepared for CELTA? (I get the impression that it is a very demanding course)

If I don't get accepted to CELTA then I will probably go with the Teach International course, purely because it provides six hours of teaching practice that doesn't involve just your peers. Both ATA and TI offer job guarantees and job search assistance.

But again, getting a degree right now is not an option for me, as living expenses are horrible in Australia right now and it's not yet a requirement for the countries I'm interested in.

Cheers, Danny

sojourner · Posted: Thu Nov 26, 2009 5:12 am Post subject:

Danny,

As for some essential pre -CELTA reading, try to get hold of some books by Jeremy Harmer or Jim Scrivener.They should be available at the Foreign Languages Bookstore (Collins St ? Bourke St ?), or at Holmes Institute (just across the road from from State Parliament).If you can't get those books in Melbourne, do a google search for the America Bookshop (store ?), Elizabeth St, Brisbane - that's where I obtained my copies a few years ago.

Also get hold of some good books re grammar, esp those that deal with "time lines", a good way to teach students about verb tenses.Try to become familiar with grammatical terms, eg: "past perfect", etc - they'll be referred to a lot during a CELTA course.

If admitted to a CELTA course, don't leave your assignments to the last minute ! As already mentioned, it's a pretty demanding 4 weeks !

Rather than do the 4 weeks course, enquire about doing the p/t 3-months course. I'm not sure if any of the training centres in Melbourne have the 3-months course, but you never know. I did my 4-weeks CELTA course at Holmes - v.good trainers, but I was absolutely exhausted towards the end !

You mentioned something about the costs involved in doing a degree. Being an Australian, you are v.fortunate compared to Americans and Canadians, as you would be covered by HECS;which means, in effect, that you would not have to pay anything until your annual income happens to exceed, I think, 34 K AUD - far in excess than anything that you'll ever earn as an EFL teacher ! (And should your income ever exceed that amount, the repayment, via PAYE, would probably only be around 20-30 AUD pw !). Also, as someone has mentioned, Aust has a number of v.good unis that provide for distance/online degree programmes. Not having a degree, as someone has already pointed out, will severly limit your chances of getting a reasonable job.

As for getting some actual work experience before heading off o'seas, consider doing some ESL tutoring work at TAFE. I believe that after a couple of months exp they'll even give you a certificate ! Definitely worth considering.

Re CELTA, if you can't get admitted, see if it's possible to do a Trinity course in Melbourne. Another option, if you are planning to travel through SE Asia on your way to Europe , would be to consider doing your CELTA training in Thailand (would be cheaper than doing it in Melbourne - also, the training centres would probably put you in touch with schools that are looking for teachers - after a few weeks in Thailand doing your CELTA , you'll probably soon forget about Russia ! ).

Good luck !

Peter

norwalkesl · Joined: 22 Oct 2009 Posts: 366 Location: Ch-Ch-Ch-Ch-China

umpotato · Joined: 17 Nov 2009 Posts: 10

Thanks for the advice! I will definitely check out that shop.

Today I borrowed "A Practical English Grammar" which appears to be very in depth, and "English Essentials" which is more of an overview.

As for doing CELTA part-time, I too haven't been able to find out if this is available, but will ask when I call around. Also I don't believe Trinity is available in Melbourne either.

I will definitely consider doing my CELTA overseas, I have already done the whole backpacking trip - went from Japan to England all by boat or train. I'm back in Australia temporarily, just sleeping at friends houses so I'm already able to just get up and go back overseas. In all honesty, the sooner the better for me.

Cheers, Danny

Chris_Crossley

umpotato · Joined: 17 Nov 2009 Posts: 10

Well tomorrow I will send off my CELTA applications, I'm sending them out to three different schools, but I guess my main concern is that the application questions were more so a test - OK they claim it's to "raise language awareness" - but it doesn't appear that way to me.

Is this HONESTLY a course that a beginner should take? $3000 AUS is a lot of money (1650 pounds, $2800 US) to blow on failing a course.

Of course I have to pass the application process, which I am doubtful about, but how much grammar should I know at this stage? My concern is that I won't be learning anything during a CELTA course, but instead be tested on what I haven't been taught.

Cheers, Danny

Chris_Crossley

sojourner · Posted: Wed Dec 02, 2009 4:04 pm Post subject:

Danny,

Chris has provided you with some v.good advice.

Apart from having a more positive attitude towards the CELTA "experience" there are a few more things that you might want to consider in order to ensure that you pass the course. At the end of each lesson or segment, don't hesitate to have a word with the trainer if you are not sure of anything.Also, ask the person about the best way to prepare for the next day's lessons/segment - eg, exactly what grammar rules will be covered, which chapter of Harmer's book you should read, etc.

Chris touched on the lessons that you'll be required to teach as part of the course. In these lessons you'll be observed by your fellow-trainees as well as by your trainers. You must be prepared to take some criticism re your performance ! If you are "too sensitive", maybe, you should reconsider your CELTA application ! But, seriously, try not to worry too much about such feedback - maybe, you might pick up some good ideas - also, you may not be aware of some "no-nos" on your part; thus, it's a good idea that someone else IS aware, and, thus, points them out to you.

As I mentioned earlier, don't leave your written assignments to the last minute !

Apart from grammar books, before the course starts do some basic background reading into the SLA (2nd Language Acquisition) process. In my initial posting to this thread I mentioned the names of a couple of the most well-known writers in the field.

Before heading off o'seas, consider getting some basic work experience.In my initial posting I touched on the possibility of getting some tutoring experience through TAFE.

Re the financial cost of doing the CELTA, you might be able to get something back from the Aust Taxation Office ("self-education" expenses, or whatever).Anyway, have a word with your tax consultant re the matter.

Good luck !

Peter