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kungfupanda
Joined: 04 Aug 2009
Posts: 24
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 Posted: Thu Jan 21, 2010 12:07 am Post subject: Is Japan a sinking ship? |
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Does this concern anyone else? Factor this in with a declining population and there is a really big problem. Does anyone think that within the next few years there will be a big shift in ESL teaching? Less people going to Japan perhaps?
Growing up I loved everything from Japan and when I was in college I studied in Chiba prefecture for a year. I'm sad to say but a lot of the news that I read online and the current poor economic situation has led me to the decision to look for another line of work that doesn't involve Japan. Have I made a wise decision or should I still consider going to Japan?
http://www.businessinsider.com/kyle-bass-i-dont-see-how-japan-has-a-way-out-2010-1 |
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Fina1
Joined: 19 Oct 2009
Posts: 22
Location: Philadelphia, PA
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| Posted: Thu Jan 21, 2010 1:02 am Post subject: |
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The video isn't working for me but I can understand what you are saying (I think).
I don't know what country you are from, but in America I don't see things getting much better for a long long time.
Graduating college at the beginning of the economic collapse was really difficult.
I had a 4 year degree from a great university and it took me 7 months to find a job after graduating. I live in a big city with a lot of "opportunities" but so many places had hiring freezes. A lot still do.
And when I did get a job it had absolutely nothing to do with my major. Rather I hired because I had 4 years previous work experience (college part time work). Furthermore, I was hired as a "temp" and had 0 benefits. No time off, no health insurance, etc, while the other employees had excellent health insurance and up to 4 weeks paid vacation time...not to mention personal and sick days.
It wasn't until a year after many of my job applications that I began getting calls back asking me if I was interested in an interview. A year.
My point is: For many people in America, especially recent graduates, it's been extremely difficult finding a job. It hasn't been getting better.
Every day in the news it's one or the other "Unemployment unexpectedly rises/falls." More and more people are still being laid off.
Japan definitely is having a problem with declining population, which will affect ESL and other teaching jobs, but in America there is a problem with too many people and not enough jobs.
For me, going to Japan to teach is going to be a good thing. I decided to leave this job because no benefits, poor salary, not what I enjoy doing, and zero time off (which wouldn't be so bad if all of the employees had it the same way)...
I am very glad I was hired to teach in Japan because I just found out that the place I work at is having major construction on our building and it will be closed for a while this year (during that time I wouldn't be paid), and two years from now they don't think we will even exist. My position is part of a major medical college that is having to cut back because of the economy.
So Japan for me! I get to do a job that I will enjoy (always wanted to go into teaching) and I get to be in a country I have always been fascinicated about. I will pay for healthcare but I can rely on it. (I had to go on medicaid here in the U.S. because healthcare was too expensive).
I will also be getting paid more and I know that I will have job security for a year.
Will my contract get renewed? I hope so. If not, will I will be able to find more work in Japan? I hope so.
If I had stayed in the U.S. would I have had enough money to pay for rent for the rest of this year? No. Would I have been able to find another job that will pay me enough? Probably not...at least not quickly enough for me to keep rent while I look. 7 months again? I'm not doing that again.
Doing something I don't really enjoy? No thanks.
So if you really want to go to Japan and really want to teach ESL then it's a wise decision. If things get back you can always come back.
Hey, things weren't going well here for me and that's why I am leaving.
TLDR:
As to answer your questions:
Does it concern me? Yes, because I am going to Japan to teach English and I would like to stay there (if all goes well). However I am confident in my abilities and believe I will be a great asset to the company or that I wouldn't have too much trouble being hired elsewhere.
A shift in the ESL teaching? Probably. I wouldn't be surprised if there is already a major shift. More people seeking individual classes to get out of high prices from schools. Less schools popping up. Maybe.
Less people going to Japan: Maybe. People will always want to go and always be looking for opportunities. If it's not ESL then maybe there will be another niche market for foreigners. Although they may have to learn the language.
Wise decision: If you enjoy Japan and enjoy/think you'll enjoy teaching, then yes. |
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Apsara
Joined: 20 Sep 2005
Posts: 2142
Location: Tokyo, Japan
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| Posted: Thu Jan 21, 2010 1:11 am Post subject: |
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| There has already been a major shift. It was happening already but Nova's collapse in 2007 accelerated it. Salaries have been declining for over a decade now, still plenty of people arriving to fill fewer jobs with worse conditions, and that will continue probably until the economies in the main English-speaking countries start picking up again. There are still good jobs out there but they seem to be getting a lot harder for people to find. |
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flyer
Joined: 16 May 2003
Posts: 539
Location: Sapporo Japan
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| Posted: Thu Jan 21, 2010 1:31 am Post subject: |
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Yes, as pointed out above, things haven't been good lately and with the population expected to go down (and the Nova fallout), the old days of the bubble are well and truely gone
But, then many other countries (if not all?) are having difficulties too. Personally, I am glad I am not working back in my home country right now. There have been hugh lay offs etc etc
If its just money you are after, then maybe somewhere else might be better? but for how long? there are so many variables no matter where you look, you never really know how things will turn out.
I like Japan, I like the lifestyle, culture, people etc. If its true that the chances of getting a good job are getting more difficult and wages are going down, people aren't stupid. Less will want to come (eventually, word gets around) and if less come, that means more work for those that are here, ... at least thats the theory?
another thing, this financial crisis has strengened the Japanese yen, so in effect given me a wage rise (when I send it home) |
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Glenski
Joined: 15 Jan 2003
Posts: 12844
Location: Hokkaido, JAPAN
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| Posted: Thu Jan 21, 2010 2:26 am Post subject: Re: Is Japan a sinking ship? |
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| kungfupanda wrote: |
| Does this concern anyone else? |
Yes.
| Quote: |
| Factor this in with a declining population and there is a really big problem. |
Yes, indeed.
| Quote: |
| Does anyone think that within the next few years there will be a big shift in ESL teaching? |
ESL is for places like the USA, UK, Canada, etc. You mean EFL. And, to answer the question, the shift has already taken place, and will continue to shift, in Japan and everywhere. Japan's declining birthrate is a major influence, as is the wishy-washy governmental practices towards education, as is immigration's policies. There is no reason to think that even if NOVA remained, EFL teaching in Japan would have remained unchanged.
| Quote: |
| Less people going to Japan perhaps? |
Fewer? Perhaps. So far, no real noticeable difference as far as I can see. Perhaps a difference would be what type of people come (as in what nationalities and what career-changers). So, some of the causes come from without, not within.
| Quote: |
| a lot of the news that I read online and the current poor economic situation has led me to the decision to look for another line of work that doesn't involve Japan. Have I made a wise decision or should I still consider going to Japan? |
Personally, I find it impossible to answer this without knowing you a heckuva lot more. |
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GambateBingBangBOOM
Joined: 04 Nov 2003
Posts: 2021
Location: Japan
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| Posted: Thu Jan 21, 2010 9:31 am Post subject: Re: Is Japan a sinking ship? |
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| Quote: |
| Is Japan a Sinking Ship? |
Yep. So are a lot of countries right now, but Japan has more serious problems. I think I read somewhere that although Japan's problems seem big (and could be solved by [tax paying, and therefore debt lowering] population increase: immigration, or rapid baby-making beginning about twenty years ago) they are like a prelude to what will happen in Korea- which has a greater population problem, but it isn't as apparent because less people live to be very old there.
| kungfupanda wrote: |
| Does this concern anyone else? Factor this in with a declining population and there is a really big problem. |
Yes. And the declining population was alluded to in the clip.
| Quote: |
Does anyone think that within the next few years there will be a big shift in ESL teaching? Less people going to Japan perhaps? |
Already started. Lower cost foreign language teachers (like those who work for BoEs that pay not-quite enough to live off for a full-time job [after the dispatch companies take their cut]) are already in place. Continued approach towards foreigners as transient people only there for a year or two, and therefore physical appearance and age being important factors in hiring decisions instead of qualifications and experience. It's possible that the only think keeping it going right now is the difficulty in finding jobs in the US, etc right now. If it weren't for Korea's reputation on intercultural relations and the treatment of foreigners, it alone would probably decimate the potential pool of people willing to go to Japan.
| Quote: |
Growing up I loved everything from Japan and when I was in college I studied in Chiba prefecture for a year. I'm sad to say but a lot of the news that I read online and the current poor economic situation has led me to the decision to look for another line of work that doesn't involve Japan. Have I made a wise decision or should I still consider going to Japan? |
Unless you have a pressing reason to go to Japan, then obviously now- and quite likely this decade, if you're thinking of long-term stay, is not a good time to try to set up shop in Japan- especially if you have nothing in the way of qualifications or experience (other than a year studying in college).
That said, it is widely reported that most of the jobs that will need to be done starting in the next decade or more haven't even been invented yet, so that makes it impossible to tell.
Final point on this subject: money isn't everything. Obviously, China will overtake Japan and it's likely that India will also overtake Japan. Anybody who's been in Japan for the last while knows that there will soon be a 1-1 ratio of applicants to university spots in this country [a country in which it is actually illegal to fail kids until senior high school, when there is basically no longer a point- if you fail little Yoshi, the first year senior high schooler, because he got 2% for the year, and make him take the course again, he's still not going to pass if he actually stopped studying or even trying back in grade 5 and so has what amounts to a grade 5.003 education when he's in grade 10]. But because of a 1-1 ratio of applicants to university spots, he'll have a univerisity degree. The result could be a nation of almost entirely uneducated people [less immigrants and Japanese people who studied overseas {as well as the odd few in each class who actually try}] as a workforce as the current workforce retires. |
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southofreality
Joined: 12 Feb 2007
Posts: 579
Location: Tokyo
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| Posted: Sat Jan 30, 2010 7:59 am Post subject: Sinking, But Slowly |
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Working conditions have gotten worse in some of the big Eikaiwa outfits, and salaries have gone down in others.
Are there still lots of opportunities?
If you're flexible and are not expecting too much, yeah there are. |
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fat_chris
Joined: 10 Sep 2003
Posts: 3198
Location: Beijing
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| Posted: Sun Jan 31, 2010 11:18 am Post subject: |
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southofreality, nice to see you here again, man. You always got good quality, highly informative posts.
Regards,
fat_chris |
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starteacher
Joined: 25 Feb 2009
Posts: 237
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| Posted: Sun Jan 31, 2010 2:52 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: |
| If you're flexible and are not expecting too much |
Yep, that's how it's going to go from now folks.
It's 2010 and we're in deep recession, look on the bright side two more years and the world is going to end  |
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flyer
Joined: 16 May 2003
Posts: 539
Location: Sapporo Japan
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| Posted: Mon Feb 01, 2010 7:06 am Post subject: Re: Sinking, But Slowly |
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| southofreality wrote: |
Working conditions have gotten worse in some of the big Eikaiwa outfits, and salaries have gone down in others.
Are there still lots of opportunities?
If you're flexible and are not expecting too much, yeah there are. |
I have a direct hire ALT job with a BOE and my wage will go down next year (this is the 3rd time it has gone down) |
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gaijinalways
Joined: 29 Nov 2005
Posts: 2279
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| Posted: Mon Feb 01, 2010 7:52 am Post subject: |
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Things are much worse, but as noted, that is going on all over with few exceptions.
GambateBingBangBOOM posted
| Quote: |
| If it weren't for Korea's reputation on intercultural relations and the treatment of foreigners, it alone would probably decimate the potential pool of people willing to go to Japan. |
I hesitate to say this, but Japan is hardly a better place for the above matters. I think more of the teachers in Korea have been coming become the currency was decimated in Korea as well as at least here a worker's work visa belongs to the worker, not the company. |
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Imseriouslylost
Joined: 09 Nov 2009
Posts: 123
Location: Tokyo
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| Posted: Mon Feb 01, 2010 9:36 am Post subject: |
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| gaijinalways wrote: |
Things are much worse, but as noted, that is going on all over with few exceptions.
GambateBingBangBOOM posted
| Quote: |
| If it weren't for Korea's reputation on intercultural relations and the treatment of foreigners, it alone would probably decimate the potential pool of people willing to go to Japan. |
I hesitate to say this, but Japan is hardly a better place for the above matters. I think more of the teachers in Korea have been coming become the currency was decimated in Korea as well as at least here a worker's work visa belongs to the worker, not the company. |
I think people teaching in Japan underestimate how bad Korea can be. From over there it must look like a sweet deal and sometimes it is.
However, it does vary a lot from person to person, job to job, location to location. I think that at its very best its on a par with Japan at its very worse (in terms of discrimination and how you're treated overall outside of work). I haven't lived in Japan but I have friends who've done both countries and have read hundreds of pages of information on this (forums, mostly). The inane crap I hear foreigners complaining about on Gaijinpot serves to buffer my theory as well
The visa thing is a big deal for me, too. I've had my legal status here completely controlled and manipulated by an insane person (literally) who thought he was above the law. Indeed, he was. I was so naive in those days. When I went to the government (labour board) for help, he had already bribed them to the extent where they wouldn't listen to foreigners working for his private academy. In Canada he would've been thrown in jail years ago, in Korea these tactics actually gave him the winning edge.
The labour board gave me the cold shoulder. With their backing, he tried to make some co-workers and I go homeless if we dared to stop showing up for work. It was a mess. We all ended up on the street at the wee hours of the morning arguing and I ended up breaking into my own apartment to fish for my stuff. Why was this? Because I refused to work for him illegally and because he didn't pay my friend's salary.
I doubt this would happen in Japan as its decades ahead of Korea on the human rights issues. |
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southofreality
Joined: 12 Feb 2007
Posts: 579
Location: Tokyo
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| Posted: Mon Feb 01, 2010 3:49 pm Post subject: |
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| fat_chris wrote: |
southofreality, nice to see you here again, man. You always got good quality, highly informative posts.
Regards,
fat_chris |
Nah, you've just got low standards 
But seriously, uh... without getting all huggy and crap... thanks.
And, hugs.
Ok, wait... No hugs,...
How about just a handshake? |
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InTheKnow
Joined: 13 Jan 2010
Posts: 20
Location: greater Japan
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| Posted: Wed Feb 03, 2010 7:56 am Post subject: |
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| Imseriouslylost wrote: |
I think people teaching in Japan underestimate how bad Korea can be. From over there it must look like a sweet deal and sometimes it is. |
I've done some research on various job sites and blogs and I've ended my job search in Korea.
| Quote: |
| The visa thing is a big deal for me, too. I've had my legal status here completely controlled and manipulated by an insane person (literally) who thought he was above the law. ...he had already bribed them to the extent where they wouldn't listen to foreigners working for his private academy. |
Now THAT would suck. In Japan you own your visa, without question.
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| Japan as its decades ahead of Korea on the human rights issues. |
Which is sad because Japan is beyond the rest of the world in many aspects, like fathers after a divorce having ZERO visitation rights here, to cite one example. |
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Sweetsee
Joined: 11 Jun 2004
Posts: 2302
Location: ) is everything
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| Posted: Wed Feb 03, 2010 8:41 am Post subject: |
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If the world didn't suck, we'd all fall off.
Enjoy,
s |
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