Job Discussion Forums

[Thomas30318]

Hello all. I'm a long-time reader of these threads, first time poster. It seems that there is a lot of great info out there and I appreciate greatly all of the positive comments as well as the often blunt, but seemingly truthful, comments. Let me apologize up front for the repetition in some of the questions I am going to ask. I know that these have been asked before but, as with most things when there is a lot of info/opinion available, you get vastly differing answers. Also, some of the threads are a couple of years old at this point.

I am going to bite the bullet and move to HCMC sometime in the very near future. It seems from the discussions that this is the best way to find a position versus trying to find one from overseas. So, my background info:

* 41 year old US citizen, white male (only putting this on here because I saw on some threads where race, sadly, is/may be an issue.
* B.A. in History
* M.S. in Business Management
* TESOL Certification - In addition to my day job (see next bullet point) I've been teaching English in the US for a number of years (10+). I work at night schools teaching English to mostly Latino students.
* Most currently worked at a fairly senior level with an international bank, HSBC. I mention this only in that it gave me a chance to work and travel internationally and improve my "global outlook," something I really enjoyed. BTW, I'm not trying to transfer with the bank because I am, frankly, tired of being associated with banking. Its definitely a four-letter word here in the US now. So, basically, I'm quitting.

I lived in Okinawa for several years in the mid-90s and fell in love with Japan and most of Asia. I've also been fortunate to travel through Asia, mostly Hong Kong, due to my work at HSBC. I love the culture, the people, the vast differences between Eastern and Western cultures, the food, etc., etc., etc. I mention this only because it seems that there are a lot of people on these threads who complain about how different it is being in the East. **SOAPBOX ALERT** Yes, it's going to be different. You can't go there with a western-centric, Judeo-Christian outlook. You have to adapt people because it will be different. Don't complain about the lack of personal space, getting jostled in lines, getting gouged while out shopping. Just accept it for what it is, learn to play like a local or leave. Sorry to be so short about this but I have no patience for the "world traveler" who goes out there and complains about how things aren't like at home. Go home then....but I digress.

So, those are my qualifications, academic and otherwise. Some of my questions are:

1). Is that enough to find a position when I get there?
2). I've read in some threads you need "a copy of your diploma/degree." Does this mean a copy of my transcripts from my university or literally open up the frames, remove my diplomas, photocopy them and bring those along with the originals?
3). How much cash can I bring into the country (Vietnam) without declaring? Also, is it better to bring a "large-ish" amount of US dollars (enough to get by for a few months) or would it be better to bring a minimum amount and then work through ATMs as needed?
4) The age-old question: Can I start working legally without a work permit? I plan on having all of the documentation, or as much as I can, with me when I arrive. This is to include criminal background check, TESOL cert., diplomas, passport photos, etc.
5). I've read about a "teacher recession" in 2008. Is there still fall-out from this? Have things gotten better? Worse?
6). When is the best time to arrive from the viewpoint of finding employment? Some folks mentioned the post-TET slowdown so that is a concern. If I've missed the prime time what would be the next best time?
7). What other things do I need to think about in terms of arrival? Rainy season? Reservations at a guest house prior to arrival? Do I just show up with all my crap and start wheeling down alleyways looking for a place to call home for a few weeks/months until I get something more permanent?

Also, I don't think I've seen anything on the Vietnam board about reference letters. Are they required? Recommended? If so, should they be personal references, generic in nature (i.e., Tom is a great guy) or more professional types from teachers/administrators at schools I've taught at? Or both?

I know this is a lot but its something I've thought about doing for years and am finally in the position to do it. I appreciate any and all info on helping me to live my dream and get outta the USA. Oh, and for those of you who will warn me about crime/thievery/etc, I live now in Atlanta, GA and have been robbed/broken into/carjacked more times than I care to remember. Crime happens everywhere...

Thanks again and I look forward to your replies and follow-on discussions.

Best regards,

Thomas

[blateson]

Your qualifications and experience should be absolutely fine. In all honesty I would recommend people with your business experience to work in fields other than "esl" if at all possible, while living in Asia. I don't know why someone with a masters degree and years of experience in finance would want to take a step down.

I read some of your other comments, which is a nicely organized and composed post, by the way. You've said that Westerners should "buckle up" and learn to mend into the society they move to (my words, based on yours), rather than "complain it isn't like home." Just letting you know that actually, that isn't possible. As a non-Asian -- and specifically, a non-local -- you will always be pointed at, viewed as a rich man to be taken advantage of, and a person to be spoken about in gossip and treated in a way that is separate from what a local would experience. In all your attempts to mesh into their society, after 10 + years you will notice that they will still be saying "Welcome to Vietnam/Japan/Thailand" or wherever; they are trained to deal with you in a certain manner that will never go away. Not only will you not receive the normal privileges of a local but around every corner, at times you really don't want it, you will be treated as a "them" rather than an "us."

It's a common, dominant mental model in the West these days, this idea that we are all alike and should all strive to lower racial and cultural boundaries, and learn to accept one another lovingly, etc etc. In most of the world, this is not at all a feature of the local culture. In all of the countries I've been to, none of them make efforts at erasing such cultural and racial boundaries. Quite the opposite, in my opinion it seems they are only raising them as they acquire more wealth and self-determination. In the West our leaders and academics have been on a long drive to stamp out ideas of human separation, whereas over here there is nothing of the sort.

You may think that people are complaining because "it isn't like back home", but underneath the complaints are deeper meanings, like a major lack of improvements, deterioration, increasing greed and hostility towards foreigners, governments run as they though really don't care, wild exchange rates with no controls, power-tripping schools "managers", to name some.

The rainy season in the southern half of Vietnam is generally from early May through early to mid-December, in my experience.

All-in-all though, good luck. All the best. Others should be along shortly to help.

[Wide Awake]

You're more than qualified, but you need to be here. I've already sent you a PM about one job for someone with a MA or MSC. There are other positions too and they pay well.

Spot on post Blateson.