Job Discussion Forums

[ragazzo gallese]

Hello all,

I've been considering teaching in S.E. Asia for some time now, and after three years in Europe, I need a change.

I was originally looking at Bangkok - indeed I still am - but I want to stay within the International House network, and IH Bangkok doesn't pay well at all. I've also heard that they are essentially a CELTA training centre, with a small school tagged on.

For this reason, I have started to broaden my search, and I've been in contact with Apollo (IH affiliates). From what I've read, I think that Saigon would suit me better than Hanoi.

Apollo told that with my post-CELTA experience, I would get paid US$1400 a month based on a 20 hour week, with an overtime rate of $18 per hour. This actually seems pretty good to me - it's certainly more than most Bangkok schools are offering, and above what many Eastern European countries pay.

However, Vietnam is somewhere I haven't yet been in S.E. Asia. I know that $1400 plus overtime would be very live-able in Thailand - even Bangkok - but what about Vietnam? I've also read that that taxes are high in Vietnam (25%), and I can only assume that the $1400 figure is gross.

Browsing through this forum, it seems that, perhaps not including the British Council, Apollo have one of the better reputations for being above board, having good staff training, etc. They also told me that they put their teachers through additional training, such as the IH YLC. I am planning to start the modular DELTA in March, so if they were able to offer good guidance and support with this, I'd be very happy.

So, I guess my questions is, are Apollo offering a decent package in terms of wages and professional development? Also, as a fan of Bangkok and Guangzhou, would Hanoi offer the same kind of colourful hustle and bustle and good night life?

I look forward to hearing your thoughts!

[DNK]

I'm not teaching yet, but I have been here 3mo. $1400/mo would be quite livable indeed. I've been managing around $750/mo excluding vacationing-sort expenses (travel from city to city, tours, etc). Definitely, with a proper long-term place to stay and time to settle into an area and learn the deals, $1400/mo would be a nice pay rate for a single person without excessive tastes. That's in central HCMC, mind you, although oddly costs of living don't seem to change much from place to place here like back home.

You can get a decent meal for $1.50, for instance. Moped for $200-1000 for a one-time expense, but gas is cheap after that, and you can resell it when you leave, but I don't know what sorts of deals people are getting on that, plus you have to assume you're probably going to be paying a local-enforced foreigner tax on both ends. Huge range of accommodation, and I've not too much experience on the apartment side, but I know you can get decent hotel rooms for $8/night if you don't mind roughing it a bit, although $15/night seems to be where you get "nicer" rooms (bargain it down 10-25% if you stay a week or month+).

From what I recall, taxes are only high (20% now?) for the first 6mo, then you get reimbursed for the extra if you stay on longer for your new, lower tax rate. I hope someone comes in to correct that if it's misleading, but that's what I heard last was the case.

[H5N1]

[I'm With Stupid]

Yeah Apollo generally have a pretty good reputation. ILA are the other ones to consider if you're really into professional development. You have to attend at least two development workshops a month, and they offer employee discounts on all of the Cambridge training programmes, including the intensive DELTA. The teaching is all very Cambridge methodology.

The pay is generally going to be in the high teens per hour, which is easily enough to live on. Your tax isn't 25% once you're officially a resident (and you can claim back any overpaid tax retrospectively too), and it should drop to around the 15% mark. You can get an apartment with maid and laundry service, including all bills for about $300. You can get a single room for under $200. You can share a nice house for somewhere between the two. Expect food to be something similar a month, depending on your tastes. A motorbike can be rented for about $50 per month, and petrol is about one tank per week ($3). Clothing isn't much cheaper than home (or it's cheaper in every sense of the word), and alcohol can get up to back-home prices when you go to fancy bars or clubs. But yeah, I'd say $600-800 on general costs, and the rest for whatever you want.

[ragazzo gallese]

Thanks for the advice guys. I'd figured $1400 to be about �1000 (it isn't actually that much - more like �850), and I realised that I should have been converting dollars into Thai baht to get a truer picture. I was never very good at maths!

Having got onto a currency converter, I find that $1400 a month is about 42,500 baht, which is only slightly higher than many Bangkok schools are offering, gross. After tax, it's less. This isn't so good, and I think there's some negotiation to be done before any decisions are made. Bangkok would be a bit more of a sure bet for me, because I've spent time there, have friends there, and I kind of know what I'm getting. Saigon is more of a risk in that sense. Thanks again.

However, is anyone in a position to say how living costs compare in Bangkok and Saigon? From what IWS said, they appear to be comparable, if a little lower for living costs. Booze, clothing, etc. maybe higher?

[snollygoster]

$1400 is pretty low. Hanoi pays more than HCMC, and most costs are similar. Tax is at a hugh rate for the first 6 months, then it drops down, and you are entitled to claim back what you overpaid.
A lot of schools quote "after tax" figures. If thats the case, $1400 is do-able, but there wont be much custard in your Christmas Pudding.

[I'm With Stupid]

If we assume a month is 4 weeks, then $1400 would be $17.50 an hour, which sounds about right to me (realistically, slightly less because there will be a couple of extra days on the month). Any reason why it's only a 20 hour contact? I would've thought 24-26 would've been a full time contract, which would be closer to $1700 for the same hourly rate? As far as I'm aware, only VUS quote after tax figures.

Booze can be cheap or European prices, depending on where you go. I'd say $1 for a bottle of Saigon or Tiger beer is about normal for bars and cheap restaurants (but you can get it even cheaper sometimes). For fancy restaurants, bars or clubs, you're looking at $3-4, but I haven't paid an entry fee anywhere yet.

As for food, you'll very quickly find a few street vendors or small restaurants where you can eat for about $1 or $1.50. Your general restaurants will then go up to about $2-5 for a meal. After that, name your price, just like anywhere else, I guess.

[bule_boy69]

Do i understand correctly that you have 3 years of teaching experience?

If so telling you that 1400 US (whether that be net or gross) is based on you havin 3 years experience, I think thats quite unimpressive.

What do they pay newbies I wonder....

I'm seriously considering HCMC..is this a typical package?

[I'm With Stupid]

[Captain Willard]

Considering that Apolllo is affiliated with International House, the rock bottom salaries shouldn't surprise anyone.

For an experienced teacher, that offer is insulting.