Job Discussion Forums

[ForeignTrainer]

Any chance of making this a sticky?

Dave - so much of the info here about this procedure is either out of date or posted by people who have found problems. So many people are confused about the procedures and the legality of being here on an L visa while they find a legal job. If you are properly qualified, and can prove it, it can be done in many provinces (for most foreign nationalities).

Let's clear something up -

To work here legally, what's required is not a Z visa but an RP [Residence/Work permit] (as others have pointed out, the latter is often wrongly referred to as a Z visa).

Some people, schools, places etc. require you to get a Z visa first, which is later cancelled and swapped for an RP.

Depending on your qualifications, documentation, nationality, province, legal status of your school, and other things, it may be, and often is, possible to proceed directly from a tourist visa to an RP while you are inside China.

This is entirely legal and above board.

The advantages of doing this, if you are entitled to and able to are:
a) it can save time and trouble
b) it can save huge expense for teachers already here who might have to return to their home country (that would be a 13000 mile round trip and a year's savings for my colleague) in order to re-enter on the always temporary 30 day Z visa
c) it allows you to see the school for yourself before signing a contract

There is nothing at all dodgy or suspicious about this procedure. Some schools just don't realise it's possible, and it isn't always available to some nationalities, but it is far and away the nicest option for many teachers.

[Teatime of Soul]

While that may be true in rare cases, the sad truth is that shady schools and sleazy recruiters who want to lure the unsuspecting into illegal/exploitative employment claim to have such power, when in truth, it is the exception, not the rule in China.

Further, school owner/managers are not ignorant of a mechanism that would save time and money in hiring.

Over the last five years, the new visa rules, and enforcement of those rules has become more, not less, stringent.

If you are walking down a street and approached by a guy who says he'll give you a great deal on a set of speakers that "fell off a truck" if you will just follow him down a dark alley, will you go? Now add 9,000 miles distance between you and that dark ally.

Cheers.

[Miles Smiles]

Isn't this a double post from the same person?

http://forums.eslcafe.com/job/viewtopic.php?t=81997&start=15

There is nothing at all dodgy or suspicious about this procedure. Some schools just don't realise it's possible, and it isn't always available to some nationalities, but it is far and away the nicest option for many teachers.

A few questions:

1. If what you say is true, then why don't all Chinese schools know this?

2. If this is legal for some but not for others, how is one to know for whom this is possible?

3. Can you provide some valid proof of what you are telling us?

These are all valid concerns and questions.

Every time I see information like this posted in a foreign teachers' forum I think of the following link:

http://middlekingdomlife.com/blog/china_living/psychopathology-of-anonymous-efl-china-teacher-forums/

[mnguy29]

Very pertinent topic right now for me. I have just accepted a teaching position at a Uni in the south of China. I am trying to understand the visa and permits, etc. It is very confusing! The FAO is telling me to come on a tour visa and then they will change it. I am very skeptical of this! I had some trouble with this in the past. Her most recent answer to my questions concerning this is as follows:
1. An American student of our Uni have taught during the summer before. He said it is ok to come on a tour visa for the summer jobs.
2. However, it is unlegal to teach in our Uni through tour visa. If you sent all the documents we need for us, we can help you gain the invitation letter and Foreign Experts Working Permit in about August.
3. If you come to Hongkong by tour visa. we can help you apply the job visa in Hongkong, and then we will convert it into the expert certificate when you come to our Uni in September. The whole process is legal.

I should also tell you that I am considering arriving a month early and trying to do some summer teaching before Sept. 1.

Of course, there is the problem of communicating and trying to understand each other which is ALWAYS an issue in China. Can anyone give me some insight on this? Thanks!

[Gilka]

It seems to vary from province to province. I did it in Jiangsu in 2007 with no problem (got an RP and FEC on an L without having to change it to a Z first) but I likely wouldn't do it again. There is always the chance that the school is lying, of course, or that they are overestimating their guanxi and will force you to make an impromptu visa run to HK.

broepke - The FAO is asking you to do summer work on an L and then go to HK to get a Z before you start your contract with them. That makes perfect sense. Why would they sponsor your visa so you can work for someone else?

lol @ unlegal.

[daCabbie]

I am so tired of listening to this topic on Dave's.

Here is a link to a eChinacities story that lays it all out fairly simple.

http://www.echinacities.com/main/ExpatCorner/ExpatsCorner.aspx?n=5623

[smutbagdisco]

I think the problem is people saying "I have been told by a recruiter I can get a Z visa after I arrive at the school on an L visa, is it true?"

They really mean go from L visa to RP. Nothing at all to do with a Z visa. In some provinces you can go from L to RP, some you can't. Most require those on L visas to leave the mainland to apply for a Z visa. That is the most common practice.

You can not get a Z visa inside China. They are issued by consulates and embassies for the purpose of applying for an RP after you arrive in China.

Z visa and the RP are completely different things.

I've never heard of anyone who got a Z visa in the mainland.

[The Ever-changing Cleric]

a sticky already exists entitled "Z Visas and Residence Permits." I imagine any questions or points that have to do with visas (any kind of visa) and residence permits could be placed there. A post on page 11 of that thread discusses this very topic, getting a residence permit after entering China on an L visa. There's also another sticky entitled "Teaching on a tourist Visa is that bad?"

To create a third sticky seems like unnecessary triplication.