Job Discussion Forums

[Karl Sal]

I'm in my second year teaching in Zhengzhou, China, the capital of the Henan Province. I teach university students English, often relating to Business English (though I have no formal business background). I'm not really too keen on staying in China any further, and definitely not Zhengzhou.

I spent three weeks in Thailand early this year, and really liked it. I know they say not to judge based on vacation time, but I liked the time I spent and feel like I could definitely live in Bangkok. So getting to the point, some questions:

From what I know, school seasons start in what, May? My contract here runs until the end of June, so I won't be able to make it for that. Is there a decent chance I could get reliable work either in the summer or fall? When should I start looking?

I'd also be traveling with my Filipino girlfriend. I know Filipinos can get ESL work in Thailand, though obviously not as varied or well-paying as native speakers, but as long as I get a good job and housing, I shouldn't have to worry too much about exactly how much she'd be earning, right? She'd be coming over at the same time as me, so no May stuff - think she'd have trouble getting a job? She's worked in China for six months longer than me and has a Filipino BA in teaching, as well as experience from kids to uni, but of course is not American, Canadian, British, Australian, etc.

Another minor concern I have is that the Baht is obviously worth less internationally than the RMB, and I'm paying off my US credit card debt on a plan of $150 per month. This would obviously drain more Baht from my funds than it does in RMB - about 4,500 I guess. How much would I have to be earning to not have to sweat that? I know that's kind of dependent on what I consider "comfortable" but just generally speaking what would you think?

I've been thinking about and wanting to move there for a while now, so I'd enjoy any and all help while it's still pretty early. Thanks.

[sojourner]

Yes, I can appreciate why you would prefer to live/work in Thailand, rather than China ! I have been in China for 8 years, but can't wait for the long uni breaks when I can head off to Thailand. I like Thailand so much that I recently purchased a condominium there !

You mentioned that you are teaching at a uni in Zhengzhou. In common with most uni jobs you would be working between 14-18 "teaching hours" pw (could mean having 3 or 4 day weekends), have v.long holiday breaks, have a rent-free (probably on-campus) flat, and are entitled to an airfare reimbursement of between 8-9 K RMB pa. Be aware that you probably would not be entitled to any of those sorts of perks if you were to teach at a Thai language school (where, it appears, most FTs happen to work).Yes, there are uni jobs available, but it would appear that they are much harder to land , than is the situation with the uni sector in China. Also, I don't think that Thai unis provide any on-campus accommodation for FTs, or airfare assistance.

Many posters to this forum have commented on problems that they have had with both Thai language school bosses and uni administrators. Do a search for posts from "PattyFlipper" on such matters - as well as to his/her comments re Thai culture as a whole.It would appear that Thailand - for those who work there - is far from the LAND OF SMILES image that most short-term visitors are impressed with.

If saving money is an important concern for you, you might want to consider remaining in China. Also, in Thailand you will probably have to work considerably harder / have less holidays than is the situation in China.If Zhengzhou is getting you down, consider going to another city - or, province. China is a big,big place !

Peter

[Karl Sal]

Thanks. You pegged my perks in China pretty well - five days a week but no more than 20 proper class hours, free housing, flight reimbursements, long vacations, etc.

It is a sweet deal to be certain...I just am not particularly fond of China itself. My Chinese is totally functional but nowhere near genuinely social or fluent - came here knowing how to say 3 things. There's a great ex-pat community here, so it's not like I'm miserable, and the city is adding new thinks like H&M stores, Dunkin Donuts, and now, fittingly, a Thai restaurant I'm going to check out this evening. But again - I don't like the Chinese government, or to generalize, the people.

I'm not entirely opposed to going to Xi'an or maybe Shanghai or Tsingtao, but really I'd like to bail on China.

I'd be willing to give up a fair amount of the fringe benefits for some of the stuff I'd enjoy from the move, but stuff like housing would depend on what the rest of the contract was like. Saving money's not huge, but making enough to make credit payments and still do my thing is.

In any case I'll check PattyFlipper's stuff and wait to hear some more takes on my questions. Thanks again.

[tttompatz]

Bottom line:

IF you have your degree AND your TESOL cert you can find work in a language academy any time.

You may NOT get full time work right away and they often don't sponsor a work visa or work permit. CAVEAT EMPTOR.

Full time school jobs start mid May, tend to be 40 hour weeks with 20-25 classes per week (depending on the school and your contract).

Salaries range from 25k-45k for a native speaker with a degree.
Your G/F can expect to get paid about 12-15k. If she is willing to work with kids it will be easier to find work.

As to paying off your bills at home - it really does depend on your spending habits. The wife and I live comfortably on about 20k baht but we are NOT in BKK (about 90km west). We don't party or drink much and our housing costs are only about b5000 including utilities and 8mb internet (private 3 bedroom/2 bath house).

If the bright lights of the Big Mango are your attraction you won't save anything and may end up in the hole after a couple months (it is EASY to lose track of cash in the city) and the convenience of shopping in the malls (with the related expenses) will kill your budget in a hurry. Let your G/F do the shopping in the wet market and you will be fine.

.

[Sadebugo]

"I spent three weeks in Thailand early this year, and really liked it. I know they say not to judge based on vacation time, but I liked the time I spent and feel like I could definitely live in Bangkok. So getting to the point, some questions:"

Yes, and they say this for a good reason. I decided to take a break from Saudi to work in Thailand for two years. I made this decision based on a few vacations there and thinking how wonderful it would be to teach in that environment. Although I wasn't miserable while teaching there, I found the glamour of the place wore off quickly and I was longing to leave for another country sooner rather than later. Keep in mind that when you work in another country, you are not in the same environment as when you are on vacation there. It's a much different and more difficult lifestyle. Ultimately, it depends on the individual and how they adapt, I guess. Good luck with the move.

Sadebugo
http://travldawrld.blogspot.com/

[Karl Sal]

Hmm, thanks on both parts, especially patz.

Here's a secondary question for anyone who wants to answer - where do you think is a good place to live under teaching circumstances outside of Bangkok there? And I already know I don't want to live in Phuket, as nice as the actual town itself is.

Once again I imagine this would ideally require a sense of me or what I like, but also again I'm just curious to hear general ideas. I don't want anything too off the beaten path, though, I'll say that much.

[PattyFlipper]

[kid ehglish]

I was in China for 6 months. That's all I could take. I worked in Thailand 8 years. I don't like BKK so I lived in the South. The going rate for my local was about 33K for an EP. In BKK it's higher as it should be. BKK is more expensive rent-wise, and too there are a lot of distractions that will cost you .. if you're a single male, or female I guess. I rented a single/typical Thai house unfurnished for less than 100USD.

Thailand is a fun place, China isn't IMO.

[bulgogiboy]

I couldn't even last 6 months in China. Unfortunately I didn't last much longer in Bangkok either!

Don't get me wrong, living in Thailand was much nicer than China (I really didn't like China at all), but Bangkok can be expensive, and a TEFL salary just didn't cover all the partying expenses. Even if you live a fairly sedate lifestyle in Bangkok, you will still always be counting the pennies, especially if you have to pay a chunk towards debt every month.

I suppose if you are in BKK the upside is there are more opportunities for work, and more chance of collecting private lessons. All of these jobs will be offering peanuts however.

The money is basically monkey feed everywhere in Thailand. I was there over 8 yrs ago and salaries advertised now seem to be static, or getting smaller. Mind you, this is something you could say about TEFL salaries in most countries... A big downside, compared to China or Korea, is that you won't get any accommodation paid for you, basically no benefits apart from your pittance of a salary.

If I were you I would just go to Thailand for holidays. There are other countries you can work in which would help you pay off your debts and save money, like Korea, but I don't know about how much having your Philippino gf with you would complicate visa procedures...

Good luck!

[NigerianWhisper]

[Karl Sal]

Huh, that sounds solid, thanks, NW. I'll give it a look.

It sounds from this and other threads like the consensus is BKK is a pretty pricey thing to gamble on and that looking outside of it is a much safer bet, yeah?

Any preferences amongst you guys? I'm familiar with some spots down South, but as far as North or around BKK goes I'm pretty uninformed.

As for Korea, I appreciate the recommendation, but it just hold no interest to me. If I were to not to to Thailand but stay in Asia, I'd probably just stay in China and go to Tsingtao for a change of environment but still reliable conditions and since my Chinese is sorta kinda decent.

[sojourner]

Karl,

If you are unwilling to give up all the Chinese goodies (free flat, low uni teaching hours, airfare allowance, etc) for a life in Thailand, there are certainly alternatives to living in your current location.

You mentioned Tsingtao.You might also want to consider Yunnan province, in the country's SW. Apart from the Han Chinese, there are significant numbers of various non-Han ethnic groups. Also, in the south of the province, the climate is v.good; and, you'll also be v.close to Laos (many travellers that I've come across actually prefer Laos to Thailand !). If you were to end up with a job in the provincial capital, Kumning, you could always fly to Bkk during your holiday breaks - several flights each week to Bkk ( 2 or 3 hours duration, I think).The only drawback with working in Yunnan is that salaries appear to be somewhat lower than in most other regions within China - probably due to the province being v.popular with the EFL set !

Another place that you might want to consider is that province (off-hand can't recall its name) in the country's NW where there is a significant minority (could actually be the majority) of Moslems, whom I've been told are of Turkish descent.

And, of course, there is always Shanghai - China's most cosmopolitan city !

Peter

[Karl Sal]