Job Discussion Forums

[DLat]

http://www.chinaprogram.org/index.php

Hello. I apologize in advance if my question has already been answered. I did a search and did not see it, so I'm making my first post.

Has anyone here had experience with this program? Or know anyone who has? Any insight someone could give me would be much appreciated.

While their published information looks credible, I want to do some additional checking to make sure that participants have been generally pleased.

TIA

[A'Moo]

Really dodgy. NEVER pay to teach in China, you will be resentful from the minute you step off the plane and see high school dropouts from former Soviet republics making $ and not having to pay for the privelege...
The "As per Chinese government regulations, only persons from the US, Canada, Aus may teach" is somewhat of a crock. These regs are never enforced...Its a programs way of saying "Asian and dark-skinned people need not apply". Put it this way-Swedes and Dutch never really have a problem with schools referring to this requirement.

[nickpellatt]

My view - AVOID!

For anyone who hasnt looked at the link - for $2300 this program includes a training course to teach for one month, Chinese lessons, and a teaching placement in a public school in ShenZhen. Doesnt sound too bad on the surface, so why avoid it?

1 - There are few details about the teaching training. A recognised teaching training program like CELTA is accredited and has strict guidelines and outside accreditation. Course are normally taught by experienced EFL instructors who are pretty well qualified. This is then an internationally recognised qualification for the TEFL industry. Costs for such courses in the UK cost less than �1000, which I think is about $1600 dollars. With so few details provided on the teacher training on this course, I would guess it may be substandard, and isnt likely to be internationally recognised. If it was cheap, it might be worth a look...this isnt cheap, so could be a waste of money.

2 - Chinese lessons are pretty standard for most teaching jobs. One thing stands out on this program. Students have to buy the books at $137. Thats looks really high to me and may well be more profiteering from the company you are signing with.

3 - Teaching placement. Salary is not generous for SZ at 6500 per month for up to 17 lessons per week, with around 10 office hours per week. This is probably on the low side, and looks a bad deal to me. They also mention that teachers may have to share dorm room accomodation...again, a bad deal. In addition, flight bonus is stated as being 4000 RMB, which is about half of what most standard contracts offer in China.

Another worry is that they suggest you should really book flights through a company they will put you in touch with, which I am sure they will also be creaming money from.

They mention they offer support during the contract etc, this may be minimal in truth, based on experience I have had with another company many moons ago, and is not worth paying through the nose for.

This just looks like a bad deal to me. It is a company that does not appear to offer high quality training ... if they did, they would provide more details, and is not offering great teaching posts either. They just appear to be a company looking to exploit newbie teachers IMO.

There is no reason why you couldnt complete a quality recognised certificate program in your home country at perhaps $700 less than the cost of what may be a spurious program, and then find your own job in China with a higher salary/and or lower workload/with better end of contract bonus/better living conditions. Avoid!

[DLat]

Thank you A'Poo and Nickpellatt for your responses. I am nervous about this. I am not bold enough at this point in my life to go to China alone and find a job. Although I want to teach in China for a year (or more), I want to do this with the security of an American company helping me with visas, contracts and housing; ensuring that I would be placed in a reputable school; and ensuring that I really have a job before I buy a plane ticket! Perhaps after a year or two of experience I�d be confident that I could negotiate my own arrangements. But this first time out, I want an English-speaking safety net before and during my stay.

I have also looked at CIEE. Is that a more reputable company?

Of course I would rather not pay a service, and I would not be opposed to getting my CELTA here in US before leaving for China. And I understand (from studying this forum) that CELTA is more recognized and valuable training than most others. BTW, there is no CELTA training near my university or home, so my cost of getting CELTA training would be both the program fee and one month of room and board in a city where offered. (expensive!)

So I guess some further questions�.given my desire for a safety net and service to help ensure that I have all arranged properly before I depart, does this particular program now look like a more reasonable choice for me?

Or does anyone recommend CIEE instead?

Or are there other options that someone might recommend?

BTW, I really appreciate the helpfulness on this board, both to my particular request and the wealth of information I�ve already found reading through this forum.

Thank you!

[nickpellatt]

I can understand your concerns about a safety net. Its very easy to say 'come on over, dont worry' and point out that thousands of people do exactly that each year...but I know it requires quite a leap of faith and confidence that isnt always easy to take/find.

When I first came to China in 2006 I did something similar. I came with a UK based company that offered a 3 month volunteer program (with training) for a fee (smaller than the one on your link). The kind of program I took is routinely slated on the boards, but I did it that way as I too wasnt as confident as I should have been.

Heres the rub though. Although my company was a UK company (just as yours has a US address) what they actually did was sub-contract the entire program to a local agent/company. I would be 99% sure the same would happen with the outfit you posted a link for. This means I didnt really get UK support and service, and Im sure you wont either. So really you are paying US prices for Chinese service, which is a pretty bad deal. My volunteer trip in 2006 worked out OK, but it didnt represent value for money, it didnt offer any real support or security, and it didnt offer anything I couldnt have done on my own TBH. The training was crap too!

The other thing to consider, is if you come on your own and work for one of the bigger chain school type people you may well be arriving with another group of china newbies who will be in exactly the same boat as you are! Its very rare that you will land in China without someone else to share the experience with, as many employers take on several new teachers to start the new year. This is also true of Uni posts etc, where the new intake of teachers co-incides with a school year. You probably wont be alone when you take the leap of faith!

I am going to post a link for another company you might want to look at. This company doesnt charge any fees and has a fairly solid reputation on the board (you can search them and you should find some forum posts). There isnt a fee, and from quickly looking at their programs they offer better flight bonus and travel bonus too. Salaries are slightly lower than the shenzhen salary, but they normally place teachers in smaller cities or towns where the cost of living will be fraction of SZ costs. Its another option for you to look at, and you will be arriving and doing the program with lots of other people too I would guess.

http://www.bucklandgroup.org/index.htm

Theres the link - they do have fairly positive reviews on this forum. People generally say they look after teachers and Im sure they could put you in touch with other teachers (which is a good idea to do with any program you look at TBH). I DONT have any interest in Buckland, and I have never worked directly for them, applied to them or even met any of their staff.

I HAVE worked in the town in which they are based though (and will be heading back to that town later this year), and worked for another school that was owned a the brother of the guy who owns Buckland. What they offer looks a better deal to me than the program mentioned, and its another option for you to look at.

Do search for Buckland on this forum if you might be interested in them, and do ask them to put you in touch with current or ex teachers. Ask this of any other company you get involved with too.

Ultimately, every trip to a new country is going to require a leap of faith, and paying $1000s of dollars may give no more of a safety net than hopping on the next flight over with a CV/Resume would. But thousands of us have done it, do it, and most of us manage just OK.

Good luck!

[Non Sequitur]

If OP is working in home country and can finance an ESL course, then do it at home and apply for a real paid job for 1 Sept start.

[Timer]

DLat, if you feel you aren't ready to go to China without help, put it off for a while and research. Read through this forum and look at job ads to get a general idea of salaries and benefits. Get a feeling for what is lawful and what is not. If you are unsure you can email or call the Chinese embassy in your country and ask them any questions you can't find the answers to on the internet.

Eventually you'll have a good set of criteria and you can start carpet bombing the job boards until you find a good job. The public schooling year starts in September (I think) so you have some time to prepare. Private schools hire year round but be more careful with them.

If you have any questions you can PM me. I've only spent a year in China but I'm willing to help you out as best I can.