Job Discussion Forums

[CThomas]

My question is simple:

Why would a Westerner want to live in Hanoi rather than HCMC?

From what I hear about corruption, treatment/attitudes, and dogs, why?

Maybe it is cooler than it first seems; worth it, even. What am I missing?

[mark_in_saigon]

it has discernible seasons, which some people like. I could live with constant spring or fall, but HCMC can be pretty tedious with the never ending heat. I guess the wet season hot season thing is seasons, but HN is more like I am used to in the southern climes of the U.S.

HN has more interesting buildings. HCMC is grittier, and does not seem to have much of an historical feel to it like HN has (at least to a larger extent).

As my friends in HN tell me: "we have Uncle Ho". Indeed they do, again, more history there, seems to me.

HN has some real poverty in some areas not too far away from the city, which can mean some forms of labor can be quite a bargain. However, it is just relative, labor is plenty cheap all over, but I did like the feel I got for HN in some ways relating to that subject.

HN is closer to more interesting geographical features.

Of course, HCMC has a lot of things in its favor as well. It really depends on what is most important to you. I spent some time up there and was very happy, but I am very happy in the south also. I think wherever you go in VN, if you live as a tourist or foreigner mostly hanging with other foreigners, you never get the true feel for the area. If you hang with locals, you come a lot closer to it. Of course, we never really know everything that is going on.

[LettersAthruZ]

Errrmmm.....what you're missing??

- Like Mark stated, a really nice "winter"......

- Not AS MANY Tay up here willing to put up with the b******t up here, so, thusly, they tend to depart fairly quickly and there is not the over-saturation of ESL instructors that I hear is currently occurring in HCMC.

- Easy proximity to Sapa and Ha Long Bay (as Mark had stated above).

What you're NOT missing?

- Cost-of-living almost twice that of Saigon......

- RAMPANT corruption and far greater difficulty in getting anything done when it comes to needing a stamp for this or that from the Government.....



When looking at Ha Noi as compared to Saigon, I have my own personal opinions about the citizenry in general in regards to rip-offs, scams, and just general overall friendliness.....but that's around on a couple of other threads, I am sure.

[Mushroom Druid]

[CThomas]

[snollygoster]

I have lived in HCMC, and Hanoi, as well as Mekong Delta and Central Vietnam.
The south, the centre and the north are 3 different planets, inhabited by 3 different herds of animals, separated by a (not so) common language.
I can tell a "Nam Ky" (Southerner) from a "Bac Ky" (guess?) simply by looking at him/her- Even the facial features are that distinct.
As soon as the mouth opens, it becomes a lot more obvious, and as soon as attitudes begin to be spoken about, the division is deeper and wider than USA's Grand Canyon.
Plenty of other regional differences too-For example almost no body can understand the dialect from Hue-despite the fact its Tieng Viet.

Cooler? The north is coooler in the winter for sure, and the thermometer at my alley occassionally hovered around the mysterious ZERO mark in winter, and closer to 40 in summer.

People? Much more sneaky in Hanoi- Chinese say "Hanoi is the capital of Deception".

Natural beauty of the land? North has the fabulous north-west mountains peopled by the Hmong who hate the Vietnamese, and it has some other great features, mostly wrecked by the thoughtlessness of the locals when discarding their trash.
Hanoi for example has lakes- they could be beautiful if it wasnt for the bountiful used daipers, food scraps and stolen, unwanted motor bikes that clog them. The smell is awful. Some nice old buildings too, like the old city walls.

Outside of the city, some ancient castles that the Commies stole from the rightful owners, and are lately asking the rightful owners they threw out of them to help with restoring them.

As I said before, 3 different planets. With a population of nearly 90m people living in a land mass the size of a shoe box, I guess the divisions will remain for a long time. Just adds to the appeal in some ways- experience a few different cultures in just a few miles of travel.

[haller_79]

[mark_in_saigon]

Yes, I also noticed that the facial features seemed different. In my mind, I found that to be interesting. Interesting to see the higher weights in the south, as they have more resources. While we have such beautiful people in the south, it is nice to see a variation, and it seems we are almost in a different country without having to get a visa or change our money. Nice.

I spent a lot of time in a remote part of HN, and while it was considered part of the city, when we would actually go into the city, again, it was a different world. It was very nice outside of the city proper, and we all know what it is like inside these cities.

I loved how the northerners would all talk smack about the southerners, and when in the south the same thing occurs. Yet they are mostly friendly to me, like they consider me neutral, and maybe trying to get me to agree with one side or the other. So funny. If we had come over to the north first, maybe we would have gone to war against the south, I don't see one region being so much more angelic than the other, do you?

Carey, I think you are on the right track generally on living here. The way I see it, a big VN city takes about 10 years off your life. I figure a traffic circle in rush hour is good for about a 30 minute reduction, on average, your mileage may vary. If you can make any decent percentage of your current income outside of the city, plus factor in the lower cost of living, you are probably doing yourself a lot of good. If you have resources from the west already, the logic is even more compelling. We do tend to get tied to the big cities though, because of relationships, and also, life is a lot more exciting here. Hate it, yes, but the boonies aint nothin like it, as we all know. My next move in life may be an in out deal where I spend half the time in smaller cities and half the time in HCMC. Not sure I can go cold turkey.

[bludevil96]