Job Discussion Forums

Sudz · Joined: 09 Aug 2004 Posts: 438

Hey guys.

Well I never thought that I'd be posting a message like this, but here I am Twisted Evil

I'm joining Nottingham University's MA TESOL program next May. They have an international branch in Malaysia, and the classes only occur once every couple of months, for 3 days at a time.

I was originally considering working part-time in Kuala Lumpur (the school provides a part-time work visa), but am now thinking of keeping my options open.

By next May, I'll have saved enough for the course, along with probably an extra couple of grand at least. I've heard that China generally has low working hours (truth?), and considering that I enjoyed China during my last visit, I feel that working part-time and studying might be a decent option.

Might I be able to save enough to live on? Would I most likely be living on survival wages, or would I be able to make enough to perhaps live a comfortable lifestyle? Keep in mind that I don't need to save money.

As the subject says, I lack a degree (joining the program based on experience and certificates). Obviously, I wouldn't be eligible for the better positions.

Worth noting: I'm currently doing fairly well in Vietnam, though it looks like I'll only be 'employable' until May without the degree. I could use a change anyways.

Sudz

choudoufu · Joined: 25 May 2010 Posts: 3325 Location: Mao-berry, PRC

this is confusing. you say by next may "you'll have saved enough,"
but then you "don't need to save money." and you're worried
you'll be living on subsistence wages.

when you say that by next may you'll have saved "an extra couple of
grand at least," does that mean you currently do not have an extra
couple grand?

not a good idea to move to china without a good stash. unexpected
expenses. three months rent plus security deposit plus agency fee
up front? a week in a hospital? health insurance?

studying and working part-time will be illegal. you can 'probably'
get away with it. but if you're picking up enough hours to live
above subsistence, you'll be more 'visible.' regardless, in order to
get that student visa, you'll have to pay tuition up front. and there
goes the savings.

better to stay employed in vietnam until may.

Sudz · Joined: 09 Aug 2004 Posts: 438

Sorry maybe I hadn't worded the OP very well. I'll have saved enough money for tuition by May 2012 (from the money I'll have saved in Vietnam), plus at least a couple thousand extra (over 15000US total). I wont be paying for the entire tuition up front, so I'll have thousands of dollars stashed away for padding.

So if I do move to China during the summer of next year, I'll have quite a bit saved. Ideally, I don't want to dip too much into my savings, though I'll probably have a few grand to fool around with.

I will be staying in Vietnam until May.

askiptochina · Joined: 26 Feb 2010 Posts: 488 Location: Beijing

The Great Wall of Whiner · Joined: 29 Jan 2003 Posts: 4946 Location: Blabbing

Non Sequitur · Joined: 23 May 2010 Posts: 4724 Location: China

The degree/no degree thing has been well worked over.
No degree and no ESL certificate really makes things tough, so do complete the course you're saving for.
Also, do start your job search early and that means April May for Sept start.
Cash is only one part of package. This has also been worked over well on this forum.
A uni job with accom, airfares etc is the place to start.
By all means go for the higher paying or supplemental jobs later but the transition (a) to China and (b) to teaching are hurdles in themselves.
Best

Sudz · Joined: 09 Aug 2004 Posts: 438

askiptochina - the classes are infrequent, and I would only have to be in Kuala Lumpur for a few days every few months. Airfare is a slight factor, though Air Asia makes things easier. Thanks for your opinion.

Non Sequitur - I think you're right. I would like to work in China at some point, but it's probably worth waiting for the MA TESOL. I've heard people mention on other forums that it would be possible to be banned from China (working without a degree). Don't know how likely this would be, but that would be a bummer.

Opiate · Joined: 10 Aug 2011 Posts: 630 Location: Qingdao

askiptochina · Joined: 26 Feb 2010 Posts: 488 Location: Beijing

The Great Wall of Whiner · Joined: 29 Jan 2003 Posts: 4946 Location: Blabbing

Was it legal?

No, it is not. He is still doing it and unafraid of the supposed risks.

How did they get a working visa?

He is working illegally on a student visa. He doesn't even attend classes. Just pays them the tuition fee and they are happy.

Does China allow this?

No, it does not. But no one around here cares about what he is doing except for the teachers who are working legally and making much less.

Are you citing something different from the norm?

Sadly, it is normal and common. This very website has piles of ads for working without a degree. I do not support nor condone it, but it is happening en masse.

The Great Wall of Whiner · Joined: 29 Jan 2003 Posts: 4946 Location: Blabbing

Non Sequitur · Joined: 23 May 2010 Posts: 4724 Location: China

I�ve noted Great Wall�s continuing interest in improved pay for FTs in China.

Low barriers to entry, low performance expectations, no lack of applicants and high turnover suggest Chinese employers have no incentive to lift salaries.

Keep up the good work but don�t expect change anytime soon. And please don�t overly criticise people who take the standard college/uni package of 4500/5500 per month + normal addons, refunds etc

That�s where the majority of jobs are for the one to two-year tenure FT.

Very buoyant Western economies crying out for every type of graduate may restrict FT supply to China and thereby improve salaries.

That scenario seems remote at present.