Job Discussion Forums

[chrisandcarla]

Hi,
My husband and I have been in Vietnam for almost 2 months, and now we are about to look for teaching positions either in Vietnam or China. We're Canadian, and have all the qualifications, aside from classroom experience (other than 6 hours in our TEFL practicum). Has anyone been to both China and Vietnam? What would you say are the main differences as far as people, lifestyle, culture, etc. go? If you've worked in both places, what are the main differences in school quality, students, etc. ?
Thanks

[thefuzz]

I've been living in China for a few years now and travel quite frequently to Vietnam. I have to be honest and say that I like Vietnam a whole lot more than China. People are generally nicer, the feel of even the big cities is a bit more rustic (although that is changing fast in places like Saigon and Hanoi) and in terms of general living Vietnam I feel is more comfortable.

When I am there I rent a motorbike to get around (cannot do this in China), have a baguette for breakfast (with cheese), again something that is missing in China. I like how Vietnam still clings a bit to its colonial past, great coffee is available if you need it (China only has overpriced Starbucks and Costa). Finally a late night Bia Hoi is a mighty good thing to have...such cheap (yet strangely good) beer is hard to come by outside of Vietnam.

As for working...never worked there, you might ask this question on the Vietnam forum and see what response you get.

Benefits of living and working in China? You'll probably earn more here, especially if working in the big cities like Guangzhou, Shanghai or Beijing. While living there you will also be able to enjoy a lifestyle similar to the one back home in Canada...good Western food, grocery shops selling imported goods and so on...something that is not yet readily available in Vietnam.

In the end I would choose Vietnam for one simple reason...it is what China was 10 years ago, when I first came here. I like that China, the one from the past and Vietnam has that vibe to it. Of course with the rapid development it will soon start to lose that "rustic" charm and go the way of China, but until then it is a great place to be.

Give Vietnam a shot...sign a year contract...and then come to China.

[xjgirl]

the vietnam forums will be better, though the one on daves isnt good

[Sudz]

Nice post thefuzz.

I've met a few expats from China who also seem to prefer Vietnam. When speaking to travelers though, China is usually the winner (from my experience).

I've been working in Vietnam for several years now, and have only briefly traveled to China. I originally wasn't all that pumped to go to China, but came out feeling quite positive about the place (again from brief trip).

I suppose that I originally thought that China would just be a bigger, more arrogant version of Vietnam (which probably holds some truth), but despite whether or not this had any accuracy, I found most of the people quite friendly.

I think I'd like to try China for a year or two at some point. I will miss the Baguettes and scooter I'm sure! (though I suppose I could buy one when there).

I'm going to have to disagree somewhat regarding the wages. I think that your average, unrelated BA holder would be able to save more in Vietnam (perhaps I'm wrong). I've seem some of the pay scales in China, and they generally seem lower. Also (speaking for Ho Chi Minh), there are plenty of western/international food options, though I'm sure not as many as Shanghai and Beijing.

I myself have mostly enjoyed Vietnam, and could certainly recommend it. I think the annoyances are quite similar in both countries, and that one should have a reasonably thick skin to live happily in either place.

[thefuzz]

[ruindasia1]

Totally correct on them being banned in shenzhen, but it's not strictly enforced, in the area that i live in shenzhen.
Also, my teacher friend just bought a scooter and he doesn't have a license for it. He also as funny as this sounds rode up on his bike and asked a cop in shenzhen for the directions to where we were meeting up at and the cop didn't do anything, just gave him the directions. Hahah, never checked his id or anything.

[platinum peyote]

Taught in Ho Chi Minh City for six months, taught for over two years in China (Nanjing and Suzhou). Pretty clear which country I liked more.

Long story short: Vietnam is a great place to visit, living there drove me nuts - the constant deception, crooks, insane traffic, getting ripped off/harassed on a daily basis, the horrid weather, having to work two jobs (and six days a week!) to make decent money, and on and on. And, not to be nasty or anything, but hands down Vietnamese is the worst-sounding language I have ever heard, seems no one speaks it but shouts or shrieks it.

I quite liked the food in Vietnam for the most part though, despite always being overcharged.

[Sudz]

Interesting about the scooters. One thing I noticed while in Chengdu, was that no one seemed to have a gas scooter. Perhaps the law has been enforced there? Ho Chi Minh could use a similar law (though I would miss my scooter!)

Definitely sounds like you had a bad experience in Vietnam platinum peyote. Was this in Ho Chi Minh? I find that I'm rarely overcharged for food honestly, though other things can be a struggle (I rarely shop, so it's not much of an issue).

I completely agree about the language. Even to this day, I sometimes look out of my window expecting to see fisticuffs, only to see a bunch of people jumping rope and eating ice cream. It sounds a little nicer coming from the more educated locals, but generally it's tough on the ears (and frankly - for me - not fun to speak).

I myself like the weather here, though after all these years, experiencing more than 2 seasons might be nice.

One thing: I would definitely recommend getting a scooter to anyone living here. You're free to go where you please, and don't have to bargain on a daily/monthly basis for a driver. I couldn't imagine my life without one!

[chrisandcarla]

Thanks for all the info! I guess it comes down to a matter of personal preference. We've been in Vietnam for 2 months now, and we do like it here. Sometimes the motorbikes drive me crazy, and I live in constant fear of getting smacked by one (and even more fear when we rent a motorbike and my husband drives!) but its nice how cheap everything is here. At the same time, we miss bigger mountains and seasons (being from Canada). And I heard that Mandarin is a lot easier to learn than Vietnamese. I guess we'll just start applying and see where we get a better offer!

[Old Surrender]

I have to echo what other people have said: the coffee in Vietnam is amazing. The best coffee that I can get in my one KFC town is, well, from KFC.

One thing to consider is that yuan is gradually getting stronger against the USD (I am assuming the CAD as well) while the VND continues to flounder. So each little bump in appreciation is, in a way, a raise if you're a saver.

As far as working, I don't know. I am planning on making a second visit to 'Nam this winter break and I may try to network for some job opportunities. I'm starting to get the moving itch. Three years in the Heavenly Kingdom may be enough for me.

[time to teach]

I'd stay in Vietnam and head to Hanoi, plenty of jobs there. I was there for one year in 2004 and had a great run. I made more friends at the local Bia Hoi than I've made in my entire TEFL career. There seem to be more schools offering fulll time contracts in Hanoi rather than the usual piecemeal positions and split shifts, which can be draining and offers less financial security, etc. Hourly wages also seem to be about the same as China nowadays, around $15-$20 usd an hour based on advertised positions. Since you're already in Vietnam and ready to work, why not stick around for awhile and find out the answers to your questions firsthand? As Buddha once said: It is better to travel well than to arrive.