Job Discussion Forums

[bluetortilla]

I'm inclined to a gov. job I think as it gives you housing and time for privates, which put together would seem to outweigh a private job with a higher base salary, but perhaps no housing, and longer hours leaving you less time for privates.

Of course you have to find the privates!

I'd imagine that it must be hard (except for provided housing!) living in an expensive city with a government job. That's where the privates come in of course, but, again, you got to make connections and find them. And I would imagine that in an inexpensive city privates are less common and pay a lot less. In that case a private job might be more attractive financially.

Am I getting this more or less right?

[Lobster]

Yep, that's pretty well true. Real money from privates comes when you can get a group together and charge them individually (e.g. 6 students at 100 each for 1.5 hours). Of course there's always the chance that they may cancel without notice or have different levels or goals. You can also do one-on-ones. I personally don't like private tutoring much. I prefer the interaction of a class.

RED

[Baozi man]

Tortilla, Except in unusual situations, "privates" are a violation of your contract and, therefore illegal

Most FTs have no problem signing a contract which forbids them to work outside and then going to work outside. Entering a contract with this mindset is known as bad faith. It voids the contract. Many people say, Oh well, this is China, it doesn't matter. You may even be encouraged to work outside, secretly, by the FAO or coworkers. This is especially true in government schools.

It's fine until it isn't fine.

Average income in China has gone up around 300 percent in the last 10 years or so in China. Not so for FTs. Actually, all things considered, FTs are an underpriviliged class in China. We are legally deprived of the right to earn money and also deprived of most benefits which make working outside less attractive to other teachers.

For example, teachers in government schools have access to steep discounts on buying houses. FTs do not. Regular employees receive various benefits such as computers, foodstuffs and other commodities at either heavily discounted prices or free. Some FTs are purposely deprived of these benefits. Retirement benefits are worth a great deal of money. A lot of these people are going to draw"social security" for 20 years or so. When an FT reaches retirement age, they will be ushered out of the country. Few will receive anything more than a goodby dinner, if that.

The cost of living in China has increased significantly. Several years ago baozi were easily found @ 4/1 RMB. Now most are 2/1RMB, sometimes, even 1/1RMB. Granted they are bigger but usually not that much bigger.

A hair stylist in a good salon makes more money in China than many FTs. Granted they work many more hours a week, but their income potential is only limited by the circumstances of their work, not an arbitrary declaration by an administrator who is himself loading his pockets with 200,000 RMB bribes [this is an accurate number].

Another very real issue for foreigners is the higher price we must pay for goods in general. Numerous shopkeepers, foodsellers, and so forth will not sell to a foreigner unless they can overcharge. A couple of RMB may not amount to much but that can run into hundreds, even thousands more, depending on what you are buying.

If you consider the % more we must pay, it is significant. A one RMB item that we must pay 2 RMB for, that's double the price. When buying clothes, shoes, and other goods, double the price can be a lot. And it can be ten times more.

It is inconceivable to most Westerners that an administrator would arbitrarily limit an employees income when the employee have the time, ability, and opportunity to earn more; however, that is the situation.

Chinese bosses are not interested in empowering their employees or win win situations. Some of them are actually quite mean. They are both selfish and cruel, sometimes simply indifferent. In their mind, being boss gives them the right to deprive others of what they themselves take for granted.

It's a mistake to plan on making a lot of money doing "privates in China." If FTs would simply stop coming to China until the onerous regulations, such as not working outside are eliminated, things might change; however, some of these people actually enjoy turning Westerners into lying, scheming vipers like themselves. The system is designed to make people dishonest.

[bluetortilla]

[The Great Wall of Whiner]

[Baozi man]

GWW, Section VI paragraph 2 of the SAFEA contract states, "Without party A's consent, Party B shall not conduct any part-time job assigned by any other party."

Unless the appendix of your contract specifies that you may work outside or you do have permission, preferably in writing, outside work is a violation of the contract.

Permission was routinely denied by FAOs with whom I spoke of the matter. An expelled from China acquaintance, when questioned by the PSB about working outside his contract specifications, found himself without obvious support from the very ones who had arranged the work.

Naturally, I speak from my own perspective and experience. It would have been better to qualify my assertion.I apologize for not doing so.

I would be interested to learn how many FTs who do teach outside have permission form their contracting employer to do so.

[Lobster]

I also have a problem with it, and I won't sign a contract that forbids outside work with an outfit that doesn't directly compete with my school. When I work on movie shoots, there are dozens of foreign extras, and I'd say 90% of them are FTs. I know this isn't exacyly what you had in mind, but it's an example of the range of jobs available that don't compete. Now I have no interest in outside work, because I can load up with all the OT I want.

RED

[Non Sequitur]

Some of my best privates came from the FAO which was supposed to enforce the 'no outside work' clause.
The upside of outside work is that you can pick how many hours you do and the level of student. It can be fun to teach a couple of classes of 8-10 year olds on a Saturday after a week of tertiary students. Smaller classes and the chance to meet the parents are all pluses of after hours private teaching.
Downsides are cancellations without notice, or the class is smaller than you were expecting and they churn through the material leaving you with time to fill. Another downside is non paid commute time.
Generally OP I think you're on the right track. Get the govt job and then the private work will come looking for you - believe me.
Another approach is do no privates during semester and binge on it over summer.

[Baozi man]

Tortilla, As NS has indicated, there is plenty of work; however, people looking for freelancers are sometimes dodgy sorts. If they decide to not pay you, hassle you, or cause trouble, you are without recourse. It may impact your legitimate job as well.

Doing business directly with Chinese people can be problematic, especially if you are unable to clearly communicate with them.

The issue of bad faith when signing a contract may be of more interest to philosophers and moralists than people simply interested in "making a buck."

My experiences have indicated that, with some notable exceptions, outside work can be trouble, especially for novices in China. Although an extreme example, one young man was killed several years ago, apparently after a falling out with gangster type school owners. A close acquaintance of mine was recently expelled due to issues arising from "working outside"

If your stated, legal salary is not adequate to meet your obligations, look for another job or another country.

[Lobster]

Another thing to consider is taxation. Private work income that you don't pay taxes on is also a way to get in trouble if you're caught out. Many people do privates, but there are some risks involved.

RED

[Non Sequitur]

Baozi and RED are right to make those cautions.
The 'legit' public sector can have its contract-observance issues, but step outside into the private world and it's a whole new game.
And the way they can treat FTs is nothing to the way they treat each other!
That said, some of my best experiences have been in private work.

[bluetortilla]

[big_big_bang_theory_fan]

[Baozi man]

SAFEA contract, section VIII; Breach Penalty:

"When either party fails to fulfill any part or all of the obligations as stipulated in the contract, that is, in the event of breach of the contract, the said party shall pay a breach penalty of $800 to $3000 or equivalent to 3 to 10 times Party B's monthly salary in RMB."

That's what the contract says; however, employing agencies routinely violate various parts of the contract. It's laughable to even consider that any employer would ever pay a foreigner a breach fee.

The contracts are sometimes, perhaps often, entered into by the employing agency in bad faith. They have no intention of fulfilling certain parts of the contract, if they can avoid doing so. Some will lie and scheme to defraud you from the moment you arrive.

Issues over transportation reimbursement, visa costs, internet hookup, number of hours and location of classes taught, living conditions, and so forth can make a FTs life miserable. There is virtually no chance that any institution would ever pay a breach fee over any of these things.

I found the culture shock I experienced visiting Japan, from China, in some respects, greater than the shock of coming from the USA to China. Unless you have a really good reason for leaving Japan, it's difficult for me to imagine how China is going to be an improvement.

[bluetortilla]