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possible to make good money in DF without teaching kids?
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SpaceTone



Joined: 11 Jul 2010
Posts: 29

PostPosted: Tue May 01, 2012 12:03 pm    Post subject: possible to make good money in DF without teaching kids? Reply with quote

Having read through previous postings, there are quite a few from people earning 20k plus in DF. I was wondering if it�s possible to make that kind of money without teaching kids?
As a business/privates teacher I could rarely get beyond the 15k mark, a reasonable amount definitely but not enough (in my opinion) to build a real future in DF (buy a house, start a family etc)
Are there any options to make a higher, and more stable, income without teaching kids? I�ve heard examining and teacher training are pretty lucrative, has anyone had experience in these areas they could share?
Additional studies like a BA/MA in ESL aren�t feasible in my situation, but things like ICELT/DELTA, which I believe could be done whilst working, are.
Any insights/experiences appreciated.
Cheers
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Prof.Gringo



Joined: 07 Nov 2006
Posts: 2236
Location: Dang Cong San Viet Nam Quang Vinh Muon Nam!

PostPosted: Wed May 02, 2012 3:37 am    Post subject: Re: possible to make good money in DF without teaching kids? Reply with quote

SpaceTone wrote:
Having read through previous postings, there are quite a few from people earning 20k plus in DF. I was wondering if it�s possible to make that kind of money without teaching kids?
As a business/privates teacher I could rarely get beyond the 15k mark, a reasonable amount definitely but not enough (in my opinion) to build a real future in DF (buy a house, start a family etc)
Are there any options to make a higher, and more stable, income without teaching kids? I�ve heard examining and teacher training are pretty lucrative, has anyone had experience in these areas they could share?
Additional studies like a BA/MA in ESL aren�t feasible in my situation, but things like ICELT/DELTA, which I believe could be done whilst working, are.
Any insights/experiences appreciated.
Cheers


The short & simple answer is no.

I know of no jobs in EFL in Mexico City that pay more than $20,000 pesos monthly for just teaching adults. In fact, few schools pay that much for teaching kids, really just a small number of private colegios.

Yes, some people post about how they can manage to string together $20,000 pesos per month, between working in a school, giving private lessons, maybe a bit of editorial work. But not through just one job at one school.

Sure, you can also run a TEFL training course (with no oversight or approval, it's pretty easy actually) or a language school (again, no oversight or standards) if you want to. Also there is the possibility of a stack of biz cards, a disposible cell phone (Telcel Amigo) and some paperwork, and voila! You are now the proud owner of a biz EFL "school" Laughing

I maxed out around $18,000 monthly in a colegio and I had no need to teach outside of it, though I did do some private biz classes for $200 a hour, so I was making over $20,000 pesos monthly, after taxes.
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mejms



Joined: 04 Jan 2010
Posts: 390

PostPosted: Wed May 02, 2012 3:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
The short & simple answer is no.

I know of no jobs in EFL in Mexico City that pay more than $20,000 pesos monthly for just teaching adults. In fact, few schools pay that much for teaching kids, really just a small number of private colegios.

Yes, some people post about how they can manage to string together $20,000 pesos per month, between working in a school, giving private lessons, maybe a bit of editorial work. But not through just one job at one school.

Sure, you can also run a TEFL training course (with no oversight or approval, it's pretty easy actually) or a language school (again, no oversight or standards) if you want to. Also there is the possibility of a stack of biz cards, a disposible cell phone (Telcel Amigo) and some paperwork, and voila! You are now the proud owner of a biz EFL "school"

I maxed out around $18,000 monthly in a colegio and I had no need to teach outside of it, though I did do some private biz classes for $200 a hour, so I was making over $20,000 pesos monthly, after taxes.


I think the glass ceiling for teaching EFL in Mexico is $30,000 per month, particularly when working on your own, and lots of things (namely schedule) need to come together in order to get there.
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Guy Courchesne



Joined: 10 Mar 2003
Posts: 9650
Location: Mexico City

PostPosted: Wed May 02, 2012 4:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

30,000 would be tough to hold together over a period teaching on your own...doable but that's a lot of work. It is as much tracking down new students/companies as teaching I think.

I don't think the DELTA track takes you much further than teacher training at the British Council or International House and there, you're not looking at more than 20k. If someone knows better, please share with us.

There's always the idea of moving out of the classroom and into management...a program coordinator at a place like Peterson earns fairly well and doesn't teach directly. That takes a few other intermediate steps, courses, and additional experience of course, but it is another path to take.
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MotherF



Joined: 07 Jun 2010
Posts: 1450
Location: 17�48'N 97�46'W

PostPosted: Wed May 02, 2012 2:30 pm    Post subject: Re: possible to make good money in DF without teaching kids? Reply with quote

SpaceTone wrote:

Additional studies like a BA/MA in ESL aren�t feasible in my situation, but things like ICELT/DELTA, which I believe could be done whilst working, are.
Any insights/experiences appreciated.
Cheers


I'm confused as to what this says about your current qualifications. Do you have a degree in something? Do you have a CELTA or other TEFL cert?
Why couldn't you do an MA while working? There are tons of reputable distance ones out there now that you can do while working.
An MA would open up the world of higher education. Many years ago I met a guy in DF at one of Guy's get togethers who was making more than 20,000 teaching at a private university. We had an argument about cost of living, because he was sure my university (well outside of DF) wasn't paying enough to live on because he felt like he was just getting buy on 20,000. And at the time we were paying about 10. I'm pretty sure this was before my kids were born so that was 8 years ago.
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EFLeducator



Joined: 16 Dec 2011
Posts: 595
Location: NONE OF YOUR BUSINESS

PostPosted: Wed May 02, 2012 4:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Some very important considerations must have been overlooked by some but what you must consider when teaching in Mexico City is the following.

1. MANY language institutes, colegios, and private students will NOT pay you on time.

2. Many will cancel leaving you with less dinero than you had planned on.

You see, TEFLing salaries in Mexico City is like a roller coaster...it goes up and then down, up and then down. It will be very hard to budget regardless of what some say.

And this, I make 20,000 a month statement?? Well, let's just say that 20,000 a month WILL fluctuate more than the blood pressure of Calderon.

FAIR...& BALANCED.
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SpaceTone



Joined: 11 Jul 2010
Posts: 29

PostPosted: Wed May 02, 2012 5:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
There's always the idea of moving out of the classroom and into management...a program coordinator at a place like Peterson earns fairly well and doesn't teach directly. That takes a few other intermediate steps, courses, and additional experience of course, but it is another path to take.

Guy, could you kindly expand on what the steps/courses would be to get in to coordinator type roles?

Quote:
I'm confused as to what this says about your current qualifications. Do you have a degree in something? Do you have a CELTA or other TEFL cert?
Why couldn't you do an MA while working?

MotherF, I do have a degree (but it�s not related to EFL/education) and CELTA, plus 1.5 years business English experience. When I said an MA wasn�t feasible, what I really meant was that I�m not in a position financially to pay out for an MA. I mentioned ICELT/DELTA because at least 1 institution gives their teachers discounts, and I believe the option to have the cost deducted from monthly wages.
Although the distance MA could be an option if it was a staggered payment system. And cheap! So is an MA necessary for university positions?

Has anyone had any experience in examining? I was told that this could be an option too.

Whatever avenue I go down, I have no qualms with additional studies if they can be paid for out of EFL wages. But would like to know that the effort and expense will pay off long term.

There�s always kids as a last resort I guess. A noble job, but the discipline issues etc really put me off.

Thanks all for your comments, much appreciated
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Guy Courchesne



Joined: 10 Mar 2003
Posts: 9650
Location: Mexico City

PostPosted: Wed May 02, 2012 5:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ICELT and DELTA are two to start with, but coordinators deal a lot with testing systems, particularly the Cambridge ESOL suite. Getting experience with test prep courses and materials. I think the British Council has courses for teachers on FCE, PET, etc.

Now that you've said 1.5 years experience, then I also add that you need more classroom experience, in a larger institution with adults or put in at least a year with the kids.

Are you involved with Mextesol? Might be worth your time to join the group and start asking around. You get teachers, coordinators, and publishers all under one roof.
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MotherF



Joined: 07 Jun 2010
Posts: 1450
Location: 17�48'N 97�46'W

PostPosted: Wed May 02, 2012 5:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Not everyone is cut out for working with kids.
I enjoyed it in Japan, but the kids came to me for no more than 1 hour than left the room. I was able to (and enjoyed) keep them focused on the task at hand for that time period. But I really don't think I could be a regular classroom teacher who has the kids all day or even half day at a bilingual school! As a parent, I'm really glad that there are people who do do that!

There is a wide variety of options in terms of paying for distance MAs, it is possible to find some with payment plans. A lack of an MA will not completely exclude you from university work, but having one will often get you more money and make you more competitive while you try to get there.

As for examining--the way it works in Mexico is that Cambridge ESOL only trains teachers who's institutions want them to be examiners--so first you have to have a job in a place that wants to give exams, then you get the training for it. IF you arrive in Mexico already a certified examiner then it is possible to pick up hours examining at institutes in major cities free lance.
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mejms



Joined: 04 Jan 2010
Posts: 390

PostPosted: Wed May 02, 2012 7:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
FAIR...& BALANCED.


EFLeducator, any chance that you're a big fan of Fox News?
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Enchilada Potosina



Joined: 03 Aug 2010
Posts: 344
Location: Mexico

PostPosted: Wed May 02, 2012 7:54 pm    Post subject: Re: possible to make good money in DF without teaching kids? Reply with quote

SpaceTone wrote:
Additional studies like a BA/MA in ESL aren�t feasible in my situation, but things like ICELT/DELTA, which I believe could be done whilst working, are.
Any insights/experiences appreciated.
Cheers

The ICELT costs around $40,000 pesos, which you don't need to pay all at once, but on tefl wages you may as well buy a car instead. Places generally won't help you with the cost of studying either.

I guess it depends what your long-term goal is.

If you want some kind of stability then colegio jobs with benefits are probably the only way to go. If you can put up with the kids and you're happy making max $18,000 a month then go for it.

Working for yourself is another option although this gives you no guaranteed income plus if you want to do it properly you'll need to issue invoices, get an accountant and so forth. You can easily make more than the above figure but then you can just as easily make less.

Working for 2/3 or more schools/universities. Only really works in the short term to cover beer-related expenses. You work under the 3rd world honorarios assimilables system which means your employer(s) can legally retain taxes, not give you an benefits and drop you like a hot potato. This is definitely the worst way to make money here.
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EFLeducator



Joined: 16 Dec 2011
Posts: 595
Location: NONE OF YOUR BUSINESS

PostPosted: Wed May 02, 2012 10:03 pm    Post subject: Re: possible to make good money in DF without teaching kids? Reply with quote

Enchilada Potosina wrote:
Working for 2/3 or more schools/universities. Only really works in the short term to cover beer-related expenses. You work under the 3rd world honorarios assimilables system which means your employer(s) can legally retain taxes, not give you an benefits and drop you like a hot potato.


Right!

Way to keep things FAIR...& BALANCED EP.
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donato



Joined: 05 May 2010
Posts: 98
Location: Mexico City, Mexico

PostPosted: Wed May 02, 2012 10:25 pm    Post subject: Re: possible to make good money in DF without teaching kids? Reply with quote

Enchilada Potosina wrote:
SpaceTone wrote:
Additional studies like a BA/MA in ESL aren�t feasible in my situation, but things like ICELT/DELTA, which I believe could be done whilst working, are.
Any insights/experiences appreciated.
Cheers

The ICELT costs around $40,000 pesos, which you don't need to pay all at once, but on tefl wages you may as well buy a car instead. Places generally won't help you with the cost of studying either


Don't know if it's changed, but it was $18,000 last year, and half off of that if you work at IH.


p.s.- good luck, capto!
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Enchilada Potosina



Joined: 03 Aug 2010
Posts: 344
Location: Mexico

PostPosted: Thu May 03, 2012 3:44 pm    Post subject: Re: possible to make good money in DF without teaching kids? Reply with quote

donato wrote:
Enchilada Potosina wrote:
SpaceTone wrote:
Additional studies like a BA/MA in ESL aren�t feasible in my situation, but things like ICELT/DELTA, which I believe could be done whilst working, are.
Any insights/experiences appreciated.
Cheers

The ICELT costs around $40,000 pesos, which you don't need to pay all at once, but on tefl wages you may as well buy a car instead. Places generally won't help you with the cost of studying either


Don't know if it's changed, but it was $18,000 last year, and half off of that if you work at IH.


p.s.- good luck, capto!

Ooops, that figure was for the DELTA. Too much sun...
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Prof.Gringo



Joined: 07 Nov 2006
Posts: 2236
Location: Dang Cong San Viet Nam Quang Vinh Muon Nam!

PostPosted: Sat May 05, 2012 3:08 am    Post subject: Re: possible to make good money in DF without teaching kids? Reply with quote

Enchilada Potosina wrote:
SpaceTone wrote:
Additional studies like a BA/MA in ESL aren�t feasible in my situation, but things like ICELT/DELTA, which I believe could be done whilst working, are.
Any insights/experiences appreciated.
Cheers

The ICELT costs around $40,000 pesos, which you don't need to pay all at once, but on tefl wages you may as well buy a car instead. Places generally won't help you with the cost of studying either.

I guess it depends what your long-term goal is.

If you want some kind of stability then colegio jobs with benefits are probably the only way to go. If you can put up with the kids and you're happy making max $18,000 a month then go for it.

Working for yourself is another option although this gives you no guaranteed income plus if you want to do it properly you'll need to issue invoices, get an accountant and so forth. You can easily make more than the above figure but then you can just as easily make less.

Working for 2/3 or more schools/universities. Only really works in the short term to cover beer-related expenses. You work under the 3rd world honorarios assimilables system which means your employer(s) can legally retain taxes, not give you an benefits and drop you like a hot potato. This is definitely the worst way to make money here.


Very good advice Enchilada!

ICELT won't be of much help in most schools in Mexico, neither is a DELTA. Better to buy a car, at least you can actually use it and improve the all important quality of life.

To work in a colegio in Mexico, as a native-speaker you will need:

1. A TEFL cert.

2. MAYBE a degree.

3. Be at the right school, at the right time to get hired.

4. Be able to baby sit rich kids all day.

5. Work nights./weekends/holidays to meet deadlines and grade homework.

6. Inflate grades so that the kids who did nothing to actually earn such grades, their rich parents who paid so much for this so-called "education" and the admin (who will NEVER back you as a so-called pro TEFL'er when it involves unhappy parents/students which pay to get a piece of paper)will all be happy.

7. Turn a blind eye to the bribes that many teachers take.

8. Sell your soul.

9. Convince yourself that this is the way everything works in Mexico, so it's not a big deal. Your ideals, values and morals needed to "adapt" to the new ones of your adopted country.

10. Post about your TEFL "success story" and share it with others!
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