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Adventurer
Joined: 28 Jan 2006
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 Posted: Sun Feb 25, 2007 7:57 am Post subject: Circumcision helps prevent HIV infection, studies confirm |
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Circumcision helps prevent HIV infection, studies confirm
Last Updated: Friday, February 23, 2007 | 3:23 PM ET
CBC News
Adult male circumcision reduces the risk of HIV infection from heterosexual intercourse by up to 60 per cent, three trials suggested.
Early results of the trials conducted in Kenya, Uganda and South Africa were so positive that the studies were ended early to give all of the men participating a chance to get circumcized.
Full data from the trial appears in Saturday's issue of The Lancet.
"This is an extraordinary development," said Dr. Kevin de Cock, director of the World Health Organization's AIDS department. "Circumcision is the most potent intervention in HIV prevention that has been described."
The studies show circumcision can reduce the risk of HIV infection in men, Marie-Louise Newell of the University of KwaZulu-Natal in South Africa and Till Barnighausen of the Harvard School of Public Health said in a commentary that accompanies the research.
If all of the 2.5 million men in KwaZulu-Natal province had been circumcised, 37,000 new infections could have been prevented in 2007, they estimated.
http://www.cbc.ca/health/story/2007/02/23/hiv-curcumcision.html |
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mithridates
Joined: 03 Mar 2003
Location: President's office, Korean Space Agency
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| Posted: Sun Feb 25, 2007 8:22 am Post subject: Re: Circumcision helps prevent HIV infection, studies confir |
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An estimation that I'm sure didn't take into account the change in sexual activity that would happen with men given the impression that it's much safer to have sex now that the circumcision's been done. It's like concluding that 65% of people assaulted on the street would have driven off the attacker if they had a pair of brass knuckles, and then handing out a pair to each guy in the country and expecting violence to go down. |
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jinju
Joined: 22 Jan 2006
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| Posted: Sun Feb 25, 2007 4:15 pm Post subject: |
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| The only thing yhe studies show is that there is a correlation. Correlation doesnt prove causation. When they do actual physical experiments on how circumcition stops the transmission of HIV, THEN I will be convinced. |
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mindmetoo
Joined: 02 Feb 2004
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| Posted: Sun Feb 25, 2007 4:46 pm Post subject: |
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| jinju wrote: |
| The only thing yhe studies show is that there is a correlation. Correlation doesnt prove causation. When they do actual physical experiments on how circumcition stops the transmission of HIV, THEN I will be convinced. |
Correct. Just as a high correlation between aspirin and Reye syndrome doesn't prove causation. Although when parents stopped giving their children ASA, cases of Reye syndrome have almost disappeared. No one knows how ASA interacted with a child's brain and the flu to cause Reye syndrome but it was prudent based purely on correlation to recommend parents switch to another analgesic for children. |
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mindmetoo
Joined: 02 Feb 2004
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| Posted: Sun Feb 25, 2007 4:48 pm Post subject: Re: Circumcision helps prevent HIV infection, studies confir |
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| mithridates wrote: |
An estimation that I'm sure didn't take into account the change in sexual activity that would happen with men given the impression that it's much safer to have sex now that the circumcision's been done. It's like concluding that 65% of people assaulted on the street would have driven off the attacker if they had a pair of brass knuckles, and then handing out a pair to each guy in the country and expecting violence to go down. |
Yeah, you can't control for risk assessment. It's like giving people "rain eater" tires or SUVs with four wheel drives and they experience higher rates of accidents despite the technically safer equipment. People perceive they're safer and then take higher risks (driving faster in rain and snow). |
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ChimpumCallao
Joined: 17 May 2005
Location: your mom
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| Posted: Sun Feb 25, 2007 7:09 pm Post subject: |
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I just saw a "bullsh!t" episode on circumcision and i must say that it is a pretty barbaric practice that apparently reduces some size and pleasure from the dudes. Although there may be evidence that it MAY prevent some STD's, perhaps then circumcision should be an option for those in very high AIDS infection areas, like sub saharan africa, but in the case of most westeners, where AIDS is still not very prevalent between heterosexuals who do not use needles, its a very extreme practice.
have you ever seen one? its horrible. dudes shouldnt have giant scars on their wangs just because jehova said so. |
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mindmetoo
Joined: 02 Feb 2004
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| Posted: Sun Feb 25, 2007 9:46 pm Post subject: |
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| ChimpumCallao wrote: |
I just saw a "bullsh!t" episode on circumcision and i must say that it is a pretty barbaric practice that apparently reduces some size and pleasure from the dudes. Although there may be evidence that it MAY prevent some STD's, perhaps then circumcision should be an option for those in very high AIDS infection areas, like sub saharan africa, but in the case of most westeners, where AIDS is still not very prevalent between heterosexuals who do not use needles, its a very extreme practice.
have you ever seen one? its horrible. dudes shouldnt have giant scars on their wangs just because jehova said so. |
That's the only Bulls *clap* hit episode I couldn't watch. Certainly it's medically unnecessary in a hygiene oriented culture. And certainly x number of babies die from complications every year. And you can argue you're giving the baby no choice. But then a lot of parents get their children's ears pieced these days and I'm certain as many children die from infections. |
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ChimpumCallao
Joined: 17 May 2005
Location: your mom
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| Posted: Sun Feb 25, 2007 10:24 pm Post subject: |
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| mindmetoo wrote: |
| ChimpumCallao wrote: |
I just saw a "bullsh!t" episode on circumcision and i must say that it is a pretty barbaric practice that apparently reduces some size and pleasure from the dudes. Although there may be evidence that it MAY prevent some STD's, perhaps then circumcision should be an option for those in very high AIDS infection areas, like sub saharan africa, but in the case of most westeners, where AIDS is still not very prevalent between heterosexuals who do not use needles, its a very extreme practice.
have you ever seen one? its horrible. dudes shouldnt have giant scars on their wangs just because jehova said so. |
That's the only Bulls *clap* hit episode I couldn't watch. Certainly it's medically unnecessary in a hygiene oriented culture. And certainly x number of babies die from complications every year. And you can argue you're giving the baby no choice. But then a lot of parents get their children's ears pieced these days and I'm certain as many children die from infections. |
dude, i couldnt watch it and im a girl. it was just not right...did you see the baby basically having a panic attack? it was awful.
an earlobe is not as important as genitalia. point blank. plus, the earlobe is not touched in any way...but i do agree that its unnecessary...but certainly not in the same level as circumcision.
furthermore, its not the procedure that is the problem, as both are quite hygenic...its the after effects. i can take off my earrings and have an intact ear just like when i was a baby...you can't do that with a johnson.
i think circumsicion should be something left up to an adult to decide...to mutilate a child like that is disgusting, especially considering its archaic, prudish traditions (thought of as a good idea in the 1900s as they assumed itd make little boys stop touching themselves so much...meaning, they removed a lot of nerves, and therefor sense...and therefore PLEASURE from that area.) its not something to be taken lightly. id rather give my kid three nose rings than partake in such a horrible practice. |
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jinju
Joined: 22 Jan 2006
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| Posted: Sun Feb 25, 2007 10:32 pm Post subject: |
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Circumsition is a disgusting act, religious motivatuons or not. Its a crime done to a child. Point blank.
As far as this study, I have serious doubts about it, it proves absolutely nothing but some kind of a correlation when a number of factors come into play. There is no direct link between AIDS prevention and circumsition.
People pushing this "evidence" obviously have an agenda. *beep* them. |
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mindmetoo
Joined: 02 Feb 2004
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| Posted: Mon Feb 26, 2007 1:20 am Post subject: |
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| jinju wrote: |
Circumsition is a disgusting act, religious motivatuons or not. Its a crime done to a child. Point blank.
As far as this study, I have serious doubts about it, it proves absolutely nothing but some kind of a correlation when a number of factors come into play. There is no direct link between AIDS prevention and circumsition.
People pushing this "evidence" obviously have an agenda. *beep* them. |
Well disgusting to you. Some might find tattooing disgusting.
You can call it a crime and I encourage you to lobby your law makers to make it such. But it's not currently a crime.
What leads you to believe the people pushing the evidence have an agenda? Is there a circumcision lobby I'm not aware of? |
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ChimpumCallao
Joined: 17 May 2005
Location: your mom
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| Posted: Mon Feb 26, 2007 2:08 am Post subject: |
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| mindmetoo wrote: |
| jinju wrote: |
Circumsition is a disgusting act, religious motivatuons or not. Its a crime done to a child. Point blank.
As far as this study, I have serious doubts about it, it proves absolutely nothing but some kind of a correlation when a number of factors come into play. There is no direct link between AIDS prevention and circumsition.
People pushing this "evidence" obviously have an agenda. *beep* them. |
Well disgusting to you. Some might find tattooing disgusting.
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sorry. illogical.
tattoing is done by adults out of their own volition. circumcision is not a choice.
the disgusting part doesn't matter, its the 'free will' and 'unecessary' part that is problematic. |
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nautilus
Joined: 26 Nov 2005
Location: Je jump, Tu jump, oui jump!
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| Posted: Mon Feb 26, 2007 2:42 am Post subject: |
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[quote="jinju"]
| Quote: |
| Circumsition is a disgusting act, religious motivatuons or not. Its a crime done to a child. Point blank. |
I'm always amazed by this response. I "had the op" as a baby. "No" is the answer. I suppose you can't miss what you never knew, but I never felt any resentment or anger about having had a flap of skin removed as a child. I suppose i do feel cleaner. I also saw guys who had it done as teenagers for hygenic purposes. They could hardly walk for a week. Personally i've never had any problems.
| Quote: |
| There is no direct link between AIDS prevention and circumsition. |
Like smoking and lung cancer you mean?
| Quote: |
| People pushing this "evidence" obviously have an agenda. *beep* them. |
-don't you think thats a bit of an overreaction? The evidence of this report clearly suggests circumcision has a beneficial effect. I have also heard that the circumcised are less likely to contract other STD's, as well as are able to have sex for longer.
PS i also had my tonsils removed as a child. I was robbed!!  |
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mindmetoo
Joined: 02 Feb 2004
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| Posted: Mon Feb 26, 2007 3:23 am Post subject: |
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| ChimpumCallao wrote: |
| mindmetoo wrote: |
| jinju wrote: |
Circumsition is a disgusting act, religious motivatuons or not. Its a crime done to a child. Point blank.
As far as this study, I have serious doubts about it, it proves absolutely nothing but some kind of a correlation when a number of factors come into play. There is no direct link between AIDS prevention and circumsition.
People pushing this "evidence" obviously have an agenda. *beep* them. |
Well disgusting to you. Some might find tattooing disgusting.
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sorry. illogical.
tattoing is done by adults out of their own volition. circumcision is not a choice.
the disgusting part doesn't matter, its the 'free will' and 'unecessary' part that is problematic. |
Parents don't tattoo their children or have their children's ears pierced? Ever? Parents do a lot of things to children and babies without the baby's consent. It's not a crime or a violation of a child's free will. Many states happily let parents let their child die, although a simple blood transfusion would save their lives. Do the parents ask the child if he/she wants to be part of the religion?
We allow parents to exercise judgments over their child within the law. A spanking parents legally deliver to some is just as bad as foreskin removal. Oh well. |
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jinju
Joined: 22 Jan 2006
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| Posted: Mon Feb 26, 2007 3:42 am Post subject: |
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| nautilus wrote: |
| Quote: |
| People pushing this "evidence" obviously have an agenda. *beep* them. |
-don't you think thats a bit of an overreaction? The evidence of this report clearly suggests circumcision has a beneficial effect. |
No, I dont. There is a clear pro-circumsition agenda here, stemmng from doctors wanting to push as much intervention on people aspossible. Again, I simply dont take this study seriously. |
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mindmetoo
Joined: 02 Feb 2004
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| Posted: Mon Feb 26, 2007 5:10 am Post subject: |
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| jinju wrote: |
| nautilus wrote: |
| Quote: |
| People pushing this "evidence" obviously have an agenda. *beep* them. |
-don't you think thats a bit of an overreaction? The evidence of this report clearly suggests circumcision has a beneficial effect. |
No, I dont. There is a clear pro-circumsition agenda here, stemmng from doctors wanting to push as much intervention on people aspossible. Again, I simply dont take this study seriously. |
What's your evidence? |
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