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Immense Ice Deposits Found At South Pole Of Mars
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igotthisguitar



Joined: 08 Apr 2003
Location: South Korea (Permanent Vacation)

PostPosted: Thu Mar 15, 2007 10:14 pm    Post subject: Immense Ice Deposits Found At South Pole Of Mars Reply with quote

Immense Ice Deposits Found At South Pole Of Mars
By Will Dunham
Thu Mar 15, 3:00 PM ET

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - A spacecraft orbiting Mars has scanned huge deposits of water ice at its south pole so plentiful they would blanket the planet in 36 feet of water if they were liquid, scientists said on Thursday.

The scientists used a joint NASA-Italian Space Agency radar instrument on the European Space Agency Mars Express spacecraft to gauge the thickness and volume of ice deposits at the Martian south pole covering an area larger than Texas.

The deposits, up to 2.3 miles thick, are under a polar cap of white frozen carbon dioxide and water, and appear to be composed of at least 90 percent frozen water, with dust mixed in, according to findings published in the journal Science.

Scientists have known that water exists in frozen form at the Martian poles, but this research produced the most accurate measurements of just how much there is.

They are eager to learn about the history of water on Mars because water is fundamental to the question of whether the planet has ever harbored microbial or some other life.

Liquid water is a necessity for life ... as we know it.

Characteristics like channels on the Martian surface strongly suggest the planet once was very wet, a contrast to its present arid, dusty condition.

Jeffrey Plaut of NASA's Jet Propulsion Laboratory in Pasadena, California, who led the study, said the same techniques are being used to examine similar ice deposits at the Martian north pole.

Radar observations made in late 2005 and early 2006 provided the data on the south pole, and similar observations were taken of the north pole in the past several months, Plaut said.

Plaut, part of an international team of two dozen scientists, said a preliminary look at this data indicated the ice deposits in at the north pole are comparable to those at the south pole.

SEARCH FOR LIFE

CONT'd ...

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20070315/ts_nm/mars_water_dc (ETC)
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Gatsby



Joined: 09 Feb 2007

PostPosted: Thu Mar 15, 2007 11:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Now if only they were hiring TESL instructors ....

I sure would like to get off this planet.
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VanIslander



Joined: 18 Aug 2003
Location: Geoje, Hadong, Tongyeong,... now in a small coastal island town outside Gyeongsangnamdo!

PostPosted: Fri Mar 16, 2007 12:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Brought to you by the same military-industrial complex behind the WMD in Iraq claim.

A precursor to the move to get billions more in taxpayers money to be invested in large contracts by private corporations supplying the "search".

It's big business.
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Hollywoodaction



Joined: 02 Jul 2004

PostPosted: Sat Mar 17, 2007 5:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Isn't that old news?

http://science.nasa.gov/headlines/y2002/28may_marsice.htm
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Gatsby



Joined: 09 Feb 2007

PostPosted: Sat Mar 17, 2007 8:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hollywoodaction

Quote:
Isn't that old news?

http://science.nasa.gov/headlines/y2002/28may_marsice.htm


It is, indeed, amazing how many times scientists have "discovered" water on Mars.

You are apparently making the erroneous assumption that newspaper editors actually read newspapers, or much of anything else not provided with copious color illustrations.

A college professor could probably issue a press release stating that astronomers have discovered a new planet orbiting the sun called "Uranus" and half the newspapers in the country would cover it with banner headlines.


Last edited by Gatsby on Sun Mar 18, 2007 3:17 pm; edited 1 time in total
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NAVFC



Joined: 10 May 2006

PostPosted: Sun Mar 18, 2007 4:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

VanIslander wrote:
Brought to you by the same military-industrial complex behind the WMD in Iraq claim.

A precursor to the move to get billions more in taxpayers money to be invested in large contracts by private corporations supplying the "search".

It's big business.


Your a dumbass.
NASA is a civilian run company, not a military organization. While alot of astronauts and shuttle workers are former military, thats the extent of it.

Space exploration is of utmost importance.
Plus, the water claim is no lie. Esp. when they publicly release said images.

One day Earth will be gone. Either no longer habitable or maybe a extinction level event: IE: asteroid takes place. When it does, we will need to find a new home, and to do such we will have needed to develop the technology to do so. This latest revelation regarding mars means someday in the far future, mayhaps we could terraform Mars into Earth 2.


Melting that water would give oceans, the water cycle would yield Oxygen giving Mars an atmosphere.
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mithridates



Joined: 03 Mar 2003
Location: President's office, Korean Space Agency

PostPosted: Sun Mar 18, 2007 5:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

VanIslander wrote:
Brought to you by the same military-industrial complex behind the WMD in Iraq claim.

A precursor to the move to get billions more in taxpayers money to be invested in large contracts by private corporations supplying the "search".

It's big business.


Confused
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mithridates



Joined: 03 Mar 2003
Location: President's office, Korean Space Agency

PostPosted: Sun Mar 18, 2007 5:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hollywoodaction wrote:
Isn't that old news?

http://science.nasa.gov/headlines/y2002/28may_marsice.htm


This new discovery is about the extent of the ice - the article from 2002 was when it was first discovered through measurements that I think went down only about a metre under the surface. These new measurements go down about 5 km or so below the surface and produce a much more accurate number re: the total volume.
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mithridates



Joined: 03 Mar 2003
Location: President's office, Korean Space Agency

PostPosted: Sun Mar 18, 2007 5:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

NAVFC wrote:
VanIslander wrote:
Brought to you by the same military-industrial complex behind the WMD in Iraq claim.

A precursor to the move to get billions more in taxpayers money to be invested in large contracts by private corporations supplying the "search".

It's big business.


Your a dumbass.
NASA is a civilian run company, not a military organization. While alot of astronauts and shuttle workers are former military, thats the extent of it.

Space exploration is of utmost importance.
Plus, the water claim is no lie. Esp. when they publicly release said images.

One day Earth will be gone. Either no longer habitable or maybe a extinction level event: IE: asteroid takes place. When it does, we will need to find a new home, and to do such we will have needed to develop the technology to do so. This latest revelation regarding mars means someday in the far future, mayhaps we could terraform Mars into Earth 2.


Melting that water would give oceans, the water cycle would yield Oxygen giving Mars an atmosphere.


Though I like the idea of colonizing Mars, I've been more interested in this location recently:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1_Ceres

Though smaller, it contains a huge mantle of ice below the surface (more than the total fresh water on the Earth), and though it doesn't have enough gravity to hold an atmosphere for millions of years it can for centuries, which is more than enough for humans to replenish it. Adding to that the fact that it has 50 times less surface area than Mars, that means for the effort it takes to bring the Martian atmosphere 2% closer to that of the Earth, we would already be done on Ceres.
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SPINOZA



Joined: 10 Jun 2005
Location: $eoul

PostPosted: Sun Mar 18, 2007 5:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Immense Ice Deposits Found At South Pole Of Mars


Hardly surprising considering Mars's polar caps are visible from Earth with a basic telescope and are a very striking feature of the planet.

Quote:
Space exploration is of utmost importance


That's debatable. Laughing





Quote:
This latest revelation regarding mars means someday in the far future, mayhaps we could terraform Mars into Earth 2.


Melting that water would give oceans, the water cycle would yield Oxygen giving Mars an atmosphere.


living on Mars would suck. Other than equatorial regions where temperatures reach a pleasant 12-20c, general conditions are akin to Antarctica - very low temperatures and immense wind. I'm totally in to Mars, but ideas of colonization are optimistic given its totally inhospitable conditions.
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NAVFC



Joined: 10 May 2006

PostPosted: Sun Mar 18, 2007 5:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

SPINOZA wrote:
Quote:
Immense Ice Deposits Found At South Pole Of Mars


Hardly surprising considering Mars's polar caps are visible from Earth with a basic telescope and are a very striking feature of the planet.

Quote:
Space exploration is of utmost importance


That's debatable. Laughing





Quote:
This latest revelation regarding mars means someday in the far future, mayhaps we could terraform Mars into Earth 2.


Melting that water would give oceans, the water cycle would yield Oxygen giving Mars an atmosphere.


living on Mars would suck. Other than equatorial regions where temperatures reach a pleasant 12-20c, general conditions are akin to Antarctica - very low temperatures and immense wind. I'm totally in to Mars, but ideas of colonization are optimistic given its totally inhospitable conditions.



Do you even know what terraforming means?
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mithridates



Joined: 03 Mar 2003
Location: President's office, Korean Space Agency

PostPosted: Sun Mar 18, 2007 7:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

SPINOZA wrote:
Quote:
Immense Ice Deposits Found At South Pole Of Mars


Hardly surprising considering Mars's polar caps are visible from Earth with a basic telescope and are a very striking feature of the planet.


Seeing ice from a distance doesn't necessarily imply water - for a long time it wasn't certain whether they were made up of water or just CO2. Just like the lakes on Titan - just seeing lakes doesn't mean they're water - those are composed of liquid methane.
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On the other hand



Joined: 19 Apr 2003
Location: I walk along the avenue

PostPosted: Sun Mar 18, 2007 8:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
And then there was the time when McDonald's could issue virtually any press release, and for some reason just about every paper in the country would run it on its front page. McDonald's to sell hamburgers made with seaweed! (This actually happened. They were disgusting.) McDonald's to sell Big Macs for 55 cents in honor of its anniversary. (If you went to a McDonald's you discovered you had to buy a medium drink and medium fries, but how many papers reported this?) They ran. Sure beats paying for advertising.


Remember those bank ads with the Dutch guy who hectored the audience with catch phrases "didn't your bank tell you this" and "save your money"? I once read, in a respectable newspaper, a profile of the actor who was in those ads. In the article, the persona he plays in the ads was referred to as a "consumer advocate", with nothing to indicate that the description should be taken at anything but face value.
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SPINOZA



Joined: 10 Jun 2005
Location: $eoul

PostPosted: Mon Mar 19, 2007 3:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sorry, I completely forgot about this.......

NAVFC

It depends what kind of Earth 2 you envisage. Earth II sounds very attractive to the casual observer I'm sure, but Full-on Earth II with breathable atmosphere and tolerable temperatures? The timescales are absolutely immense. The time required to produce an oxygen rich atmosphere via photosynthesis is over 100,000 years and even that is of course modest compared to the 2 billion it took here (so�..don�t hold your breath! Laughing ). Also, studies have been done to determine what Mars' environment would be like if it had an atmosphere exactly like Earth's. The surface temperature on the planet would be considerably warmer than it is now of course (average -60c now, less than -100c at the Poles in Winter) because the carbon dioxide content would be about 30 times greater. But, it would still be generally too cold to be habitable because of its greater distance from the Sun. However, if a vaguely suitable entity requiring breathing apparatus and other protection will do, that is manageable in a more reasonable timescale (1000 years).

Further, I'd love to know how many folks there are who deny the centrality of co2 to global warming yet simultaneously advocate that introducing C02 and other greenhouse gases to Mars' atmosphere is the key to warming Mars. A comically contradictory position. Whilst melting Mars� ice H20 and ice C02 is exciting and a good idea, we�d be far better investing in improving our planet in my opinion.

Mithridates

Haven't we known for some time that the poles (especially the north, if I recall, but also the South in copious quantities now as we found out in the OP) are a mixture of ice H20 and ice CO2?
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mithridates



Joined: 03 Mar 2003
Location: President's office, Korean Space Agency

PostPosted: Mon Mar 19, 2007 4:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

SPINOZA wrote:
Mithridates

Haven't we known for some time that the poles (especially the north, if I recall, but also the South in copious quantities now as we found out in the OP) are a mixture of ice H20 and ice CO2?


Yes - I'm not sure exactly since when but not simply through looking through regular telescopes and seeing that the south looks white and therefore must be ice. For a while though they weren't sure about two things: whether it was mostly just CO2 or not, and how deep the ice went. There was a possibility before that it might have just been dirty CO2 ice on the top of rocks that looked like more than it was, but it turns out to be better and better as time goes on.

Here's an entry from the 1911 edition of Britannica which shows what we knew well before the space age:

http://www.1911encyclopedia.org/Mars
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