|
Korean Job Discussion Forums
"The Internet's Meeting Place for ESL/EFL Teachers from Around the World!"
|
| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
dogbert
Joined: 29 Jan 2003
Location: Killbox 90210
|
 Posted: Wed Sep 24, 2003 6:24 pm Post subject: |
 |
|
| Gawd, I know I'll get flamed for this, but how is it that a city can be "too white"? It always makes my teeth itch whenever I hear someone say that. |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
desultude
Joined: 15 Jan 2003
Location: Dangling my toes in the Persian Gulf
|
| Posted: Wed Sep 24, 2003 6:42 pm Post subject: |
|
|
No, I won't flame you for that, it is a reasonable question.
When I say "too white" I simply mean that it is monocultural. After living in Miami, where I hear many languages in one given day, where breakfast can be pan Cubano and cafe con leche, lunch a pastrami on rye (real, Jewish deli pastrami and rye) and dinner curry goat eaten at a little Haitian dive, and where the music on the radio spans the world, some "white" Pacific Northwest cities are a little bland and monocultural.
The same can be said for New York City, L.A., Chicago, and many other large U.S. cities (that they are wonderfully multicultural).
I like a cosmopolitan city. Its my preference. Besides, I feel more fit to live in the big world for having lived in such a mixed culture. I prefer "moros y Cristianos"- blacks beans mixed in with my white rice.
Last edited by desultude on Wed Sep 24, 2003 6:50 pm; edited 1 time in total |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
dogbert
Joined: 29 Jan 2003
Location: Killbox 90210
|
| Posted: Wed Sep 24, 2003 6:43 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Thank you for your answer. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
bugs
Joined: 09 Sep 2003
Location: Classroom
|
| Posted: Wed Sep 24, 2003 7:15 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Quote: |
Seattle has a few more asians.. but also right up there as another very white city of the USA. Oddly everywhere near the Canadian border is pretty white.. from Washington to Montana to the northern parts of the Midwest to Maine. So I can see why it definetely looks like that coming from Canada.
Most of the immigrants seem to gravitate towards the big cities.. which are mostly in California, Florida, Texas, New York, New Jersey, Massachusetts, Virgina (DC area) and Illinois definetely leading the nation by a far far margin - also they are where the mass majority of the population lives as well. All the major cities (LA, SF, DC, Chicago, NYC, Boston, Miami, Houston, etc.).
I guess certain places have a very unusual proportion of enormous amounts of immigrants and other places are seem completely void. Seemingly, everywhere near the Canadian border of the US seems to be pretty much void of any kind of immigration patterns.
|
A long time lurker and a first time poster, and I had to respond due to such an erroneous statement. I'm an ESL teacher in Seattle. I spent most of my life either in Seoul, Korea, Honolulu, Hawaii, or Seattle, Washington, USA. Consequently, I believe that I'm somewhat qualified to repond to the above statement.
I don't find this to be true at all. As a former alumn of University of Washington, I found UW to be extremely diverse and cosmopolitan. I believe about 40 % of the student body is minority; mostly Asian-Americans; UW is located at the center of Seattle. Moreover, Seattle and the Puget Sound area are very diverse. Despite mostly "White," conservative areas in the Eastern Washington, due to heavily concentrated, minority population in the Seattle area, our current, two-term governor is an Asian.
A lot of schools in Seattle have a large Asian population, and depending in the neighborhood, Latino population as well. Some well-off neighborhoods are predominately White, however, also have their concentration of wealthy Asians too.
Remember, Seattle and Puget Sound have one of the largest port system in the U.S.. Internationally, the state of Washington's primary trading partners are Japan, Korea, and China; more than any other ports in the U.S. The city of Seattle is known as the "gateway" to Asia; from the U.S. point of view. We have a large number of Asian companies operating out of Puget Sound. If I grew up in some small, town in Eastern Washington and never been anyplace else, I would almost have believer your blanket statement. Remember, there's a reason why this is called the World Wide Web; need to be careful what you say, especially from a so-called "teacher." Sorry for the rant.
W. Bugs |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
desultude
Joined: 15 Jan 2003
Location: Dangling my toes in the Persian Gulf
|
| Posted: Wed Sep 24, 2003 7:44 pm Post subject: |
|
|
bugs said:
| Quote: |
| I don't find this to be true at all. As a former alumn of University of Washington, I found UW to be extremely diverse and cosmopolitan. I believe about 40 % of the student body is minority; mostly Asian-Americans; UW is located at the center of Seattle. Moreover, Seattle and the Puget Sound area are very diverse. Despite mostly "White," conservative areas in the Eastern Washington, due to heavily concentrated, minority population in the Seattle area, our current, two-term governor is an Asian. |
First, welcome aboard Bugs.
I agree- I spent years (too many) at U Dub, and it was diverse, but mostly in an Asian sort of way- very small black and Latino student populations. My post about demographics is from the current census data, and it is Seattle demographics. I was careful not to make it King County or the State, because that would water down the minority stats.
But it is not just the upper class neighborhoods that are white. I lived north of the Ship Canal for years, and in a decidedly working class neighborhood which was really white. We had one Indian family in the nieghborhood, otherwise, white. it is this segregation that makes Seattle appear to be whiter than it is, and that makes the dominant culture feel quite whilte.
I really love Seattle, and would love to spend more time there, but I am glad to live in a more mixed environment when I am in the States, such as Miami. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
bugs
Joined: 09 Sep 2003
Location: Classroom
|
| Posted: Wed Sep 24, 2003 8:00 pm Post subject: |
|
|
desultude,
It's nice to know there is a fellow Husky at this forum. How are you? What are you doing in Korea? When did you graduate? Did you attend UW Ed. program? |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Tiger Beer
Joined: 07 Feb 2003
|
| Posted: Wed Sep 24, 2003 11:51 pm Post subject: |
|
|
I love the Northwest of the USA as well.. its definetely one of the most beautiful regions in the US with a great culture all its own, great microbreweries, beautiful mountains, perfect-size cities.. just everything about the entire region actually.
But after having lived in NYC and SF.. it just appears very white to me.. especially after NYC where if you get on any subway you'll hear an enormous amount of different languages, read subways signs in who knows how many languages, and find newspapers from every corner of the world scattered about the subway. And the people.. ahh the people.. truly the most amazing mosaic of people I've ever seen in my life.. (and I lived in Brazil for awhile as well!!)..
The first time I came back from abroad (Korea & South America).. I chose to live in New York City for a couple years and it was like I never came home from traveling. Particularly since I could just go to Greenpoint for example, and I'm basically in Poland.. (absolutely everything is in Polish).. go south of there a few subway stops and get out at another stop and Hasidic Jews everywhere with the hats and whatever else.. as far as the eye can see.. everyone is like that.. get on the train again.. go somewhere else and its you are in Little India.. (once again, everyone and everything you see just looks and smells and feels like India). Then the enormous Chinese (or Asian) neighborhoods in Queens, Manhattan, NJ.. other neighborhoods are all Italian or all Russian.. seemingly surrounding all the areas is overwhelmingly Spanish.. there are mostly almost all Spanish neighborhoods.. but not just 'spanish' as a catch all.. but this entire region is Dominican.. this is all Puerto Rican.. then in Manhattan you walk down the street and everything just collides into one big mish mash of everything imagineable..
Anyhow, throughout ALL of North America its changing alot. after the census reports there just seemed to be a wave throughout all of the USA and Canada as well.. of this sheesh.. well, anyhow, overwhelingly in the USA it kept talking about how the 1990s brought in the biggest wave of immigrants since the 1890s but almost entirely from all non-European places.. this same wave hit Canada as well.. just an exciting time in general.. I love it. (Same thing happening everywhere though.. from North America to Australia/NZ to all of Western Europe, etc.)
I love Seattle as well.. and in the NorthWest it definetely is the international attraction of the region.. coming from Idaho or Oregon it seems alot more.. ahmm.. not multicultural exactly.. but just a really cool place.. but on a foreign language and foreign culture feel.. it doesn't compare when descending from Vancouver.. or coming up from California however.. on a 'multicultural, really in-your-face diverse and multi-lingual' kind of way.. apart from that.. its still an amazingly beautiful city and has its pockets but you have to search them out in Seattle rather than just overwhelmingly being apart of the scenery..
Regarding one of the posts about Tacoma.. actually, my last time in the State of Washington (about one year ago).. Tacoma has been getting alot of press about its Korean population.. in fact my friend's wife in Portland Oregon is Korean.. and she's been expressing alot of interest in that area.. also I believe Olympia as well has a big Korean population. My last trip into Washington I went through some rural areas.. and surprisingly got gas in the middle of nowhere and had Koreans who were owning and running the stores. Definetely seems to be some Korean immigration going through the Seattle port..
I'll have to look it up or find something more up-to-date.. but in 1997.. Kings County, Washington was #11 in counties in the USA with significant Asian numbers.. so no doubt that there are definetely Asians in the area..
That being said, I've been living in Bay Area CA and NYC as of the last 7 years when in the USA.. so even a #11 in Asian population doesn't compare to being in other countries that are higher on the list plus mixed with even more people with extremely sizeable numbers. But still.. WA and Seattle are pretty cool when you think how many counties there are in the USA.. there must be 1000s upon 1000s of counties across the US.. so thats still pretty sizeable population of Asians in King County compared to other areas.. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Walter Mitty
Joined: 27 Mar 2003
Location: Tokyo! ^.^
|
| Posted: Thu Sep 25, 2003 1:10 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Tiger Beer wrote: |
| Regarding one of the posts about Tacoma.. actually, my last time in the State of Washington (about one year ago).. Tacoma has been getting alot of press about its Korean population.. in fact my friend's wife in Portland Oregon is Korean.. and she's been expressing alot of interest in that area.. also I believe Olympia as well has a big Korean population. My last trip into Washington I went through some rural areas.. and surprisingly got gas in the middle of nowhere and had Koreans who were owning and running the stores. Definetely seems to be some Korean immigration going through the Seattle port. |
The area in Tacoma is pretty neat. If you find yourself jonesing for most anything from Korea you can get it there. I got my friends to go to the big market there to get Peppero instead of paying $5 for Pocky at Suncoast. Same thing for $1.50.
I can relate to the rural thing as well. I was out camping on the Olympic Peninsula in 2001 and saw a roadside firewood stand. Pulled it to pick some up and there was ajumma! I heard her speaking Korean to her husband so I gave her a "kamsamnida" after I got the firewood. She smiled and he looked surprised. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Tiger Beer
Joined: 07 Feb 2003
|
| Posted: Mon Mar 21, 2005 7:25 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| bugs wrote: |
| A long time lurker and a first time poster, and I had to respond due to such an erroneous statement. I'm an ESL teacher in Seattle. I spent most of my life either in Seoul, Korea, Honolulu, Hawaii, or Seattle, Washington, USA. Consequently, I believe that I'm somewhat qualified to repond to the above statement. |
Still lurking?
Come and tell us about Honolulu! Just curious, are you Asian? I wouldn't mind hearing a bit about it. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
billybrobby
Joined: 09 Dec 2004
|
| Posted: Mon Mar 21, 2005 10:38 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Can anybody dig up some stats about the racial make-up of Canada overall??
I usually go to the CIA World Fact Book for this stuff but this time it's no help.
http://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/
In their profile of America's people, they break things down by race. But for Canada they break it down by whether people are originally from the British Isles or French or something else. Everybody else is lumped into the 'other' category and there's a huge (26%) category called 'mixed background.' I supposed this difference reflects the preoccupations of our respective countries.
Can somebody find a link that says Canadians are X percent white, Y percent black, Z percent asian and so on? |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Tiger Beer
Joined: 07 Feb 2003
|
| Posted: Tue Mar 22, 2005 12:12 am Post subject: |
|
|
| billybrobby wrote: |
Can anybody dig up some stats about the racial make-up of Canada overall??
I usually go to the CIA World Fact Book for this stuff but this time it's no help.
http://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/
In their profile of America's people, they break things down by race. But for Canada they break it down by whether people are originally from the British Isles or French or something else. Everybody else is lumped into the 'other' category and there's a huge (26%) category called 'mixed background.' I supposed this difference reflects the preoccupations of our respective countries.
Can somebody find a link that says Canadians are X percent white, Y percent black, Z percent asian and so on? |
Sure.
http://www.statcan.ca/english/Pgdb/demo50a.htm
Total Population: 30 million.
Total Whites: 26 million (88-89%)
Total Asians: 3 million (10%)
Total Blacks: 662,000
Total Latinos: 215,000
Total Arabic: 300,000 |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
billybrobby
Joined: 09 Dec 2004
|
| Posted: Tue Mar 22, 2005 12:46 am Post subject: |
|
|
Sweet. Thanks, Tiger. I'll put up America's numbers for comparison.
white 77.1%,
black 12.9%,
Asian 4.2%,
Other 5.8%
http://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/geos/us.html
So, hmmm, what can we say? Percentage-wise, Canada is slightly more white, a lot less black, and a lot more Asian. I guess this pretty much conforms with my impression of the situation. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Tiger Beer
Joined: 07 Feb 2003
|
| Posted: Tue Mar 22, 2005 12:57 am Post subject: |
|
|
| billybrobby wrote: |
Sweet. Thanks, Tiger. I'll put up America's numbers for comparison.
white 77.1%,
black 12.9%,
Asian 4.2%,
Other 5.8%
http://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/geos/us.html
So, hmmm, what can we say? Percentage-wise, Canada is slightly more white, a lot less black, and a lot more Asian. I guess this pretty much conforms with my impression of the situation. |
I went to that website.. but can't find the dates its sourced too.
Here is one from the 2000 Census:
http://www.censusscope.org/us/chart_race.html
UNITES STATES:
White 69% (281 million)
Latino 12.5% (35 million)
African 12% (33 million)
Asian 3.6% (10 million)
Other (whatever is left over) |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
peppermint
Joined: 13 May 2003
Location: traversing the minefields of caddishness.
|
| Posted: Tue Mar 22, 2005 1:00 am Post subject: |
|
|
I'm probably wrong here, but I get the impression that there's a more even distribution of races in the US than in Canada.
I suspect if you had a map of Canada based on distribution of races, you'd see the vast majority of Asians on the west coast, lots of blacks in Nova Scotia and maybe New Brunswick and Southern Ontaio with a real mix. Sad, but maybe that's where the real mosaic is. . . |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
dogbert
Joined: 29 Jan 2003
Location: Killbox 90210
|
| Posted: Tue Mar 22, 2005 1:03 am Post subject: |
|
|
| billybrobby wrote: |
Sweet. Thanks, Tiger. I'll put up America's numbers for comparison.
white 77.1%,
black 12.9%,
Asian 4.2%,
Other 5.8%
http://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/geos/us.html
So, hmmm, what can we say? Percentage-wise, Canada is slightly more white, a lot less black, and a lot more Asian. I guess this pretty much conforms with my impression of the situation. |
"White" (and lesser numbers of "Black") here includes those identifying themselves as Hispanic. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
|
|
FAQ
Search
Memberlist
Usergroups
Register
Profile
Log in to check your private messages
Log in
