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Gopher
Joined: 04 Jun 2005
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 Posted: Thu Dec 28, 2006 9:33 am Post subject: |
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| mindmetoo wrote: |
| In that light, what sacrifices are you making to rectify the situation? |
Your suggestion that I could and should "do something" about the Columbian Exchange is a hopeless one, lacking any practical toehold whatsoever. I sense some kind of implicit personal judgment as well. Yet it was never about conscious individual decisions but rather pell-mell cultural and biological contact.
You also seem to have placed a value judgment on the Columbian Exchange -- something I have not advanced here. We benefitted and things worked out in our favor, so why rock the boat or even bring it up?
But my point was merely that we have recently become aware that said exchange produced much violence and destruction in its wake. This awareness is something that should inform any effort we might make to contact extra-solar-system life or how we might better protect ourselves if extra-solar-system life found us...or, in any case, we should not let it proceed pell-mell again. We should manage it.
This notwithstanding, I will play ball. What sacrifices would you have me make?
Last edited by Gopher on Thu Dec 28, 2006 9:41 am; edited 2 times in total |
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mithridates
Joined: 03 Mar 2003
Location: President's office, Korean Space Agency
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| Posted: Thu Dec 28, 2006 9:37 am Post subject: |
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NASA (and some other places) is going to be holding a planetary defense conference in 2007:
http://www.aero.org/conferences/planetarydefense/
This being 2007 and us not knowing about the existence of aliens it's going to be about asteroids though, as it should be. At the moment this is the only thing we know of that could swoop in and cause some major damage before we know it. There are a lot of asteroids still large enough to cause damage but too small to be detected easily that we don't know about. |
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mindmetoo
Joined: 02 Feb 2004
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| Posted: Thu Dec 28, 2006 5:25 pm Post subject: |
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| Gopher wrote: |
This notwithstanding, I will play ball. What sacrifices would you have me make? |
The same sacrifice rapier says we should make: pack up 'n' move back to the old world. Or at least visiting an Indian casino. You know, do your part.
I agree we can learn from our past mistakes, however ultimately you and I were winners in this exchange.
Do you feel our ancestors did wrong and do you think we owe something to the people hard done by? |
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Gopher
Joined: 04 Jun 2005
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| Posted: Thu Dec 28, 2006 5:45 pm Post subject: |
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| mindmetoo wrote: |
| The same sacrifice rapier says we should make...Do you feel our ancestors did wrong and do you think we owe something to the people hard done by? |
Now I understand. I think you are projecting or transferring.
I do not judge anyone who participated in the Columbian Exchange. I consistently argue that, as so much of it came about unconsicously, any notion of someone being in the right or in the wrong cannot withstand scrutiny. It was more an accident than anything else -- biogeographical factors rather than human agency showed themselves as the most decisive factors of all.
I think that one of my most consistent positions on this board has been that we are where we are, all of us, including Israel, and we ought to deal with everyone where they are rather than continue to preach and bicker over who is more morally entitled to live here or there.
Rather, my point is that now we know. Now we know the dangerous forces that contact entails. We did not really appreciate this before, at best, the late nineteenth century, and not fully until the last several decades. And now that we know, this changes things. We ought to put much thought into things before we act. To cite science-fiction to help illustrate my position again, something like Star Trek's "Prime Directive."
Quite a few people -- since at least as early as Sagan -- have leaped into the search for intelligent life. I agree it is an exciting idea. But I only note that no one is putting much thought into the issue I raise here. And I do not believe we can start thinking about this complex and complicated issue too soon.
And since you brought up Rapier, I respectfully remind you that I argued more than twenty pages on this forum against him and the position that you seem to have attributed to me here. Look it up. I think its title is "The World According to Rapier." |
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mindmetoo
Joined: 02 Feb 2004
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| Posted: Thu Dec 28, 2006 8:13 pm Post subject: |
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| Gopher wrote: |
| mindmetoo wrote: |
| The same sacrifice rapier says we should make...Do you feel our ancestors did wrong and do you think we owe something to the people hard done by? |
Now I understand. I think you are projecting or transferring.
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I was just checking  |
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mithridates
Joined: 03 Mar 2003
Location: President's office, Korean Space Agency
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mithridates
Joined: 03 Mar 2003
Location: President's office, Korean Space Agency
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| Posted: Fri May 04, 2007 7:30 pm Post subject: |
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And, since it's performing many times better than expected it should be able to pick up Earth-sized planets too:
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2007/05/070503163458.htm
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COROT has provided its first image of a giant planet orbiting another star and the first bit of �seismic� information on a far away, Sun-like star- with unexpected accuracy.
The unanticipated level of accuracy of this raw data shows that COROT will be able to see rocky planets - perhaps even as small as Earth - and possibly provide an indication of their chemical composition.
COROT, a CNES project with ESA participation, is a mission with a dual goal. It is the first space mission dedicated entirely to the search of extra-solar planets. It provides a wide-field survey of planets like our own at an unprecedented level of accuracy. It is also making the most comprehensive study ever of the interior of stars other than our Sun. Both objectives are achieved by analysing the behaviour of light emitted by a target star.
An exoplanet is detected by COROT due to a sudden decrease in the intensity of light or the �light curve� of a parent star when a planet transits in front of it.
The study of stellar interiors � or �asteroseismology� � is carried out by analysing the oscillations in the light curve of the star. The oscillations are created due to mechanical waves propagating in the star itself and they give a clue to the structure of its interior.
COROT�s strength lies in the continued observation of the same targets in a given area of the sky. The observations have been on since the science operations began, 60 days ago. Another strong point is the accuracy with which it measures the variations in the luminosity of the star.
The first planet detected by COROT, now named �COROT-Exo-1b�, is a very hot gas giant, with a radius equal to 1.78 times that of Jupiter. It orbits a yellow dwarf star similar to our Sun with a period of about 1.5 days. �COROT-Exo-1b� is situated roughly 1500 light years from us, in the direction of the constellation Unicorn (Monoceros). Coordinated spectroscopic observations from the ground have also allowed the determination of the mass of the planet, equivalent to about 1.3 Jupiter masses.
The scientific evaluation of the results that are streaming in will take some time. �The data we are presenting today is still raw but exceptional,� says Malcolm Fridlund, COROT Project Scientist for ESA. �It shows that the on-board systems are working better than expected in some cases - up to ten times the expectation before launch. This will have an enormous impact on the results of the mission.�
All the sources of noise and disturbance have not yet been taken into account in the data. This first exoplanet was detected with an error of only five parts out of 100 000 during one hour of observation. When all the corrections are applied to the light curves, the error will be reduced to only one part out of 100 000.
As a consequence, small planets down to the size of our Earth � three times smaller than initially thought possible - will be in the grasp of COROT. The satellite may also be able, in specific circumstances, to detect subtle variations in the stellar light reflected by the planet itself. This would give an indication of its chemical composition.
The quality of the asteroseismological data is equally impressive. Excellent �starquake� data were obtained during the first 60 days of observations, with a margin of error of less than one part per million.
COROT observed a bright Sun-like star continuously for 50 days, showing large, unexpected luminosity variations on time scales of a few days. This may be related to the star�s magnetic activity. The accuracy of these measurements was truly outstanding: with an error of five parts out of 100 000 in one minute (corresponding to one part per million over four minutes), COROT has already reached the maximum performance for a telescope of its size.
The preliminary analysis of the oscillations in stellar luminosity clearly shows the seismic signature typical of a Sun-like star. This analysis will eventually help scientists understand the star�s internal structure and age.
�COROT, a joint endeavour between France, Europe and Brazil under the leadership of CNES, was certainly born under a lucky star,� concluded Fridlund. �After a perfect launch, and a faster-than-expected start of its science operations, we have been eagerly awaiting its data. Now, having seen its quality, we can expect great discoveries in the future.�
Background Information
COROT was launched by a Soyuz rocket from the Baikonur cosmodrome in Kazakhstan on 27 December 2006. Settled in its almost-circular polar orbit ranging between 895 and 906 kilometres above the Earth's surface, the spacecraft was powered on on 2 January 2007 and started its science observations on 3 February this year.
COROT is a CNES project with ESA participation. The other major partners in this mission are Austria, Belgium, Brazil, Germany and Spain. |
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