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Research on age and possible accent changes with adolescents

 
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Yu_Bum_suk



Joined: 25 Dec 2004

PostPosted: Wed Jun 27, 2007 11:38 pm    Post subject: Research on age and possible accent changes with adolescents Reply with quote

We all know that after about age 16 it's very difficult for someone to change their accent, especially in L2, but could someone point me to some published sources on this? Any studies dealing specifically with age and accent readjustment would be especially useful. I'm trying to do a little bit of research in this area, and my background in early modern English ecclesiastical literature pertaining to gender isn't exactly serving me well. Thanks.
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paquebot



Joined: 20 Jun 2007
Location: Northern Gyeonggi-do

PostPosted: Thu Jun 28, 2007 9:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you find anything on the subject would you mind sharing?

While the reasoning behind that theory sounds accurate, the one personal experience I have in the matter is a little different. I don't know if it's a matter of my being an exception or not. I'll see what I can find out as well.

....................

The experience in question is that I was told that I picked up a local (rural) French accent at the end of my first day in eastern France. I was 20 years old at the time, and everyone I met in the following two weeks assumed I was French instead of American. This is with four years of high school French lessons.
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bacasper



Joined: 26 Mar 2007

PostPosted: Thu Jun 28, 2007 11:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Foreign Accent, Comprehensibility, and Intelligibility in the Speech of Second Language Learners

http://www.blackwell-synergy.com/doi/abs/10.1111/0023-8333.49.s1.8

ACCENT, INTELLIGIBILITY, AND COMPREHENSIBILITY

http://www.journals.cambridge.org/action/displayAbstract?fromPage=online&aid=36363

Age and Accent in a Second Language

http://applij.oxfordjournals.org/cgi/content/abstract/11/1/73?maxtoshow=&HITS=10&hits=10&RESULTFORMAT=&fulltext=%28accent+AND+reduction+AND+puberty%29&searchid=1&FIRSTINDEX=0&resourcetype=HWCIT
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Yu_Bum_suk



Joined: 25 Dec 2004

PostPosted: Thu Jun 28, 2007 4:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

bacasper wrote:
Foreign Accent, Comprehensibility, and Intelligibility in the Speech of Second Language Learners

http://www.blackwell-synergy.com/doi/abs/10.1111/0023-8333.49.s1.8

ACCENT, INTELLIGIBILITY, AND COMPREHENSIBILITY

http://www.journals.cambridge.org/action/displayAbstract?fromPage=online&aid=36363

Age and Accent in a Second Language

http://applij.oxfordjournals.org/cgi/content/abstract/11/1/73?maxtoshow=&HITS=10&hits=10&RESULTFORMAT=&fulltext=%28accent+AND+reduction+AND+puberty%29&searchid=1&FIRSTINDEX=0&resourcetype=HWCIT


Wow - thanks.

paquebot, I also found this: http://72.14.235.104/search?q=cache:JlH1SoSrNooJ:psy.nccu.edu.tw/chn_ver/documents/cph_finalms.doc+%22three+misconceptions+about+second+language+learning&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=6
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spliff



Joined: 19 Jan 2004
Location: Khon Kaen, Thailand

PostPosted: Thu Jun 28, 2007 4:31 pm    Post subject: Re: Research on age and possible accent changes with adolesc Reply with quote

Yu_Bum_suk wrote:
We all know that after about age 16 it's very difficult for someone to change their accent, especially in L2,


Try 11.
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Yu_Bum_suk



Joined: 25 Dec 2004

PostPosted: Thu Jun 28, 2007 4:47 pm    Post subject: Re: Research on age and possible accent changes with adolesc Reply with quote

spliff wrote:
Yu_Bum_suk wrote:
We all know that after about age 16 it's very difficult for someone to change their accent, especially in L2,


Try 11.


Well that' precisely what I find quite interesting. One of my co-worker's sons spend two months in Canada when he was 14 (western years) and his intonation is so, so much clearer than my best students of the same age. I also know of siblings who moved to Canada and ~16 years old really seems to be the magic age. I knew two sisters who moved from England when one was in her late teens and the other her early teens. One sounded completely English and the other completely Canadian. Even their mannerisms seemed a bit different, with the younger seeming to have great integrative motivation to be Canadian and the other not. I also knew two brother who came from Germany, one 19 and the other 12 or 13. When I saw them years later at a wedding, one still had a strong German accent and the other didn't have any.

My motivation for researching this matter is to try to show why about age 15 would be the best time for highly motivated students to be exposed to immersion environments, with an aim for integrative motivation taking over instrumental motivation, and the belief that there's a strong correlation between accent acquisition and grammaticality judgement.
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aarontendo



Joined: 08 Feb 2006
Location: Daegu-ish

PostPosted: Thu Jun 28, 2007 5:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

We studied it a bit during some master's courses I took recently. The degree to which a student develops their accent is the strongest supporting reason for the critical period hypothesis. It really seems to show. Two of my co-teachers had spent time in America when they were quite young, 8 - 10 years of age if I recall. Their accents are flawless, and I would assume that they were Korean-American's had they not told me otherwise.

Having said that, there are probably a lot of factors at play, such as practice, motivation, exposure to native accents during the course of their studies here in Korea, etc.

However, according to the CPH 15 years of age might be a bit late to expect strong accent work to be done. Supposedly prior to puberty is the key time.
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bacasper



Joined: 26 Mar 2007

PostPosted: Thu Jun 28, 2007 6:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

aarontendo wrote:
However, according to the CPH 15 years of age might be a bit late to expect strong accent work to be done. Supposedly prior to puberty is the key time.

Yes, you are correct according to developmental psycholinguistics which tells us that those who move to a new country before puberty will have no accent in the new language.
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jvalmer



Joined: 06 Jun 2003

PostPosted: Thu Jun 28, 2007 6:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I went to school with alot of Chinese from Hong Kong. Many of them cam e to Canada around the ages 12-16. It's weird, some have flawless accents while other have heavy Chinese accents. Most (90%) could speak fluently after a few years, but for some reason some of them really retained their Chinese accents. Someone please explain why?
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Yu_Bum_suk



Joined: 25 Dec 2004

PostPosted: Thu Jun 28, 2007 7:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

bacasper wrote:
aarontendo wrote:
However, according to the CPH 15 years of age might be a bit late to expect strong accent work to be done. Supposedly prior to puberty is the key time.

Yes, you are correct according to developmental psycholinguistics which tells us that those who move to a new country before puberty will have no accent in the new language.


You see that's the underlying assumption I'd like to challenge. I know that puberty is connected in some ways with cognative development but I don't think it alone makes that much difference and that entrenchment of one's ability to make certain sounds may usually come at a later date. Furthermore, using a guidepost like puberty, which can happen anywhere from 10-14 or in extreme cases even earlier or later, has its pitfalls. What I rather suspect is that the CP extends a bit later than puberty for most individuals, until around 15.

What I wonder is if this would be in any way demonstrable in a study of three groups of Korean students age 18, 15, and 12, respectively, based on how quickly and easily students can learn to pronounce and recognise English sounds unfamiliar to the Korean language.
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Alyallen



Joined: 29 Mar 2004
Location: The 4th Greatest Place on Earth = Jeonju!!!

PostPosted: Thu Jun 28, 2007 9:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I guess I'll toss in my small bit of experience with.

My parents were born in Jamaica and moved to the U.S. in their early 20s. They both still have their accents.

My older brother was born in Jamaica and switches between a Jamaican and American accent effortlessly. Same thing with my younger brother who was born in the U.S but spend summers in Jamaica.

Me...I have an accent but according to most people, I sound Canadian! Shocked

When I was in college, I went to school with a bunch of Swedes. They all had British accents. 4 years later, I'd say it was a 50/50 split between those who had American accents by the time they graduated and those who still kept the British accent.

Accents are a confusing business, aren't they?
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Yu_Bum_suk



Joined: 25 Dec 2004

PostPosted: Thu Jun 28, 2007 9:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Alyallen wrote:
I guess I'll toss in my small bit of experience with.

My parents were born in Jamaica and moved to the U.S. in their early 20s. They both still have their accents.

My older brother was born in Jamaica and switches between a Jamaican and American accent effortlessly. Same thing with my younger brother who was born in the U.S but spend summers in Jamaica.

Me...I have an accent but according to most people, I sound Canadian! Shocked

When I was in college, I went to school with a bunch of Swedes. They all had British accents. 4 years later, I'd say it was a 50/50 split between those who had American accents by the time they graduated and those who still kept the British accent.

Accents are a confusing business, aren't they?


How old were you when you moved to the US?
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meangradin



Joined: 10 Mar 2006

PostPosted: Fri Jun 29, 2007 5:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I was taught in a neurolinguistics class that at around the age of 13, the acquistion and processing of language shifts from the left frontal hemisphere to the right frontal hemisphere. Perhaps this also correlates with accents. On a personal note, I was born in Scotland, to parents with rather thick Glaswiegen accents, and I was raised in both New Zealand and Canada. I think I have a Canadian accent, but i am constantly told I have an accent that is hard to place.
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Alyallen



Joined: 29 Mar 2004
Location: The 4th Greatest Place on Earth = Jeonju!!!

PostPosted: Fri Jun 29, 2007 6:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yu_Bum_suk wrote:
Alyallen wrote:
I guess I'll toss in my small bit of experience with.

My parents were born in Jamaica and moved to the U.S. in their early 20s. They both still have their accents.

My older brother was born in Jamaica and switches between a Jamaican and American accent effortlessly. Same thing with my younger brother who was born in the U.S but spend summers in Jamaica.

Me...I have an accent but according to most people, I sound Canadian! Shocked

When I was in college, I went to school with a bunch of Swedes. They all had British accents. 4 years later, I'd say it was a 50/50 split between those who had American accents by the time they graduated and those who still kept the British accent.

Accents are a confusing business, aren't they?


How old were you when you moved to the US?


Me? I was born and raised in the U.S. of A. And I've only been to Canadia once and that was trip to Montreal....so I really don't get it...
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Yu_Bum_suk



Joined: 25 Dec 2004

PostPosted: Fri Jun 29, 2007 8:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

meangradin wrote:
I was taught in a neurolinguistics class that at around the age of 13, the acquistion and processing of language shifts from the left frontal hemisphere to the right frontal hemisphere. Perhaps this also correlates with accents. On a personal note, I was born in Scotland, to parents with rather thick Glaswiegen accents, and I was raised in both New Zealand and Canada. I think I have a Canadian accent, but i am constantly told I have an accent that is hard to place.


Do you remember learning about what kinds of differences in language acquisition and processing occur because of this?
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