|
Korean Job Discussion Forums
"The Internet's Meeting Place for ESL/EFL Teachers from Around the World!"
|
| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
princess
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
Location: soul of Asia
|
 Posted: Wed Jul 18, 2007 2:41 am Post subject: |
 |
|
| Gamecock wrote: |
| Quote: |
| Many go there without actually having sex with the women |
Yeah, and in America many men go to strip clubs to listen to the music. They don't really look at the girls. C'mon. Get real. I don't believe ALL Korean men are paying for sexual services. But they don't just innocently hang out at those places on a regular basis. These are the lies the wife is told so she can feed her denial. We don't want to believe the statistics because in our culture it's a shameful act. Here it's not.
I was told by the nicest, most Christian Korean man I've ever known, with great embarrassement, that ALL young men go to a prostitute the night before their military service starts, and for many this is their first sexual experience. I don't believe that "all" means completely 100%...but a very high number of Korean men have done it at least once...and most are still doing it. |
True. Sad but true. Almost ALL Korean men visit the prostitutes before doing their militry service. One Korean guy told me that even girls he was friends woth encouraged him to go see one of those prostitutes before he did his military service, but he told me he didn't do it. But most do. My Korean friend who used to be my roommate is a Christian and so is her brother. But she told me she is pretty sure he did this.  Christian???? hahaha. Also, what a sad. sick, and disgusting way to lose your virginity.  |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
jessie-b
Joined: 17 Apr 2006
|
| Posted: Wed Jul 18, 2007 5:07 am Post subject: |
|
|
| yeah it just seems really sad to me. Like the young men are being cheated out of some really integral experiences...just cuz of stupid peer pressure and tradition. Sexism doesn't just hurt women. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
nateium
Joined: 21 Aug 2006
Location: Seoul
|
| Posted: Wed Jul 18, 2007 5:21 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Hollywoodaction wrote: |
| Tokki1 wrote: |
It's quite popular, but I wouldn't say everyone does it.
|
Not everyone, but based on some published estimates, 70% of Korean men have visited what could be described as sex workers. Seems high, but then again, not everyone who goes to a room salon as sex with one of the hostesses. I'm sure that if you considered a stripper as a sex worker, the numbers would probably be just as high back home.
As for safe sex, or the lack thereof, Korea has a very high rate of hepatitis B (10% of the population are chronically infected, as a matter of fact). But, it is preventable with a vaccine...or a condom, of course. |
Where did you find statistics like that? |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
blaseblasphemener
Joined: 01 Jun 2006
Location: There's a voice, keeps on calling me, down the road, that's where I'll always be
|
| Posted: Wed Jul 18, 2007 6:17 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Judging by the fact that you can't through a soju bottle without hitting a business that is part of the sex trade, I'd say that nearly every Korean guy is hitting that action at least some of the time. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Hollywoodaction
Joined: 02 Jul 2004
|
| Posted: Wed Jul 18, 2007 6:41 am Post subject: |
|
|
| nateium wrote: |
| Hollywoodaction wrote: |
| Tokki1 wrote: |
It's quite popular, but I wouldn't say everyone does it.
|
Not everyone, but based on some published estimates, 70% of Korean men have visited what could be described as sex workers. Seems high, but then again, not everyone who goes to a room salon as sex with one of the hostesses. I'm sure that if you considered a stripper as a sex worker, the numbers would probably be just as high back home.
As for safe sex, or the lack thereof, Korea has a very high rate of hepatitis B (10% of the population are chronically infected, as a matter of fact). But, it is preventable with a vaccine...or a condom, of course. |
Where did you find statistics like that? |
The papers. Can't remember if it was the Herald or the Times, 1999-2000. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Adventurer
Joined: 28 Jan 2006
|
| Posted: Wed Jul 18, 2007 8:48 am Post subject: |
|
|
| peppermint wrote: |
| Adventurer wrote: |
As someone who teaches adults, I will tell you that many of them do, in fact, have sex with the women from the room salons, but it does not mean if you go to a room salon that you will have sex with a woman there. |
What the hell are YOU teaching in freetalking? Seriously, don't expect the truth to out on a subject like that in a classroom. |
I don't teach classes. This one on one, and you are assuming that this was discussed inside the place of work. One person pointed out room salons for me when I went out and hinted that he could get me someone, and I said no. So don't be shocked. I would never discuss such a subject in a classroom with other adults. I have talked to many adults since I've lived in Korea.
In most cultures if a man is a virgin for too long he is not a man and since that pressure exists in most cultures the men are pressed to lose their virginity in that way because in the past sleeping with Korean women was hard. Western men are often expected to go to strip clubs in some parts of Canada and the U.S. Men are often pressured to constantly show their sexuality and display it in many cultures and when the women are not free in that particular culture things become very one-sided.
Korean women do not have sex on the same level as Western women and the pressure is still on the men to express their sexuality and so they go to these places. This is not simply about Korean men. It is also about Korean women. There is still the notion of the Korean woman cranking the token two babies and that's that and she becomes an ajumma. Korean women are not encouraged to view sexuality the same way Western women do. If women had more liberty to be sexual (not that I am trying to promote that), then the sex trade wouldn't be prominent.
Last edited by Adventurer on Wed Jul 18, 2007 9:11 am; edited 1 time in total |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Adventurer
Joined: 28 Jan 2006
|
| Posted: Wed Jul 18, 2007 8:59 am Post subject: |
|
|
| princess wrote: |
| Gamecock wrote: |
| Quote: |
| Many go there without actually having sex with the women |
Yeah, and in America many men go to strip clubs to listen to the music. They don't really look at the girls. C'mon. Get real. I don't believe ALL Korean men are paying for sexual services. But they don't just innocently hang out at those places on a regular basis. These are the lies the wife is told so she can feed her denial. We don't want to believe the statistics because in our culture it's a shameful act. Here it's not.
I was told by the nicest, most Christian Korean man I've ever known, with great embarrassement, that ALL young men go to a prostitute the night before their military service starts, and for many this is their first sexual experience. I don't believe that "all" means completely 100%...but a very high number of Korean men have done it at least once...and most are still doing it. |
True. Sad but true. Almost ALL Korean men visit the prostitutes before doing their militry service. One Korean guy told me that even girls he was friends woth encouraged him to go see one of those prostitutes before he did his military service, but he told me he didn't do it. But most do. My Korean friend who used to be my roommate is a Christian and so is her brother. But she told me she is pretty sure he did this. Christian???? hahaha. Also, what a sad. sick, and disgusting way to lose your virginity. |
Well, most Americans and Canadians are Christian but people are having pre-marital sex. The difference is teenagers can have sex with teenagers. It is so common. Korean females do not generally have sex even close to the level of Korean men. Not long ago, they were expected to be virgins and many still expect that. To a large extent, you can say many American males are not virgins and same for the females due to peer pressure. Also, there are more men than women in Korea by far unlike Canada where there are more women than men. Anyway, it is not like Buddhism or Christianity encourage that.
Every culture has different peer pressure. I just think North American males would probably find it easier to be faithful to their wives. In many societies where the women are expected to be very conservative, the man is still often expected to be able to find a way to lose his virginity to prove he is a man. That is what happens with the younger Korean men.
I personally don't want to jump the wagon and judge Korean married men whole-sale and say they are unfaithful. I think many of them are faithful. There are just more temptations. Korea does need to change to where there isn't the old traditional views of the wife cranking out the kids and becoming the ajumma and men will be men while bringing home the bacon. That is so 1940s.
Anyway, the women also have a role in changing things. It is not just the men. The attitudes about sex from both genders is a problem over here. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
SuperFly
Joined: 09 Jul 2003
Location: In the doghouse
|
| Posted: Wed Jul 18, 2007 2:29 pm Post subject: |
|
|
I work at a very large and well known Korean company. 90% of the men that I work with cheat on their wives with prostitutes. Here's the drill: We go out for dinner with the team. After dinner, we go to "round 2" beer and anju. After "round 2" the women go home and the men continue to "round 3" - whiskey and Ho bags. And NO, I haven't yet joined them, although I've really, really wanted to more than a few times when my wife was being a BIATCH, but I didn't...  -maybe coz my wife is also a HOTTY... 
These things happen. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
princess
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
Location: soul of Asia
|
| Posted: Wed Jul 18, 2007 3:02 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Adventurer wrote: |
| peppermint wrote: |
| Adventurer wrote: |
As someone who teaches adults, I will tell you that many of them do, in fact, have sex with the women from the room salons, but it does not mean if you go to a room salon that you will have sex with a woman there. |
What the hell are YOU teaching in freetalking? Seriously, don't expect the truth to out on a subject like that in a classroom. |
I don't teach classes. This one on one, and you are assuming that this was discussed inside the place of work. One person pointed out room salons for me when I went out and hinted that he could get me someone, and I said no. So don't be shocked. I would never discuss such a subject in a classroom with other adults. I have talked to many adults since I've lived in Korea.
In most cultures if a man is a virgin for too long he is not a man and since that pressure exists in most cultures the men are pressed to lose their virginity in that way because in the past sleeping with Korean women was hard. Western men are often expected to go to strip clubs in some parts of Canada and the U.S. Men are often pressured to constantly show their sexuality and display it in many cultures and when the women are not free in that particular culture things become very one-sided.
Korean women do not have sex on the same level as Western women and the pressure is still on the men to express their sexuality and so they go to these places. This is not simply about Korean men. It is also about Korean women. There is still the notion of the Korean woman cranking the token two babies and that's that and she becomes an ajumma. Korean women are not encouraged to view sexuality the same way Western women do. If women had more liberty to be sexual (not that I am trying to promote that), then the sex trade wouldn't be prominent. |
I'm sorry, but I don't buy into that whole "Korean women don't have sex on the same level as Western women" crap. Surely, you don't believe a Korean woman only has enough sex to make some babies, do you? There are many Korean girls who sleep around. Trust me. I've seen it. I used to be friends with this one k-girl who worked at Club DD in Hongdae and she was 22 and alredy slept with 5 guys. She made jokes to me about her Canadian boyfriend who was back in Canada for 6 months. She said before he comes back to Korea, I've got to clean up the guys....hahaha...Korean women are not THAT innocent. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Adventurer
Joined: 28 Jan 2006
|
| Posted: Wed Jul 18, 2007 4:00 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| princess wrote: |
quote] I'm sorry, but I don't buy into that whole "Korean women don't have sex on the same level as Western women" crap. Surely, you don't believe a Korean woman only has enough sex to make some babies, do you? There are many Korean girls who sleep around. Trust me. I've seen it. I used to be friends with this one k-girl who worked at Club DD in Hongdae and she was 22 and alredy slept with 5 guys. She made jokes to me about her Canadian boyfriend who was back in Canada for 6 months. She said before he comes back to Korea, I've got to clean up the guys....hahaha...Korean women are not THAT innocent. |
The women you see having sex does not mean they are having sex on the same level as the men at all. Look at smoking for example. So many women smoke in secret, and you know that and that is just the attitude towards smoking never mind sex. You know the Korean girls who are rebellious towards the traditional culture. I said changes have been made, but I also know Korean women who like wouldn't kiss their boyfriend until after some dates. By the way, I have also seen plenty of Korean women run home from a bar to make their curfew. This is not a liberal society. I didn't see the men rushing home. I think that should tell you something.
By the way, Spanish women in Europe are one of the most conservative women when compared to many other Europeans, so if I meet some Spanish girls who quickly share a bed with someone it wouldn't change that overall there is a strong conservative streak among the females.
In summary, Korean attitudes towards female sexuality plays a role in this and the old traditional views are still alive. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
4 months left
Joined: 07 Feb 2003
|
| Posted: Wed Jul 18, 2007 4:15 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| SuperFly wrote: |
I work at a very large and well known Korean company. 90% of the men that I work with cheat on their wives with prostitutes. Here's the drill: We go out for dinner with the team. After dinner, we go to "round 2" beer and anju. After "round 2" the women go home and the men continue to "round 3" - whiskey and Ho bags. And NO, I haven't yet joined them, although I've really, really wanted to more than a few times when my wife was being a BIATCH, but I didn't... -maybe coz my wife is also a HOTTY...
These things happen. |
Seconded here. I teach at a well known company and some of the nicest guys with kids you think to yourself, "no way this guy cheats." Next time we're out together it's off to the Norae Bong with paid hostesses and they're the worst ones, going down the woman's shirt, grabbing the hand of girl near me and putting it on my dick.
Talk to the wives, many, many have lovers on the side. There are "special cheating clubs" they go to. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
djsmnc
Joined: 20 Jan 2003
Location: Dave's ESL Cafe
|
| Posted: Wed Jul 18, 2007 4:33 pm Post subject: |
|
|
I had an ajosshi practically force me to grab a girl's ass and feel her up in a room salon once. He and this other guy were my students, so I was trying to play the whole 'I'm not gonna set myself up as a foreign teacher and end up in a heap of sh*t that could come back to me' deal.
He countered that with a more 'Dude, I paid $1300 to do this tonight, you better get on that' kinda attitude.
Even more interesting was the fact that he seemed practically married to this ajumma that was also in his class, always next to each other flirting and whatnot. However, she was married to this other older and more classy guy in another class. They were all rich and played golf and took frequent trips to the US, China, and Europe. I think there was something more deep and sinister going on. There was a "I'll give you my Mickey Mantle for your Joe DiMaggio card" vibe amongst some of the guys in the class in relation to the ajummas.
I thought they were pretty cool. They kinda had the whole 'Great Gatsby' thing going. Koreans are more interesting than people make them out to be sometimes. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
mikowee
Joined: 03 Aug 2006
|
| Posted: Wed Jul 18, 2007 5:48 pm Post subject: |
|
|
I wonder how most Korean women feel about this. My girlfriend seems to be of the opinion that visiting prostitutes does not constitute cheating. But that just might be a ploy to get me to admit that I've had them. Most other Korean girls I talk to will also freely admit that prostitution and cheating are rampant.
Has anyone else talked about prostitution with their k-gfs? Do they consider it cheating or just accept it as a given? Or perhaps they take that as an excuse to cheat themselves. I had a Korean friend tell me once that her mother was looked down upon in her circle of friends because she didn't have a boyfriend on the side.
However, my sister is married and does not have a boyfriend, although some of her other married friends do. She's openly stated that she would kick her husband out if she caught him cheating. However, the husband is usually out all night drinking with his coworkers so I have to question his fidelity. I wouldn't blame him for cheating, though. He provides adequately for the family and treats my sister very well, even though she's told him that she would marry someone with more money if given a second chance.
If there was a purpose to this post, I forgot it. I digress. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Adventurer
Joined: 28 Jan 2006
|
| Posted: Wed Jul 18, 2007 6:12 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| 4 months left wrote: |
| SuperFly wrote: |
I work at a very large and well known Korean company. 90% of the men that I work with cheat on their wives with prostitutes. Here's the drill: We go out for dinner with the team. After dinner, we go to "round 2" beer and anju. After "round 2" the women go home and the men continue to "round 3" - whiskey and Ho bags. And NO, I haven't yet joined them, although I've really, really wanted to more than a few times when my wife was being a BIATCH, but I didn't... -maybe coz my wife is also a HOTTY...
These things happen. |
Seconded here. I teach at a well known company and some of the nicest guys with kids you think to yourself, "no way this guy cheats." Next time we're out together it's off to the Norae Bong with paid hostesses and they're the worst ones, going down the woman's shirt, grabbing the hand of girl near me and putting it on my *beep*.
Talk to the wives, many, many have lovers on the side. There are "special cheating clubs" they go to. |
Well, Korea is a land chalk full of contradictions. I sometimes feel like I am in the twilight zone. You have the puritanical women who won't even hug on the first date or kiss on the third and the women who will be quite liberal and you wouldn't think in a conservative culture that the idea of sleeping with someone other than your wife is not cheating. However, this is a different culture. You can say that Buddhism and Christianity would be against this, but they do things their way here. In Japan and Korea, it is often viewed that if the man pays for sex then he is not cheating.
I can understand that logic to some extent since he is not living with the woman, exchanging emotions, and he is just engaging in something physical and not abandoning his home. And for many of the women, it is ask don't tell. As far as married women and boyfriends, I am sure there are so many Korean married women who are dating and having trysts. I have seen married women dating people. Infidelity doesn't seem to be so tolerated in North America. The cheating women weren't brought up because the OP was dating a Korean male. This is a very chauvinistic culture with the mentality of boys will be boys and go out and play while the women stay at home until the boys come home.
I must add a note infidelity here is just more out in the open and in some Western countries cheating is a major problem. I mean in Britain 31% of women and 42% of men have at least kissed someone while being in a committed relationship. The difference is you don't have British men saying "Hey, it is just part of our culture". It still means the majority of British men are faithful and I would say that applies to North American males. I don't know about Korean males. I hope most are close to a majority are faithful.
http://www.sciencedaily.com/upi/?feed=Quirks&article=UPI-1-20070207-13594900-bc-britain-infidelity.xml |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
twg
Joined: 02 Nov 2006
Location: Getting some fresh air...
|
| Posted: Wed Jul 18, 2007 6:18 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| princess wrote: |
| There are many Korean girls who sleep around. Trust me. I've seen it. I used to be friends with this one k-girl who worked at Club DD in Hongdae and she was 22 and alredy slept with 5 guys. She made jokes to me about her Canadian boyfriend who was back in Canada for 6 months. She said before he comes back to Korea, I've got to clean up the guys....hahaha...Korean women are not THAT innocent. |
Not that I think Korean women are innocents, but I think basing your entire opinion of them on the bar hos you hang with is not a good idea. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
|
|
FAQ
Search
Memberlist
Usergroups
Register
Profile
Log in to check your private messages
Log in
