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Vicissitude
Joined: 27 Feb 2007
Location: Chef School
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 Posted: Mon Aug 06, 2007 8:00 am Post subject: |
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| AbbeFaria wrote: |
| America not bad, Clinton bad. |
Clinton is a Mason. They've always had close ties with communists and America's rivals. So what can you expect? |
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thepeel
Joined: 08 Aug 2004
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| Posted: Mon Aug 06, 2007 8:05 am Post subject: |
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| So are many of the male members of my family. It is just an excuse to get drunk and make business. |
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Vicissitude
Joined: 27 Feb 2007
Location: Chef School
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| Posted: Mon Aug 06, 2007 8:10 am Post subject: |
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| BJWD wrote: |
| So are many of the male members of my family. It is just an excuse to get drunk and make business. |
I've heard that line of bull dung many a times.
The biggest threat to America are those from within. |
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thepeel
Joined: 08 Aug 2004
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| Posted: Mon Aug 06, 2007 8:14 am Post subject: |
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| No, really. Masons get drunk, talk sports and negotiate business. They aren't even really secretive. |
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Vicissitude
Joined: 27 Feb 2007
Location: Chef School
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| Posted: Mon Aug 06, 2007 8:34 am Post subject: |
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| BJWD wrote: |
| No, really. Masons get drunk, talk sports and negotiate business. They aren't even really secretive. |
wrong. Lies lies and more lies. |
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AbbeFaria
Joined: 17 May 2005
Location: Gangnam
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| Posted: Mon Aug 06, 2007 8:48 am Post subject: |
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| Vicissitude wrote: |
| BJWD wrote: |
| No, really. Masons get drunk, talk sports and negotiate business. They aren't even really secretive. |
wrong. Lies lies and more lies. |
Another conspiracy nut. Where's IGTG when you need him.
-S- |
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thepeel
Joined: 08 Aug 2004
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| Posted: Mon Aug 06, 2007 8:53 am Post subject: |
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| Vicissitude wrote: |
| BJWD wrote: |
| No, really. Masons get drunk, talk sports and negotiate business. They aren't even really secretive. |
wrong. Lies lies and more lies. |
Neat-o. |
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On the other hand
Joined: 19 Apr 2003
Location: I walk along the avenue
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| Posted: Mon Aug 06, 2007 9:02 am Post subject: |
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| AbbeFaria wrote: |
| Vicissitude wrote: |
| BJWD wrote: |
| No, really. Masons get drunk, talk sports and negotiate business. They aren't even really secretive. |
wrong. Lies lies and more lies. |
Another conspiracy nut. Where's IGTG when you need him.
-S- |
The conspiracy theories feed on the fact that there is a difference between continental Freemasonry(by which I basically mean Masons in Catholic countries), and Anglo-American freemasonry.
In Catholic countries, the lodges did tend to be invloved in political activity, usually of a liberal and anti-clerical character. Not so in the USA, where they evolved into the middle-brow drinking and philanthropy clubs that we all know and love. So, when an American joins the Masons, he is basically doing the most conservative, pro-establishment thing imaginable. But when an Italian or a Frenchman joins the Masons, it can be viewed as a bit more of a gesture against the status quo. (Or at least this was true when the Catholic Church was a serious force in European politics.)
So, the basic gist any Masonic conspiracy theory goes like this...
"Hey, you know, Mazzini and Allende were Masons, and their lodges were mixed up in conspiratorial politics. Wow, Clinton was a Mason too. Guess he's mixed up in all that kind of stuff as well." |
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On the other hand
Joined: 19 Apr 2003
Location: I walk along the avenue
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| Posted: Mon Aug 06, 2007 9:06 am Post subject: |
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The Grand Orient Of France is still heavily hepped up on the political aspects of Freemasonry. These guys are especially into the Separation Of Church And State.
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Even in France, the "la�c" idea is far from being universally accepted. It must still be defended and enlarged.
- The separation of the churches from th state still suffers from too many intolerable geographical restrictions (Alsace-Moselle, Guyane, TOM).
The ever more frequent juridical interventions, notably to Settle problem linked to religious practices (e.g. the wearing of the Islamic veil in school), is disturbing. lt's up to the Republic to define unitary measures and to hold by them. Society life must not rsolve itself to be directed by a series of jurisprudences concerning the practices and relationships between different communities. There is a very severe americanisation of community life which questions the foundations of our republican society.
- Scientific progress must be freed of all influence from pressure groups, notably religious. General interest and human respect must be th only context for this progress.
- The "la�cisation" of "life styles" (love and sexuality, death, illness) is not finished. The liberty to choose one's way of life, the social modes of life for couples and families, the fundamental garanties for liberty in this context, children's rights and dignity, are so many fields of application for a "la�cit�" as garantor for the freedom of body and spirit.
- in the composition of moral or ethical committees which are formed here and there, it is important to favour in the choice of members their abilities and not their convictions. For shouldn't th aim of these commitees be to see that the necessary conditions are sufficient for the exercise of liberty and the respect of human dignity, rather than to try to keep a false balance between rival communities ?
- Finally, culture and artistic creation, and also information and communication participate to the development of awareness which is no longer reserved for schools. It is necessary however to permanently ensure that no religious or dogmatic taboos and also no economical or idealogical pressure groups can impose the slightest limitation to liberty, even by economically stifling the vitality of minority groups. It is in the name of "la�cit�" that we must denounce ait forms of single-mindedness.
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On the other hand
Joined: 19 Apr 2003
Location: I walk along the avenue
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Vicissitude
Joined: 27 Feb 2007
Location: Chef School
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| Posted: Mon Aug 06, 2007 1:00 pm Post subject: |
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| Masons have always been heavily involved in politics, especially in America. And yes they do have their own agendas. |
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mehmeh
Joined: 23 May 2007
Location: South, South Korea
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| Posted: Mon Aug 06, 2007 4:08 pm Post subject: |
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Wow, from the hostage ordeal to free masons...well done everybody. I knew there would be a link somewhere  |
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mack the knife
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
Location: standing right behind you...
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| Posted: Mon Aug 06, 2007 5:07 pm Post subject: |
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| A nice editorial in the Chosun Ilbo today expressed displeasure with the misguided attempt of some Korean lawmakers to persuade the U.S. government to change its stance with regards to terrorist negotiations in the "special" case of the Korean hostages. The U.S. government told them where to go and how fast, and rightfully so. |
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Atavistic
Joined: 22 May 2006
Location: How totally stupid that Korean doesn't show in this area.
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| Posted: Mon Aug 06, 2007 8:50 pm Post subject: |
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| So are you saying Korea needs to go ask the Masons for help? |
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thepeel
Joined: 08 Aug 2004
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| Posted: Mon Aug 06, 2007 8:51 pm Post subject: |
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| mack the knife wrote: |
| A nice editorial in the Chosun Ilbo today expressed displeasure with the misguided attempt of some Korean lawmakers to persuade the U.S. government to change its stance with regards to terrorist negotiations in the "special" case of the Korean hostages. The U.S. government told them where to go and how fast, and rightfully so. |
In my opinion, the Chosun accounts for 94-95% of all editorial/journalistic sanity in the ROK. |
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