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cj1976
Joined: 26 Oct 2005
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 Posted: Thu Nov 29, 2007 6:48 pm Post subject: Cuffed a kid round the head today |
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I walked into a 6th grade class and saw two boys fighting. One was on the ground and the other was giving him a stomping, laying in the boot so to speak. I ran over and grabbed him by the collar and cuffed open-handed on the back of the head. I feel so bad right now. I apologized to the kid after class and explained my actions. I don't want to see any form of violence or bullying ever and I don't want anyone hurt in my class.
Did I do wrong here? The other teachers say it's fine, but I feel proper *beep* for losing my rag like that. |
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Yu_Bum_suk
Joined: 25 Dec 2004
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| Posted: Thu Nov 29, 2007 6:58 pm Post subject: |
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Look at it from the kid's perspective - he probably thinks nothing of it if he himself was being too physical. I do really hate it when teachers hit kids on the head, however, and would also feel like a right shit if I did it, too. Learn where pressure-points are and you can pretty much immobilise a kid like that with a little pinch.
That said, was it real fighting or just rough playfighting? If the latter, there's not much point in stopping Koreans from acting like Koreans. |
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hugo_danner
Joined: 21 Jun 2006
Location: korea
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| Posted: Thu Nov 29, 2007 7:00 pm Post subject: |
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| They don't know you love them if you don't slap them around a bit! |
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spliff
Joined: 19 Jan 2004
Location: Khon Kaen, Thailand
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| Posted: Thu Nov 29, 2007 7:05 pm Post subject: |
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Learn where pressure-points are and you can pretty much immobilise a kid like that with a little pinch.
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Just like Mr. Spock....  |
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cj1976
Joined: 26 Oct 2005
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| Posted: Thu Nov 29, 2007 7:13 pm Post subject: |
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| It turns out the kids were 'playing'. I had no idea - I just saw one boy taking a real kicking. I guess I panicked a little and lost my composure. Looking back, the Vulcan Death Grip might have worked just as well and not looked so dramatic. However, I do feel a bit guilty. That is not my normal style of dealing with things. |
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thegadfly
Joined: 01 Feb 2003
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| Posted: Thu Nov 29, 2007 7:31 pm Post subject: |
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Meh, to all appearances, the kids were fighting -- in that kind of situation, one does not have the time to mosey in and leisurely determine if the kids are friends or not. Even in the nanny states in the US, you would be covered for your actions.
Now as to your own guilt -- forget it. Do NOT let this incident cause you to hesitate the next time you see some kid whalin' on another kid -- the safety of students IS a concern of the teacher, and you did what a teacher ought to do -- you stopped the fight as quickly as possible, employing "lesser force." Just because it turns out that the kids were friends playing does not change things.
I have taught in places where breaking up serious fights was part of my "duties." When kids are really going at it, being wishy-washy about your intervention just allows the aggressor to get a few more licks in, usually undefended because the victim stops fighting when an authority figure steps in -- well, that has been my experience, anyway. Immediately immobilize 'em or yank 'em out of arm's reach...neither one of which is particularly gentle...THEN you can talk 'em down.
I would say you clearly did the right thing. If you feel bad about your reaction (which I do not think you should -- you reacted appropriately), make a plan for your actions the next time, and follow that. |
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Yu_Bum_suk
Joined: 25 Dec 2004
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| Posted: Thu Nov 29, 2007 7:48 pm Post subject: |
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| cj1976 wrote: |
| It turns out the kids were 'playing'. I had no idea - I just saw one boy taking a real kicking. I guess I panicked a little and lost my composure. Looking back, the Vulcan Death Grip might have worked just as well and not looked so dramatic. However, I do feel a bit guilty. That is not my normal style of dealing with things. |
It's useful if you can learn which students are friends and which have genuine issues with other students for when you come upon situations like that. With very little kids, especially if they don't know each other really well, it's often for real but by the time they get to be that age 99% of the time it's play-fighting or establishing the pecking order. The other week one of my high school students slapped her friend's face - not as hard as she could, but pretty hard - and I left it at just telling her to 'be nice'. She's the dominant one in the group and getting involved in whatever they were straightening out would be about as useful as getting involved in a Korean domestic dispute. The funny thing is that she's about 110lbs, her friend about 150lbs, and if they got in a real fight she'd get her ass kicked. |
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ED209
Joined: 17 Oct 2006
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| Posted: Thu Nov 29, 2007 7:57 pm Post subject: |
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It sounds like you regret it, so just move on. Sure back home you'd be sued. Here the parents encourage hitting. Just try not to make a habit of it 
As for apologizing to the kid, did you get one back? I hope so. |
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thegadfly
Joined: 01 Feb 2003
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| Posted: Thu Nov 29, 2007 8:19 pm Post subject: |
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| Naw, the parents could try to sue, but most US states have "equal force" or "lesser force" laws, and he clearly employed "lesser force." Parents might try to sue, but he was still on the good side of things, even in the litigious US...don't forget "Zero Tolerance." The kids would be out for 180 days in a lot of school districts. |
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ceesgetdegrees
Joined: 12 Jul 2007
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| Posted: Thu Nov 29, 2007 8:20 pm Post subject: |
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Don't hit the kids in any way, shape or form. If they persist in being little pricks then have them assume stress positions, i.e, kneeling on the floor with arms raised. Make sure to hav an established set of rules governing behaviour in your classroom and that all the kids are aware of and understand them, then when they act up you are justified in dealing out punishments.
Don't hit the kids. |
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twg
Joined: 02 Nov 2006
Location: Getting some fresh air...
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| Posted: Thu Nov 29, 2007 8:32 pm Post subject: |
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| Shaking the crap out of them is better. |
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Yu_Bum_suk
Joined: 25 Dec 2004
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| Posted: Thu Nov 29, 2007 8:39 pm Post subject: |
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| ceesgetdegrees wrote: |
Don't hit the kids in any way, shape or form. If they persist in being little pricks then have them assume stress positions, i.e, kneeling on the floor with arms raised. Make sure to hav an established set of rules governing behaviour in your classroom and that all the kids are aware of and understand them, then when they act up you are justified in dealing out punishments.
Don't hit the kids. |
Sometimes a light tap is an effective way of reminding them who's the teacher and who's the student. This morning in one of my better classes five students were about a minute late. Our grade one academic HS students all have English class at the same time and I'm the only English teacher who consistantly starts the lesson when the bell rings. I gave them each a swat on the upper arm with my pen as they were filing in. It hardly hurts at all but makes the point that they haven't met my expectations, of which they're well aware. And since a couple of them are my 'favourite' students whom I'm always talking to, it also shows all the other students that, while I may admittedly have favourite students, I don't play favourites. I think there's a big difference between something like that and slapping a kid upside the head. |
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ceesgetdegrees
Joined: 12 Jul 2007
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| Posted: Thu Nov 29, 2007 9:03 pm Post subject: |
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| whatever works for you , as for me i'm 6 foot and weigh about 102 kg's. I don't lay a finger on the kids ever. |
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Ilsanman
Joined: 15 Aug 2003
Location: Bucheon, Korea
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| Posted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 2:03 am Post subject: |
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This was an issue for me today.
After class, a kid stayed in the classroom. He told me he was expecting a fight and he didn't want to get dragged into it. So he stayed with me for a few minutes. Then as I was gettign ready to leave, he looked a bit panicked.
I ended up walking him to his next classroom (making it appear that I was following him) and I said I'd stay around the classroom until his teacher came. Also I said if I saw a fight, I'd break it up.
I think it is a teacher's responsibility. It's proactive, instead of reactive. |
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moosehead
Joined: 05 May 2007
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| Posted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 6:43 am Post subject: |
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| Ilsanman wrote: |
This was an issue for me today.
After class, a kid stayed in the classroom. He told me he was expecting a fight and he didn't want to get dragged into it. So he stayed with me for a few minutes. Then as I was gettign ready to leave, he looked a bit panicked.
I ended up walking him to his next classroom (making it appear that I was following him) and I said I'd stay around the classroom until his teacher came. Also I said if I saw a fight, I'd break it up.
I think it is a teacher's responsibility. It's proactive, instead of reactive. |
you did the right thing - i totally agree - i've broken up fights between students that weren't even my responsibility- but never struck a kid - i'd never do that - and if one is definitely hurting another - i march them both to the nearest k-teacher or principal (if i don't think the k teacher will listen) - and let them both explain what was going on - i stay out of it.
if you're not fluent it's hard to understand whatever the problem is, but regardless all children need to understand there's better way of solving their differences than pummeling each other into the ground - or getting pummeled mercilessly.
believe me, when a foreign teacher takes notice of K students fighting, K techers and admin DO listen and pay attention - they don't want to look like they aren't doing their job.
as for the OP - i'd think careful about how fast you were to use force, that's just not cool, they're kids after all. maybe you need a little break or something? pulling them apart is one thing and certainly acceptable but laying your hands on them is not, ever, for ANY reason. |
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