Korean Job Discussion Forums

[pkang0202]

It think 2.5 million should be the new minimum. There are so many positions available. I think we could forcibly make 2.5 the new minimum. Here's how:

Mr Kim's Hagwon: 2.0 million per month.
Native Teacher A: 2.5 is my minimum
Mr Kim's Hagwon: No.
Native Teacher A: I'll go look elsewhere. Thanks.

Mr Kim's Hagwon: 2.1 million per month.
Native Teacher B: 2.5 is my minimum
Mr Kim's Hagwon: No.
Native Teacher B: I'll go look elsewhere. Thanks.

Mr Kim's Hagwon (desperate): 2.2 million per month.
Native Teacher C: 2.5 is my minimum
Mr Kim's Hagwon: No.
Native Teacher C: Thanks, I'll look elsewhere.

Mr Kim's Hagwon (losing many students because of no teacher): 2.3 million per month.
Native Teacher D: 2.5 is my minimum
Mr Kim's Hagwon: FINE!
Native Teacher D: Thanks.

[yingwenlaoshi]

You're right. And people that take jobs for less should be shunned by others. "You're teaching for what? Do you realize you're bringing down our prices, arsehole!"

[stillnotking]

Yeah, this is the basic idea behind all labor negotiations. The problem is that the vast majority of people who go teach in Korea are not going to read this website, and there's no union or other organization to let them all know their rights.

I'm actually surprised that Korean schools pay as much as they do. Pay in Korea is far higher, even in a relative-to-per-capita income sense, than in most countries (other than the Gulf States, and who wants to teach there?). I'm not really sure why this is.

[yingwenlaoshi]

Thing is, I don't know how some of these small hagwons do it. Or would do it.

[Homer]

You could do that pkang as others could.

But it will depend on more than a few teachers demanding more. In fact, it is glaringly obvious that most teachers will not read this thread and will in fact no demand more outright because the information is not spread out enough.

Also to consider, it is much, much too soon to see a lasting impact on the industry here when it comes to wages. If such a general wage increase happens it will do so out of sustained pressure to find scarce teachers due to overly restrictive regulations (so you seem to feel anyway). These new regulations are so new the paint has not even dried on them. Give it time and you may very well see a basic wage increase or you may see a relaxation of the rules by the government from hakwon industry pressure...that would pretty much sink the 2.5 demand outright.

In short, wait and see before sounding what sounds to me like a premature charge...

Just my two cents.

As a backdrop on this: in 1997 when the IMF crisis hit, salaries did not immediatly go up even if there was a cry out for replacement teachers to replace those that left. Salaries did rise but it took over a year (or a little more) to see it as a market wide thing. The salaries did not raise because teachers demanded more either, they went up because hakwons needed to attract teachers and competition was fierce. These conditions may very well replicate with the new regs but you have to wait and see before starting to make demands.

[Juregen]

When wages of teachers increase, 2 things can happen.

1. More students per class.
2. higher price per student.

We already now that 2.0 + benefits for someone fresh out of college is a decent wage, with zero experience.

If wages do keep rising, government will take measures to stabilize the market.

All the more power to you if you can make more money, but in the long run it might become counterproductive. Hagwon owners will want to screw everyone over more, due to HR costs.

I do believe that work needs to be properly rewarded, but when the market becomes narrow, wage increase might be "inaccurate".

It might have long term negative impact.

[Juregen]

[Netz]

[Don Gately]

Seems to me that if they add these requirements vis a vis medical and criminal checks that will thin the herd of prospective teachers as:

1. Some will not pass meds
2. Some will not pass criminal (this probably includes me
3. Some cannot be bothered to go through all the hullaballoo when they can just go to Taiwan/China/Home.

That means less supply which, if my eighth grade economics holds, means greater demand.

Greater demand means prices rise.

Stick 'em for 2.5-2.7 at least.

[Netz]

[expat2001]

[mistermasan]

back in taiwan english teachers got too uppity. the next thing you know there are scads of folks from a certain english speaking country from southern africa all over the place willing to work for less than half of what a north american would consider.

labor is an expense. we are all replaceable. simply make yourself more valuable in the eyes of an employer.

you can't herd cats, muchless unionize them.

[tob55]

Value, regardless of whether it is real or perceived is determined by supply and demand, even for services being offered such as teaching English in Korea. The entire EFL-ESL industry in this country has been based on hagwon owners, public and private schools making a hefty amount of money from the insane interest Koreans have in learning English. Foreign teachers have gone through all of the constant change and scrutiny that comes with simply wanting to come here and attempt to help the general population interested in learning English be better readers, writers, listeners and speakers.

I agree there should be an increase in the wage system for foreigners, but never assume that the whole of the workforce teaching English in this country should be entitled to a raise. As it was mentioned about Taiwan, there is nothing to stop immigration or the MOE from changing the rules again, which we are all aware they are capable of doing. Making demands might push them to start including native English speakers from countries other than the big 6 or 7 they are willing to accept at this point. Then you will actually begin to wages going down rather than up.

There should be incentives for teachers to earn more money that is based on output and performance. A system that makes the hagwons, private and public schools more accountable for working within the guidelines of the educational plan for English in the country. In reality the only way to begin seeing more income as teachers requires the main players in the system to stop taking the major share of the money from the industry, to stop treating their employees like slaves and view them as professionals, and to change their thinking with regard to the real value of English rather than the perceived image they have of English learning and English teaching professionals right now.

[pkang0202]

[Mosley]

I'm with the OP with perhaps one exception: outright, fresh newbies might be setting themselves up for a long job search by demanding 2.5 right off the bat.

Got proven experience? Then nothing outrageous by asking for 2.5-3.0.