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fiveeagles
Joined: 19 May 2005
Location: Vancouver
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 Posted: Wed Jul 09, 2008 5:54 pm Post subject: |
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| hogwonguy1979 wrote: |
your garbage is really getting annoying fiveeagles.
face it nobody here cares about your evangelical bs and nobody wants to hear it. |
haha.
ABC News
http://abcnews.go.com/Nightline/FaithMatters/story?id=5338963&page=1
CNN News is also going to broadcast the ongoing signs and miracles
Yep, it's still going and gaining momentum. How about that?
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Thanks to the Internet and satellite television, word of the revival spread quickly around the world to people like Jim Carter, who came to Lakeland from Anaheim, Calif., with his wife and daughter.
"We've been watching on the Internet since it started, basically," he said. "We just wanted to come down and first-hand experience."
Carter added, "We just want more of God, more of his presence and to see God change our country and bring America back to God." |
However, it does say this;
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| When asked to present evidence of the healings, Bentley promised to give "Nightline" the names and medical records of three followers who would talk openly about his miracles. He never delivered. Instead, his staff gave "Nightline" a binder filled with what he says are inspiring miracles, but with scant hard evidence. It offered incomplete contact information, a few pages of incomplete medical records, and the doctors' names were crossed out. |
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ED209
Joined: 17 Oct 2006
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| Posted: Wed Jul 09, 2008 8:26 pm Post subject: |
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A true Christian would never look to signs and miracles. The teachings of Jesus go beyond parlour tricks. You fiveeagles are a charlatan.
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| When asked to present evidence of the healings, Bentley promised to give "Nightline" the names and medical records of three followers who would talk openly about his miracles. He never delivered. Instead, his staff gave "Nightline" a binder filled with what he says are inspiring miracles, but with scant hard evidence. It offered incomplete contact information, a few pages of incomplete medical records, and the doctors' names were crossed out. |
Well what does that tell you? |
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RACETRAITOR
Joined: 24 Oct 2005
Location: Seoul, South Korea
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| Posted: Thu Jul 17, 2008 8:15 pm Post subject: |
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Wow, belief in faith healing? Korea really does get bottom-of-the-barrel foreigners.
| ED209 wrote: |
A true Christian would never look to signs and miracles. The teachings of Jesus go beyond parlour tricks.
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-walking on water
-turning water to wine
-resurrection
| ED209 wrote: |
You fiveeagles are a charlatan.
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Faith healers are as legitimate as Nigerian princes who need your bank account number. End of story. |
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fiveeagles
Joined: 19 May 2005
Location: Vancouver
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| Posted: Thu Jul 17, 2008 11:47 pm Post subject: |
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| ED209 wrote: |
A true Christian would never look to signs and miracles. The teachings of Jesus go beyond parlour tricks. You fiveeagles are a charlatan.
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| When asked to present evidence of the healings, Bentley promised to give "Nightline" the names and medical records of three followers who would talk openly about his miracles. He never delivered. Instead, his staff gave "Nightline" a binder filled with what he says are inspiring miracles, but with scant hard evidence. It offered incomplete contact information, a few pages of incomplete medical records, and the doctors' names were crossed out. |
Well what does that tell you? |
Do you believe everything your media tells ya?
Anyway, I wanted to put it in to be objective. |
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uberscheisse
Joined: 02 Dec 2003
Location: japan is better than korea.
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| Posted: Fri Jul 18, 2008 12:21 am Post subject: |
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| fiveeagles wrote: |
Well what does that tell you? |
Do you believe everything your media tells ya?
[/quote]
critical of the media, yet not critical of some guy who's faking it like a hooker fakes an orgasm. hmm... |
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mindmetoo
Joined: 02 Feb 2004
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mindmetoo
Joined: 02 Feb 2004
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| Posted: Fri Jul 18, 2008 6:30 am Post subject: |
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| fiveeagles wrote: |
Right. I have 7 years of engineering experience and a bachelors of science. My dad owns a multimillion dollar engineering company and is responsible for developing environmental technologies.
And you? |
And he still knows enough that claims of witches and people being raised from the dead is a testable claim by science. And you don't. Why? It seems to me we learn the scientific method in grade 10 science class. You don't have to have an iron ring on your finger to grasp the scientific method.
If one of your dad's engineers said you don't need support beams, he has a cheaper way of using the mighty power of Jesus to keep up a bridge, what would your dad's approach be to this suggestion? |
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mindmetoo
Joined: 02 Feb 2004
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| Posted: Sat Jul 19, 2008 4:57 pm Post subject: |
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From Randi's page:
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For the Associated Press, when asked, his �ministry� came up with a list of fifteen persons it said were cured, and who they said they�d checked out. Bentley�s people said that all but three of their stories had been "medically verified." That sounded good � though it was a rather slim number, given the thousands upon thousands of cures for which they say they can show proof. However, two of the phone numbers they�d given out were wrong, six of those persons who were contacted did not respond to telephone messages, and only two of the remaining seven � when finally reached � said that they had medical records that would prove their miracles. Then one of them refused to make her physician available to confirm the validation, and the other's doctor did not return calls despite having received the patient's authorization to discuss the cure.
It�s strange, isn�t it, how such plentiful and conclusive evidence seems to become elusive when pursued? Could it be that Satan is more powerful than the deity-of-the-moment? |
Pathetic anyone would follow this scam artist. |
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ED209
Joined: 17 Oct 2006
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| Posted: Sat Jul 19, 2008 7:01 pm Post subject: |
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| RACETRAITOR wrote: |
Wow, belief in faith healing? Korea really does get bottom-of-the-barrel foreigners.
| ED209 wrote: |
A true Christian would never look to signs and miracles. The teachings of Jesus go beyond parlour tricks.
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-walking on water
-turning water to wine
-resurrection |
But those happened, I read them in a book. Christians require faith not evidence, religion ain't that stupid. |
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fiveeagles
Joined: 19 May 2005
Location: Vancouver
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| Posted: Sat Jul 19, 2008 10:15 pm Post subject: |
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| mindmetoo wrote: |
From Randi's page:
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For the Associated Press, when asked, his �ministry� came up with a list of fifteen persons it said were cured, and who they said they�d checked out. Bentley�s people said that all but three of their stories had been "medically verified." That sounded good � though it was a rather slim number, given the thousands upon thousands of cures for which they say they can show proof. However, two of the phone numbers they�d given out were wrong, six of those persons who were contacted did not respond to telephone messages, and only two of the remaining seven � when finally reached � said that they had medical records that would prove their miracles. Then one of them refused to make her physician available to confirm the validation, and the other's doctor did not return calls despite having received the patient's authorization to discuss the cure.
It�s strange, isn�t it, how such plentiful and conclusive evidence seems to become elusive when pursued? Could it be that Satan is more powerful than the deity-of-the-moment? |
Pathetic anyone would follow this scam artist. |
They are supposed to have a doctor on board to be verifying all of the healings. I will be talking to a few people on Sunday about this and hopefully get to the bottom of it.
Here are some videos that show x-ray proof;
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9MNF1BPDwE4
more to come! |
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knee-highs
Joined: 15 Feb 2007
Location: yes
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| Posted: Sun Jul 20, 2008 4:51 am Post subject: |
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| fiveeagles wrote: |
| mindmetoo wrote: |
From Randi's page:
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For the Associated Press, when asked, his �ministry� came up with a list of fifteen persons it said were cured, and who they said they�d checked out. Bentley�s people said that all but three of their stories had been "medically verified." That sounded good � though it was a rather slim number, given the thousands upon thousands of cures for which they say they can show proof. However, two of the phone numbers they�d given out were wrong, six of those persons who were contacted did not respond to telephone messages, and only two of the remaining seven � when finally reached � said that they had medical records that would prove their miracles. Then one of them refused to make her physician available to confirm the validation, and the other's doctor did not return calls despite having received the patient's authorization to discuss the cure.
It�s strange, isn�t it, how such plentiful and conclusive evidence seems to become elusive when pursued? Could it be that Satan is more powerful than the deity-of-the-moment? |
Pathetic anyone would follow this scam artist. |
They are supposed to have a doctor on board to be verifying all of the healings. I will be talking to a few people on Sunday about this and hopefully get to the bottom of it.
Here are some videos that show x-ray proof;
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9MNF1BPDwE4
more to come! |
you give socks a bad name... |
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mindmetoo
Joined: 02 Feb 2004
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| Posted: Sun Jul 20, 2008 5:00 am Post subject: |
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| fiveeagles wrote: |
| mindmetoo wrote: |
From Randi's page:
| Quote: |
For the Associated Press, when asked, his �ministry� came up with a list of fifteen persons it said were cured, and who they said they�d checked out. Bentley�s people said that all but three of their stories had been "medically verified." That sounded good � though it was a rather slim number, given the thousands upon thousands of cures for which they say they can show proof. However, two of the phone numbers they�d given out were wrong, six of those persons who were contacted did not respond to telephone messages, and only two of the remaining seven � when finally reached � said that they had medical records that would prove their miracles. Then one of them refused to make her physician available to confirm the validation, and the other's doctor did not return calls despite having received the patient's authorization to discuss the cure.
It�s strange, isn�t it, how such plentiful and conclusive evidence seems to become elusive when pursued? Could it be that Satan is more powerful than the deity-of-the-moment? |
Pathetic anyone would follow this scam artist. |
They are supposed to have a doctor on board to be verifying all of the healings. I will be talking to a few people on Sunday about this and hopefully get to the bottom of it.
Here are some videos that show x-ray proof;
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9MNF1BPDwE4
more to come! |
Do you spend all your day on youtube? Let me suggest a guy who claims he has solid proof, offers it, and then it turns out impossible to verify and has a past as a child sex offender might not be worth wasting a Sunday or anymore youtube time. |
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blaseblasphemener
Joined: 01 Jun 2006
Location: There's a voice, keeps on calling me, down the road, that's where I'll always be
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| Posted: Sun Jul 20, 2008 5:23 am Post subject: |
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FiveEagles,
Are you aware that the Templeton Foundation, a richly-endowded Christian group, funded an actual scientific double-blind test of prayer?
The results, predictably, were that the patient groups who didn't know they were being prayed for, and the patients who were unknowingly prayed for, had the same results, meaning the prayers did not cause them to be healed. However, the patients who DID know they were prayed for, did markedly worse. The doctors involved in the study speculated they had performance anxiety.
BTW, how does God decide which prayers to answer, and which not to? And, why does god let people get sick, then later decide to heal them? And, if he is all-knowing, why didn't he just skip the second step and just let them not get sick in the first place?
Also, how do you reconcile the horribly mean and brutal god of the Old Testament with the loving Jesus? Did god create a son that knew how to do things better than he had himself figured out? Does that mean that god is imperfect, or does he just get to make things up as he goes along? |
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blaseblasphemener
Joined: 01 Jun 2006
Location: There's a voice, keeps on calling me, down the road, that's where I'll always be
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| Posted: Sun Jul 20, 2008 11:47 pm Post subject: |
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| bump to FiveEagles! |
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fiveeagles
Joined: 19 May 2005
Location: Vancouver
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| Posted: Mon Jul 21, 2008 9:46 pm Post subject: |
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Good discussion!
| blaseblasphemener wrote: |
FiveEagles,
Are you aware that the Templeton Foundation, a richly-endowded Christian group, funded an actual scientific double-blind test of prayer?
The results, predictably, were that the patient groups who didn't know they were being prayed for, and the patients who were unknowingly prayed for, had the same results, meaning the prayers did not cause them to be healed. However, the patients who DID know they were prayed for, did markedly worse. The doctors involved in the study speculated they had performance anxiety.
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Here are some articles where prayer worked;
http://www.wired.com/wired/archive/10.12/prayer.html
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| BTW, how does God decide which prayers to answer, and which not to? |
A person has to know the will of God. A very complicated subject, but also very simple.
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| And, why does god let people get sick, then later decide to heal them? And, if he is all-knowing, why didn't he just skip the second step and just let them not get sick in the first place? |
Life is all about the journey and during that journey we learn a lot of important questions along the way. I made some horrible mistakes along the way, but because of them I believe I am a better person since I have learned from them. It's like the story of Job. God could have spared Job all of the trauma that came upon his life, however, He allowed it to happen. Teaching Job, that for eternity we will be journeying with God.
| Quote: |
| Also, how do you reconcile the horribly mean and brutal god of the Old Testament with the loving Jesus? Did god create a son that knew how to do things better than he had himself figured out? Does that mean that god is imperfect, or does he just get to make things up as he goes along |
Do you know what holiness is? Holiness is like burning goodness. God is so good that He is on fire. He burns with love. In Him, is the perfection and completion of love.
Sin on the otherhand means to miss the mark, to fall short of one's destiny or to make all the wrong decisions. It is the absence of love and it's main focus is on selfish, carnal pleasures.
Now, God is a Holy God and without a blood offering, we cannot enter into relationship with Him. So without the blood sacrifice of Jesus, there was nothing in the way to separate God from a sinful generation. If God, came down from the Heavens, His holiness would break out against those who didn't know Him.
Because of His goodness, God took humans on a journey throughout the OT. And while it seems horrible at times, there are many stories of restoration that are the foundation of the OT. While God would judge and destroy evil and wicked nations, He would always give them third and forth chances to turn from their evil.
Bringing them to the world stage where Jesus would be born. Jesus is the fullness of what God represents. Jesus, when he died on the cross, took the wrath of God for all those who believe. So now we can know God through Jesus. For everyone who believes and lives for Christ will spend an eternity with Him.
On the opposite hand...God is still Holy and demands that sin be punished. For this reason there is a place of eternal suffering. Now hell was never meant to be for humans. It was only meant to be for the demons and devils. Unfortunately, people love their own darkness and so do not receive the free gift of salvation and therefore are cast into the lake of fire with the demons and devils for eternity.
It's hard to understand the kindness and severity of God. It takes years of meditations and conteplation before you can truly understand them both, but I assure you it's a very worthwhile journey.  |
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