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Questions about "bu"s in Seoul.
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jkelly80



Joined: 13 Jun 2007
Location: you boys like mexico?

PostPosted: Mon Aug 04, 2008 9:33 pm    Post subject: Questions about "bu"s in Seoul. Reply with quote

I've noticed from working in the public schools in Seoul that theres's around 11 or so "bu"s in the city--Seobu, Bukbu, etc. My initial impression was that this was some sort of educational administrative district, but I've also seen hospitals and police stations divided by "Bu". (I'm assuming the fire dept too). From what I can tell Seobu where I live is Seodamun-gu, Mapo-gu and Eunpyeong-gu, at least when it comes to schools, but I'm not sure about the other divisions.

I was wondering if anyone knew exactly what services/offices were covered by the "bu" system and what kind of overlap they had over the 'gus' in Seoul.
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Ut videam



Joined: 07 Dec 2007
Location: Pocheon-si, Gyeonggi-do

PostPosted: Mon Aug 04, 2008 10:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's not a system at all. -부 (-bu) just means "area" or "part." So Seobu is the western area, Bukbu is the northern area, Jungbu is the central area, etc. It applies equally to other countries: the northern United States would be 미국 북부 (miguk bukbu) in Korean.

The overlap you notice is because a lot of the 구 (gu), which are administrative divisions, also use geographic designations in their names�Jung-gu, etc.
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jkelly80



Joined: 13 Jun 2007
Location: you boys like mexico?

PostPosted: Mon Aug 04, 2008 10:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ut videam wrote:
It's not a system at all. -부 (-bu) just means "area" or "part." So Seobu is the western area, Bukbu is the northern area, Jungbu is the central area, etc. It applies equally to other countries: the northern United States would be 미국 북부 (miguk bukbu) in Korean.

The overlap you notice is because a lot of the 구 (gu), which are administrative divisions, also use geographic designations in their names�Jung-gu, etc.


How is it not a system? There's only one hospital in Seobu? One police office?
Why name them all Seobu Byeonwon or Seobu Gyeong Chal?
Whenever my school has a query they have to go to the Seobu office. When we had a teacher's meeting we had Seobu Districit Teacher's meeting. Just b/c a few of them correspond to directions doesn't mean it's geographic.
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Ut videam



Joined: 07 Dec 2007
Location: Pocheon-si, Gyeonggi-do

PostPosted: Mon Aug 04, 2008 10:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Like I said, the bu's are geographic. So... the northern gus are considered Bukbu, southern are Nambu, western are Seobu, central are Jungbu, etc... it's not a system, it's just a way of grouping by general geographic location. Other cities and even provinces have bu's... Suwon is the capital of Gyeonggi province, for instance, but there's a secondary administrative office in Uijeongbu that serves Gyeonggi-do buk-bu (northern Gyeonggi province).

Tell you what, smart guy... show me a bu that's NOT a geographic/directional designation. Show me the error of my ways.
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jkelly80



Joined: 13 Jun 2007
Location: you boys like mexico?

PostPosted: Mon Aug 04, 2008 10:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ut videam wrote:
Like I said, the bu's are geographic. So... the northern gus are considered Bukbu, southern are Nambu, western are Seobu, central are Jungbu, etc... it's not a system, it's just a way of grouping by general geographic location. Other cities and even provinces have bu's... Suwon is the capital of Gyeonggi province, for instance, but there's a secondary administrative office in Uijeongbu that serves Gyeonggi-do buk-bu (northern Gyeonggi province).

Tell you what, smart guy... show me a bu that's NOT a geographic/directional designation. Show me the error of my ways.


How about proving that Seobu Educational Office is NOT a political/administrative district? I did NOT claim that 'bu's don't always have geographical names' (go ahead and read my post again), but I DID claim that 'x, y, and z' are all publicly administered offices with "Seo bu" in their titles, ergo Seobu must constitute some sort of administrative district AS WELL AS being a general geographical one.
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jvalmer



Joined: 06 Jun 2003

PostPosted: Mon Aug 04, 2008 10:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

부 means part or division or assistant. It isn't always reserved for only geography. example, instead of saying 교감 for vice-principal, you could rarely say 부교장. But almost nobody says that, but people will know what you mean
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Ut videam



Joined: 07 Dec 2007
Location: Pocheon-si, Gyeonggi-do

PostPosted: Mon Aug 04, 2008 11:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Administrative_divisions_of_South_Korea

The administrative divisions of cities are gu and dong. Bu is not one of them.

Different agencies may group several gu together under one office. For simplicity's sake, this is often done geographically. So, the "Seobu Education Office" would serve the western gu's of the city. But there is no system�each agency does it differently.

http://www.police.go.kr/KNPA/about/ab_offices_01.jsp

Lot of police stations there. Just to take one example, Jongno-gu would be considered to be Seoul jungbu (central Seoul). Yet there's a Jongno Police Station AND a Jungbu Police Station. If the bu's were a system as you claim, there would seemingly be only one Jungbu Police Station in Seoul Jungbu. But this is not the case.

Also, most hospitals in Korea are not government-operated, so their designation as "Seobu," etc. merely indicates their�wait for it�geographic location. Nor is there only one hospital in Seobu, Jungbu, etc.

Care to keep going?
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Ut videam



Joined: 07 Dec 2007
Location: Pocheon-si, Gyeonggi-do

PostPosted: Mon Aug 04, 2008 11:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

jvalmer wrote:
부 means part or division or assistant. It isn't always reserved for only geography. example, instead of saying 교감 for vice-principal, you could rarely say 부교장. But almost nobody says that, but people will know what you mean

Depends on which bu you're talking about.

부 (副) is the one that indicates an assistant or subordinate.

부 (部) is the one that indicates part, division, etc.

Same spelling in Hangul, same pronunciation, but different hanja.
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jkelly80



Joined: 13 Jun 2007
Location: you boys like mexico?

PostPosted: Mon Aug 04, 2008 11:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ut videam wrote:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Administrative_divisions_of_South_Korea

The administrative divisions of cities are gu and dong. Bu is not one of them.

Different agencies may group several gu together under one office. For simplicity's sake, this is often done geographically. So, the "Seobu Education Office" would serve the western gu's of the city. But there is no system�each agency does it differently.

http://www.police.go.kr/KNPA/about/ab_offices_01.jsp

Lot of police stations there. Just to take one example, Jongno-gu would be considered to be Seoul jungbu (central Seoul). Yet there's a Jongno Police Station AND a Jungbu Police Station. If the bu's were a system as you claim, there would seemingly be only one Jungbu Police Station in Seoul Jungbu. But this is not the case.

Also, most hospitals in Korea are not government-operated, so their designation as "Seobu," etc. merely indicates their�wait for it�geographic location. Nor is there only one hospital in Seobu, Jungbu, etc.

Care to keep going?


And yet, there are still Nambu, Seobu, Dongbu, etc SMOE district offices.
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Ut videam



Joined: 07 Dec 2007
Location: Pocheon-si, Gyeonggi-do

PostPosted: Mon Aug 04, 2008 11:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

jkelly80 wrote:
And yet, there are still Nambu, Seobu, Dongbu, etc SMOE district offices.

Yes there are. How is that different from what I wrote?

Ut videam wrote:
Different agencies may group several gu together under one office. For simplicity's sake, this is often done geographically. So, the "Seobu Education Office" would serve the western gu's of the city. But there is no system�each agency does it differently.

SMOE is one agency. They've divided up their jurisdiction into Nambu, Bukbu, Dongbu, and Seobu districts (which, by the way, mean Southern, Northern, Eastern, and Western). Other agencies do it differently. I pointed out how the police organization does NOT follow this model�there are multiple police stations in Seobu, Jungbu, etc.

Hence.... it's not a system�at least not beyond the bounds of any particular agency.
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bangbayed



Joined: 01 Dec 2005
Location: Seoul

PostPosted: Mon Aug 04, 2008 11:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

jkelly80 wrote:
And yet, there are still Nambu, Seobu, Dongbu, etc SMOE district offices.


Dude, it's a suffix, that's all. Think of it like the "-ern" in Southern, Northern, etc.


Last edited by bangbayed on Mon Aug 04, 2008 11:46 pm; edited 1 time in total
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jkelly80



Joined: 13 Jun 2007
Location: you boys like mexico?

PostPosted: Mon Aug 04, 2008 11:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ut videam wrote:


Hence.... it's not a system�at least not beyond the bounds of any particular agency.


Well then it is a system, isn't it, if it's used by an agency?
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Ut videam



Joined: 07 Dec 2007
Location: Pocheon-si, Gyeonggi-do

PostPosted: Tue Aug 05, 2008 12:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, if each agency organizes their offices differently, I wouldn't say there's anything systematic about it.

The point stands: Seoul is subdivided into gus, which are further subdivided into dongs. Some agencies may choose to serve multiple gus in a given area (southern, northern, etc.) from a single office.

Your original question was "I was wondering if anyone knew exactly what services/offices were covered by the "bu" system and what kind of overlap they had over the 'gus' in Seoul."

Since there is no single system, there is no single answer to your question. Each office/agency organizes their offices in a different way. SMOE has their way. The Seoul Metropolitan Police Agency has another. Korean Immigration in Seoul has yet another.

It's not a system. It's just a general geographic designator. Each individual agency determines which particular gus/dongs are served by their particular offices.
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JERGENIUS



Joined: 09 Dec 2007

PostPosted: Tue Aug 05, 2008 5:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

it is a system look it up in the dictionary
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Ut videam



Joined: 07 Dec 2007
Location: Pocheon-si, Gyeonggi-do

PostPosted: Tue Aug 05, 2008 5:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

JERGENIUS wrote:
it is a system look it up in the dictionary

No, it really isn't.
Quote:
부(部)
1【부문】a department;a division
부원 a member of the staff;the staff《총칭》
부장 the head[chief] of a department
2【일부분】a part;a section;a division;a class;a category
제1부 section one
제2부의 첫째 장 the first chapter of Part Two
3부로 된 소설 a novel in three parts
3【부수】a copy 《of a book, a magazine》;a volume
신문을 2부 사다 buy two copies of newspapers
이 잡지 1부 a copy of this magazine
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