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How long is Korea's history?
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How long is Korea's history?
700,000 years old - Arrival of the first hominids
2%
 2%  [ 1 ]
10,000 years old - evidence of the first pottery
2%
 2%  [ 1 ]
5,000 years old - Bear in a cave eats sacred garlic, becomes a woman and has a baby, Dangun, with the god Hwangnung. Dangun "founds" Pyeongyang. Dangun becomes a mountain god at the ripe old age of 1908
27%
 27%  [ 11 ]
1400 years old - Unified Shilla first Kingdom to effectively control the entire Korean peninsula
37%
 37%  [ 15 ]
600 years old - Joseon dynasty controls entire peninsula until 1910
5%
 5%  [ 2 ]
60 years old - Republic of Korea (SK) founded in 1948
25%
 25%  [ 10 ]
Total Votes : 40

Author Message
semi-fly



Joined: 07 Apr 2008

PostPosted: Tue Aug 26, 2008 9:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Guri Guy wrote:
The following is a timeline of early Korean History. Information presented on this timeline comes from the USC Berkley history seminar, 1994.


I thought I was the only history nerd here, glad to see I'm not alone.
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Guri Guy



Joined: 07 Sep 2003
Location: Bamboo Island

PostPosted: Tue Aug 26, 2008 12:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeah, I am a history nerd too. Korean history is quite interesting to me. Smile

Well, any history is interesting to me. Right now I am reading a book on the history of Thailand and Cambodia.
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semi-fly



Joined: 07 Apr 2008

PostPosted: Tue Aug 26, 2008 1:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Guri Guy wrote:
Yeah, I am a history nerd too. Korean history is quite interesting to me. Smile

Well, any history is interesting to me. Right now I am reading a book on the history of Thailand and Cambodia.


What period of Thai history are you focusing on, early or modern Thailand (Siam)?
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LuckyNomad



Joined: 28 May 2007

PostPosted: Tue Aug 26, 2008 3:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

zpeanut wrote:
Korean history was apparently set according to Chinese history. The Chinese claim 5000.. so... thats pretty much it.

LuckyNomad wrote:
The correct answer will always be: older than China. Wink
My question: In 3,000 5,000 or 100,000 years of history, what exactly are the great accomplishments? I realize that according to the OECD, Koreans are very inefficient, but 5,000 years ought to be enough time to do more than create Hangeul, which contributes nothing to the rest of humanity. How can you be proud of 5,000 years of nothing?


Don't forget the Japanese interrupted big time half way through and big brother China was always looking over their shoulders.


If you mean the Imjin War, it was in the 1590's. Apparently Korea was already 4,600 years old at that time. That's not halfway through.
The Chinese didn't start taking over parts of Korea until around 2 or 100 BC if I'm not mistaken. And China spent a lot of its history divided and battling itself or being invaded anyway.
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blaseblasphemener



Joined: 01 Jun 2006
Location: There's a voice, keeps on calling me, down the road, that's where I'll always be

PostPosted: Tue Aug 26, 2008 5:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ya-ta Boy wrote:
You can't have history until you have writing. When are the first dated references to Korea? Anything before that is pre-history. Legends, folk tales and archeological finds tell you a lot, but they are not history.


What about oral history? It's not perfect, but neither is written.
From "Roots" by Alex Haley:

Quote:
As an African American, Haley�s early ancestors were enslaved, and slaves were not identified by name on early Census counts. Moreover, to find any information at all about slaves, you need to identify the owners. Most records that may exist were kept by the individual owners. Some owners kept better records than others. Some records survive � many do not. Furthermore, America�s slavery system sought to obliterate a slave�s �personhood,� particularly any memory link to an African homeland: native language, religion, and culture were either erased or went underground. Indeed, Haley was fortunate that his grandmother and her ancestors preserved a strong oral tradition with references to people and places.[
/b]
Quote:
He went to the village of Juffure, where Kunta Kinte grew up and which is still in existence, [b]and listened to a tribal historian tell the story of Kinte's capture
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nateium



Joined: 21 Aug 2006
Location: Seoul

PostPosted: Tue Aug 26, 2008 5:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

sjrm wrote:
History of exactly what?!


Exactly.

First we have to define a few terms exactly.

What is Korea?

What does it mean to be Korean?


For sure, nothing that could be recognized as current "Korean" existed 5,000 years ago. Different language, probably genetics, clothing, art, pottery, food, etc.

Anthing before Shilla seems arbitrary.
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kiwiduncan



Joined: 18 Jun 2007
Location: New Zealand

PostPosted: Tue Aug 26, 2008 6:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

nateium wrote:
sjrm wrote:
History of exactly what?!


Exactly.

First we have to define a few terms exactly.

What is Korea?

What does it mean to be Korean?


For sure, nothing that could be recognized as current "Korean" existed 5,000 years ago. Different language, probably genetics, clothing, art, pottery, food, etc.

Anthing before Shilla seems arbitrary.


Exactly my point, and my reason for posting up this poll. Judging from all the responses here a lot of the expats in Korea take quite an interest in the history of the Korean peninsula. I think most people recognize that the human history of the Korean peninsula is far longer and more complicated than the 5000 year myth. But at the same time they'd probably aree that the history of any "proto-Korean" state (by which I mean one unified state covering the entire Korean peninsula and inhabited by people who saw themselves as one distinct nation) is perhaps 1500 years maximum.

I just get really annoyed when Koreans tell me about their 5000 years of history as if it is real, rather than a myth, and seem to expect instant respect from me based on this.
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nateium



Joined: 21 Aug 2006
Location: Seoul

PostPosted: Tue Aug 26, 2008 7:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

kiwiduncan wrote:


I just get really annoyed when Koreans tell me about their 5000 years of history as if it is real, rather than a myth, and seem to expect instant respect from me based on this.


I'll just tell them America has a 40,000 year history, and see if they take the bait.

Are you from NZ? Doesn't work quite as well, but you can make a good arguement it's 1,200 years old. Older than Korea by some definitions. You can at least make them think a bit....
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bluelake



Joined: 01 Dec 2005

PostPosted: Tue Aug 26, 2008 9:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

As one who teaches Korean history, I'll briefly say what I tell my students (over the course of a semester). There have been people (not necessarily "Koreans" per se) on the Korean peninsula for thousands and thousands of years. Until the last two millennia, the borders were very fluid and nomadic tribes traveled in and out as they followed their food.

Around three thousand years ago, proto-states began and eventually there were walled cities, which then turned into city-states. There was an Old Choson (고조선), but the word "old" was not added until the Yi Choson dynasty to differentiate it. However, Old Choson had elements that are historically controversial.

The peninsula was still not "Korea", but elements were taking shape. Up to the point talked about above, few people inhabited the southern half. Then there were tribes, such as Yemaek and breakaways from Old Choson, and others who came south to make up the Samhan (Three Han). They eventually made up two of the Three Kingdoms: Baekje and Silla (and the confederation of tribes called Kaya, which eventually was absorbed by the other two).

The Three Kingdoms fought back and forth and occasionally two kingdoms would team up with each other to fight the third, only to have one side change and have a different two against one war. Eventually, the weaker Silla became the stronger (with Tang Chinese help) and the stronger sides weakened. When �Unified� Silla came into being (around 668 A.D.), the peninsula was pretty much divided as it is today, with Silla controlling up to a bit more than Pyongyang. Some Koguryo people joined Silla, but a great number of them formed the Palhae kingdom. It wasn�t until the Koryo dynasty (935 A.D.) that Korea was truly unified. A huge part of the Palhae population went south as they fled the Khitan invasion. From that time, we could comfortably call the people �Korean�.

As for Tangun, that myth wasn�t even popularized until the Yi Choson dynasty when the people were looking for common roots. Before that time, each kingdom tended to hold on to its own creation myth, with their people at the center.

Again, it is a greatly simplified historical overview, but covers most aspects.
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The Grumpy Senator



Joined: 13 Jan 2008
Location: Up and down the 6 line

PostPosted: Tue Aug 26, 2008 10:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks, Bluelake.

I am currently reading Lee Ki-baik's "A New History of Korea" and you pretty much summed up the first 100 or so pages. It is the first Korean history book I have looked and I am glad to have some conformation of the information in the book.

Can you reccomend any other good reads? I also picked up the Yi Sun-sin biography and will start on that after Mr. Lee's book.
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bluelake



Joined: 01 Dec 2005

PostPosted: Tue Aug 26, 2008 10:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Grumpy Senator wrote:
Thanks, Bluelake.

I am currently reading Lee Ki-baik's "A New History of Korea" and you pretty much summed up the first 100 or so pages. It is the first Korean history book I have looked and I am glad to have some conformation of the information in the book.

Can you reccomend any other good reads? I also picked up the Yi Sun-sin biography and will start on that after Mr. Lee's book.


I use Lee's book in my class. I like it because it covers the subjects in an academic way, while some others try more to tell a story. I usually tell my students if they would like something that is more narrative to get Korea's Place in the Sun; it has some inaccuracies, but it tends to be an enjoyable read.
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kiwiduncan



Joined: 18 Jun 2007
Location: New Zealand

PostPosted: Wed Aug 27, 2008 3:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for the information Bluelake. You also have the advantage that if any of your students disagree with you in class you can shoot an arrow through their hand Very Happy
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bluelake



Joined: 01 Dec 2005

PostPosted: Wed Aug 27, 2008 3:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

kiwiduncan wrote:
Thanks for the information Bluelake. You also have the advantage that if any of your students disagree with you in class you can shoot an arrow through their hand Very Happy



LOL Smile The only problem with that being, many of them also end up taking my archery course, so they are armed at some point and I'm not.
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