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Korean Job Discussion Forums "The Internet's Meeting Place for ESL/EFL Teachers from Around the World!"
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Dan

Joined: 16 Jan 2003 Location: Sunny Glendale, CA
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Posted: Mon Mar 10, 2003 7:18 pm Post subject: |
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dogbert wrote: |
Are you serious? There are tons of Westerners with Japanese wives. They just don't tend to live in Korea. |
Really? they don't live in korea?! why the heck not? dogbert, i've lived in Cali and New York, and it was these places i was basing my opinion on. don't be condescending to someone without a frame of reference
and in my entire life, i think i've met one western/japanese couple, and they were moonies selling flowers |
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dogbert

Joined: 29 Jan 2003 Location: Killbox 90210
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Posted: Mon Mar 10, 2003 7:40 pm Post subject: |
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Dan wrote: |
dogbert wrote: |
Are you serious? There are tons of Westerners with Japanese wives. They just don't tend to live in Korea. |
Really? they don't live in korea?! why the heck not? dogbert, i've lived in Cali and New York, and it was these places i was basing my opinion on. don't be condescending to someone without a frame of reference
and in my entire life, i think i've met one western/japanese couple, and they were moonies selling flowers |
I've lived decades in both Northern and Southern California and have seen many Japanese/Western couples. I'd say that's a good frame of reference.
And as far as your argument goes, the Koreans are just like the Japanese in not fully accepting someone who was not born ethnic Korean. |
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Dan

Joined: 16 Jan 2003 Location: Sunny Glendale, CA
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Posted: Mon Mar 10, 2003 8:00 pm Post subject: |
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i was not making a comparison between korea and japan, just a personal experience. and in california, the population of japanese are mostly 2nd or even 3rd generation people, who came years ago and settled there. how about 1st gen japanese with western spouses? |
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matko

Joined: 16 Jan 2003 Location: in a world of hurt!
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Posted: Mon Mar 10, 2003 8:10 pm Post subject: |
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Dan
There are thousands of first generation Japanese with western spouses.
In fact, I would guess that it is more common with the Japanese (percentage wise) than with the Koreans. Anybody have any numbers?
I'm kind of lazy
btw I think the blue sea is cool as well.
No one has answered my Russian question so I'll ask again.
Anybody know what the Russians call it?
Last edited by matko on Mon Mar 10, 2003 8:18 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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dogbert

Joined: 29 Jan 2003 Location: Killbox 90210
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Posted: Mon Mar 10, 2003 8:18 pm Post subject: |
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Dan wrote: |
i was not making a comparison between korea and japan, just a personal experience. and in california, the population of japanese are mostly 2nd or even 3rd generation people, who came years ago and settled there. how about 1st gen japanese with western spouses? |
If I recall correctly, you originally said "Japanese". As you know, "Japanese" indicates both ethnicity and nationality. If you want to define it as women having Japanese citizenship as opposed to nissei, sansei, and yonsei, that's an important distinction.
After World War II, and again during the Korean War, many Japanese women living in Japan married American ("Western") soldiers.
Even today, many English teachers and other non-Japanese resident in Japan (like English teachers here) marry Japanese citizens. This is why I brought up the point about them not living in Korea. Just like you have a better chance of finding Korean/Western couples in Korea, so you have a better chance of finding Japanese/Western couples in Japan.
Here is a link to some statistical information regarding marriage between Japanese citizens and non-Japanese.
http://www.glocom.org/special_topics/social_trends/20021112_trends_s16/ |
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TheUrbanMyth
Joined: 28 Jan 2003 Location: Retired
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Posted: Mon Mar 10, 2003 8:37 pm Post subject: |
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Corporal wrote: |
Is "Japs" really so offensive? Aren't we being a little too sensitive and PC? It's no worse than Canucks, Yanks, Aussies Kiwis etc. surely, none of which bother me at all. Granted a lot of people use it derogatively but it's really just a short form and less fingerwork than typing Japanese. |
It's not the actual word itself. It is what the word denotes. Canucks, Yanks and Kiwis by and large have no negative connotations (sp?) like the word "Japs" does. |
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Circus Monkey
Joined: 10 Jan 2003 Location: In my coconut tree
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Posted: Mon Mar 10, 2003 8:40 pm Post subject: |
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liam the scholar wrote: |
I've harboured a deep seated dislike of the 'monkey people' |
Having a deep-seated dislike of monkeys will not get you very far.
CM |
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Chonbuk

Joined: 28 Jan 2003 Location: Vancouver
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Posted: Mon Mar 10, 2003 9:09 pm Post subject: |
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I'm sensing that Liam has a few issues he needs to work on. Must be difficult to hold all that anger inside.
I have to agree with the KofK- it is far too emotional and to recent of an issue to deal with it reasonably and rationally, but I don't think that family members talk about those times together. Ask your students if their grandparents have ever told them war stories or Colonial stories. They learn the hatred from the history pages and from flippant comments from their parents but not real discussions about the past.
Yes, we should not forget but at some point we have to forgive in order to heal.
I find it rather funny however that whenever I travel anywhere the Koreans and the Japanese are always together, sharing restaurants, guesthouses etc. The Koreans need to feel that they are so different from their number 1 enemy but in reality they really aren't.
Today I had the same class, and one student said she went to Japan during the holidays, but would never go back- The food was terrible, and the two-faces of the people bothered her-
I started a talk about public and private faces- basically trying out Denz theory but a simplified version. Do you act the same way with your friends that you do with your parents?? or in school? or at your part time job... They all could easily understand this logic, and quickly realized that all people have both a public and private face-
I'm engaged to a Japanese man. I'm a western woman. There are actually alot of us throughout the world. One forum I belong to with western women and Jap men has over 300 members the majority of them living in Japan- There are a heck of a lot more western men and Jap-women around.
Yes, international relationships are not easy, but from the experiences of the wives in my forum, they do become recognized members by the society and the family it just takes more time, and complete language skills.
thanks for the last link- it was informative.
Also I think many Korean women would jump at the chance to get involved with a J-man.
Cheers.
Chonbuk |
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Pets wonderland
Joined: 09 Feb 2003
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Posted: Mon Mar 10, 2003 11:10 pm Post subject: |
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I've never been particularly anti- Japanese until this incident happened-
I was on the train, minding my own business, until a gentlemen noticed I'm not Japanese. (I'm Korean, and proud of it!)
He proceeded to stare for a while, and then decided to tell me something. He repeated it many times, despite my feeble attempts at telling him I can't speak Japanese, at all.
Finally, a lady sitting next to me said, 'He says this seat is for his friend, his friend needs the seat'. And stupid me, I believed him and left the seat.
It was a long trip and it seemed the gentlemen had a long way to go too. This 'friend' he mentioned was nowhere to be seen and I saw numerous other, more 'Japanese' looking people occupy my seat and the gentlemen was strangely silent. They came and went, and he nener told them 'that's my friend's seat'.
Of course, other people may say 'That's a one-off incident' but almost all foreigners I spoke to in Japan had the same thing happen to them, if not worse. It's extremely degrading yet subtle form of racism.
The worst thing that the Japanese can do is brainwash other Asians into thinking that their own country is inferior. I'm ashamed to admit that many Koreans who live in Japan have been completely brainwashed into thinking that Japan is the best and Korea has a long way to go. Same goes for other Asians, they want to be 'Japanese' and hide their real selves. This, I find the most disturbing of all.
By the way, there are loads of western and foreign men married to Japanese women in Japan. They don't sem to last long though, but they're around. A lot of them seem to end up in divorce, however. |
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Hotuk

Joined: 10 Jan 2003
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Posted: Tue Mar 11, 2003 12:21 am Post subject: |
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many Koreans who live in Japan have been completely brainwashed into thinking that Japan is the best and Korea has a long way to go. |
Millions of North American consumers of automobiles and electronic products have come to the same conclusion. I'm not so sure it's because they've been brainwashed by the Japanese.
You know, the Pony, the Scoupe and the Excel, after all. It's not based on nothing. And 15 years after the Pony, they're still not on par with the Japanese, quality or technology-wise... |
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The Lemon

Joined: 11 Jan 2003
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Posted: Tue May 06, 2003 12:51 am Post subject: |
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Don't imagine you'd be too thrilled to hear Koreans referred to as "gooks", eh? |
You know, given the racist connotations the word has in English (yes, I understand the Korean meaning), I do wish they'd done some consulting before launching this campaign I saw in Seoul on the weekend:
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whatthefunk

Joined: 21 Apr 2003 Location: Dont have a clue
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Posted: Tue May 06, 2003 1:38 am Post subject: |
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It seems like alot of you are batteling racism with racism. I don't know if thats such a good idea. |
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Dan

Joined: 16 Jan 2003 Location: Sunny Glendale, CA
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Posted: Tue May 06, 2003 3:23 am Post subject: |
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Lemon, i hope you didn't dig up this post just to put that picture on here --;
anyway, its pretty funny, you should submit it to Engrish.com |
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Yaya

Joined: 25 Feb 2003 Location: Seoul
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Posted: Tue May 06, 2003 12:51 pm Post subject: |
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Hotuk wrote: |
Quote: |
many Koreans who live in Japan have been completely brainwashed into thinking that Japan is the best and Korea has a long way to go. |
Millions of North American consumers of automobiles and electronic products have come to the same conclusion. I'm not so sure it's because they've been brainwashed by the Japanese.
You know, the Pony, the Scoupe and the Excel, after all. It's not based on nothing. And 15 years after the Pony, they're still not on par with the Japanese, quality or technology-wise... |
Neither have the Americans. Hell if I'll EVER buy a piece-of-junk American car again. |
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dogbert

Joined: 29 Jan 2003 Location: Killbox 90210
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Posted: Tue May 06, 2003 4:41 pm Post subject: |
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Yaya wrote: |
Hotuk wrote: |
Quote: |
many Koreans who live in Japan have been completely brainwashed into thinking that Japan is the best and Korea has a long way to go. |
Millions of North American consumers of automobiles and electronic products have come to the same conclusion. I'm not so sure it's because they've been brainwashed by the Japanese.
You know, the Pony, the Scoupe and the Excel, after all. It's not based on nothing. And 15 years after the Pony, they're still not on par with the Japanese, quality or technology-wise... |
Neither have the Americans. Hell if I'll EVER buy a piece-of-junk American car again. |
Lucky for you you live in a place where foreign cars don't carry prohibitive tariffs and your neighbors/co-workers/friends won't hate/envy/resent you for buying a foreign car. |
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